So hindu's are now telling us that wikipedia is a muslim propaganda website~! As I said before there is no limit to the stupidity of these hate islam scumbags~!

This yasseryousufi is a joker. he cites ten year old posts from some Muslim propaganda website and calls them authentic. Utter garbage. Even if the Buddhists mob (not monks) have rampaged, it is due to the destruction of Buddhist statues in Bamiyan, Afghanistan as one of the propaganda posts clearly acknowledges. It is always first the Muslims that engage in some atrocity. When people react, they cry foul.

The basic point is the stupid Islamic philosophy of "us" Muslims as separate from "them" infidels. Well, they have succeeded in creating a 5 billion strong "them" that is quite turned off at everything Islamic. Talk about shooting themselves in the foot! Islam is its own worst advertisement.

kia huwa beta?? bolti band hogaee?

test~!

ARKNS,

Do you enjoy being insulted? Or do you have a problem understanding English language? I doubt if you went beyond 5th grade. Your nonsensical posts certainly seem like they're by an uneducated crackpot. Read what I copy paste below carefully. Ask your mum to help you out if you have difficulty understanding it.

------------------------------------------------------

1997 Anti-Muslim Riots in Mandalay

On 16 March, 1997 beginning at about 3:30 p.m. a mob of 1,000-1,500 Buddhist monks and others shouted anti-Muslim slogans. They targeted the mosques first for attack, followed by Muslim shop-houses and transportation vehicles in the vicinity of mosques, damaging, destroying, looting, and trampling, burning religious books, committing acts of sacrilege. The area where the acts of damage, destruction, and lootings were committed was Kaingdan, Mandalay.[34] The unrest in Mandalay allegedly began after reports of an attempted rape of a girl by Muslim men. At least three people were killed and around 100 monks arrested.[35]

-----------------------------------------------------------

Anti-Muslim Riots in Sittwe & Taungoo (2001)

The violence in February 2001 flared up after an incident in which seven young monks refused to pay a Muslim stall holder for cakes they had just eaten. The Muslim seller, a woman, retaliated by beating one of the novices, according to a Muslim witness. He attested that several senior monks then came to protest and a brawl ensued. One of the monks was hit over the head by the Muslim seller’s husband and started to bleed. Riots then broke out. A full-scale riot erupted after dusk and carried on for several hours. Buddhists poured gasoline on Muslim homes and properties and set them alight. More than thirty homes and a Muslim guest house were burned down. Police and soldiers reportedly stood by and did nothing to stop the violence initially. There are no reliable estimates of the death toll or the number of injuries. More than twenty died according to some Muslim activists. The fighting took place in the predominantly Muslim part of town and so it was predominantly Muslim property that was damaged.[144]

In 2001, Myo Pyauk Hmar Soe Kyauk Hla Tai, The Fear of Losing One's Race, and many other anti-Muslim pamphlets were widely distributed by monks. Human Rights Watch reports that there was mounting tension between the Buddhist and Muslim communities in Taungoo for weeks before it erupted into violence in the middle of May 2001. Buddhist monks demanded that the Hantha Mosque in Taungoo be destroyed in "retaliation" for the destruction of the Buddhas of Bamiyan.[146] Mobs of Buddhists, led by monks, vandalized Muslim-owned businesses and property and attacked and killed Muslims in Muslim communities.

I think Yasseryousufi got his information on persecution of Muslims in Myanmar from Wikipedia which talks about Buddhists mobs attacking Muslims there. He got confused between mobs and monks. What can I say? The result was a story about attacking rabbits. The fellow is a good comedian.

There's plenty more on the web that pertains to the persecution of Buddhist monks in Myanmar....and has been said, anyone else that poses a threat to the military junta that has governed for 60 years.

Dictatorships are generally supported by military forces, and do not subscribe to religious principles - and we can see similar repressive actions by China in Tibet.

The only places we're likely to find theoracies with autocratic rule by religious fiat these days, is in Muslim nations.

http://www.asianews.it/news-en/The-Burmese-junta-continues-the-persecution-of-Buddhist-monks-16968.html

Christians are also persecuted in Myanmar, not just Muslims. All those who are interested, see the link:

http://magicstatistics.com/2007/03/02/army-renews-attacks-against-christians-in-myanmar/

Why are the Muslims making it sound as if they are the only ones targeted?

Yasseryousufi has ESP. I wonder why he does not use his powers to make millions in the stock market instead of ranting on this blog. Buddhist monks attacking mullahs. Nice joke. I have to remember that one. Thanks.

ARKNS,

You can jump up and down like your Monkey God all you want, that doesn't change the fact. The Buddhist monks have been involved in deadly organized attacks on muslims, calling for their ouster, razing their mosques, burning their homes. The infor I cite is from respectable sources like Human Rights Watch and UNHCR. Calling it all propaganda is the best you can do i guess. As I said, dont take on people with facts. You're good at your well rehearsed anti-islam rant. Keep doing that. No one is bothering to read it. Just try to avoid people who know a thing or two about the stuff you're writing. Coz then you'll get found out like you did and its never a nice feeling.

These mullahs see Hindus under every rock. I have no intention of revealing my religion. That does not matter on this blog. Argue like a human being if you have human values and if you have knowledge.

Don't tell me about Myanmar. None of the Islamic propaganda can whitewash what is happening there. It is the height of stupidity to claim that the military junta is persecuting Muslims for their religion. They persecute anyone including Hindus and Christians if they feel that they are a threat to the junta. For your information, the junta is particularly targeting Buddhist monks and this fact is all over the media. But I suppose the mullahs are too busy memorizing the Koran to read newspapers.

And another flaw in Islamic thinking. The Baluchis are in majority in Baluchistan as are the Sindhis in Sindh. These ethnic groups have been clamoring to separate from Pakistan ever since the creation of Pakistan. They do not feel that they are adequately represented in the Pakistani government or that their needs are met. Now if you are asking that the majority's demand should be accepted to form a separate country (as in Kashmir), why doesn't Pakistan allow Baluchistan and Sindh to separate from the country?

"There is even a particular sect of Hinduism known as Kashmir Shaivism (a form of Tantra). I know this because I am a student of Indian philosophy."

Its funny how these hindu's with fake ID have such a low self esteem that they somehow think its un cool if they disclose they true identity. I, for one cannot comprehend how these people (Kafir, Clearthinking, ARKNS) look a themselves in the mirror.

"Yasseryousufi needs to do some basic reading about Myanmar. He says "violent monks" are killing Muslims in Myanmar. The claim is laughable. When someone does not know about a topic, one should just shut up because saying something so silly only reveals one's ignorance.

The military junta is killing off and repressing all kinds of opposition. Religion does not have anything to do with the way the military junta is behaving."

Here's some actual information for you to dwell upon kiddo. Some advice for your childish ignorant self, try not to poke educated people who know much more than you can ever dream of. Keep exchanging your hate mails with your like mided friends (Kafir and Clearthinking)

Here's the link

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Muslims_in_Burma

"....illegally occupying the muslim state of Kashmir"

A load of bull. "Occupying" means a country has forcefully taken over another country and occupying it. Go check the dictionary. Kashmir was always a princely state ruled by the Maharaja who signed an agreement to join India. What do you mean "occupation"?

Just because Muslims are in majority in an area does NOT make it a Muslim state. It's idiotic reasoning.

Persiflage,

You keep sidetracking from the real issues. That’s a turnoff for me. If you’re looking for a dialogue, im all for it. If you’re looking for a monologue where you keep asking questions without responding to any, don’t bother replying to this post.

I asked you to define terrorism to me. You clearly cannot. Because any definition you’ll come up with wont suit you Americans and your European allies either. So you’ll keep trying by throwing around your terrorist cries. Let me tell you as clearly as I can. Suicide bombing is an abhorrent, hateful and disgusting crime. An overwhelming majority of muslims believe that a suicide bomber goes straight to hell. There are numerous fatwa’s in this regard. But let me ask you once again, what would you feel like if in one single night there are 1700 sorties over New York City including 504 Cruise Missiles, killing as yet unknown number of civilians (probably in thousands) and absolutely blowing up the whole infrastructure of your city to smithereens. And then your if your wicked, deceitful lying enemy and its media instead of calling it terrorism comes with an imaginative new term “Shock and Awe”. I bet you’d be shocked out of your skull. Try to look at this whole situation objectively. Who is the bigger terrorist, those amateurish suicide underwear bombers or these morons thousands of feets up in the air dropping 2000 pound bombs on cities filled with people. None of your Gandhi’s or MLK’s or Mandela’s ever faced this kind of savagery. So I ask you, how would the New Yorkers and Americans reacted to such an attack and how should the Iraqi’s have reacted to this cruel attack on their country by the combined power of Christian world on a pack of lies.

Yasseryousufi needs to do some basic reading about Myanmar. He says "violent monks" are killing Muslims in Myanmar. The claim is laughable. When someone does not know about a topic, one should just shut up because saying something so silly only reveals one's ignorance.

The military junta is killing off and repressing all kinds of opposition. Religion does not have anything to do with the way the military junta is behaving. |

For those who do not see the logic behind suicide bombing among the Jihadists here is a summary of the justification according to a Muslim imam.

The privileges that are bestowed upon the one who dies for Allah and mentioned in the hadith are:
1- The Shahid's sins are forgiven
2- He sees his place in Paradise and lives a full life of joy with Allah
3- He is protected from "the Great Shock" on Judgment Day
4- He is crowned with a crown of honor
5- He marries 72 dark-eyed wives
6- He will be able to intervene on behalf of 70 of his family members on Judgment Day, thereby ensuring them the reward of Afterlife.

No comment!

Pakistani Muslims have this fixation that Kashmir belongs to them. Well, let's explore this absurd claim.

If you look at the history of Kashmir, you will find that the majority of Kashmirs were Hindus when it was ruled by Maharajas. There is even a particular sect of Hinduism known as Kashmir Shaivism (a form of Tantra). I know this because I am a student of Indian philosophy. Now, the region was invaded by Mughals and converted to Islam in the 18th century. Since then, the demographics of Kashmir has shifted as Muslims came into majority.

Now there was no Pakistan before 1947. Pakistan was carved out of India. The Indians gave them the land because Muslims felt that they could not live with Hindus in India. Just read the history of India. To now say that they also want Kashmir because Muslims happen to be in the majority there has no merit. Just because you are in the majority somewhere does not entitle you to a separate country. If that were the case, then the Chinese should give Tibetans their independence, the Sinhalese in Sri Lanka should grant the Tamil their own homeland. Does that entitle Muslims in Dearborn, Michigan to ask for a separate country? But look at this absurd logic. Muslims everywhere in the world are fomenting trouble and violence because they feel that it is their right to ask for independence by virtue of the fact that they are in the majority there--just look at what is happening in Thailand, the Philippines, Chechnya (Russia), China with the Uighur, etc. The Jews are not asking for a separate homeland in New York. The Christians are not rebelling and asking for a separate homeland in some parts of Southern India where they happen to be in majority. In fact, many parts of the world have certain groups which are in a majority somewhere (e.g., the aborigines are in majority in some parts of Australia). That does not given them the right to demand a separate country! I really don't understand this nonsensical Islamic logic.

Yasseryousufi:

'Why this one sided terrorism accusation hysteria.'
__________

Because of the destruction and mayhem wrought by fundamentalist Muslims both here and abroad, and because of the highly acclaimed terrorist actions that are still planned and pending here in the USA.

The cumulative effects of several years of very negative press/media coverage has also taken a huge toll with regard to shaping attitudes about Islam in general.

The suicide bomber as an individual jihadist and global symbol of Islamic terrorism doesn't help much either. To most, this is homicidal insanity of the worst kind and is extended to the entire Muslim world, whether fairly or not.

The Japanese action of suicide pilots bombing naval targets in WWII was seen as a purely military action, which was viewed as a part of the Samurai warrior tradition. But that was then and here we are in a very different world 60 years later.

Muslims have been persecuted in India and there's plenty of evidence for that - which no one should dispute. Hindus are not in any way superior to Muslims, in that regard. The Muslim contributors to Indian culture that can quickly be found in wiki appear to be primarily Sufis. If anything, the Sufi tradition is for many reasons the very best part of Islam.

However, the mystical Sufis that you apparently identify with, have also been persecuted by their own fellow Muslim devotees.

The fact is, no one is feeling threatened by Buddists, who are seen as complete pacifists. Obviously Islam has a completely different image on the world stage at this point in time.

http://www.bahairights.org/2007/12/09/fresh-persecution-of-sufis-in-iran/

http://www.muslimhope.com/Sufis.htm

http://psychology.wikia.com/wiki/Sufism

And about Japan:

There isn't much difference between Shintoism and Buddhism. Shinto derives a lot of its practices from Buddism and according to wiki more than 80% Japanese associate themselves with Shinto-Buddhist religion.

Persiflage,

I don’t think you paid attention to the point I was responding to. Lets get the perspective clear. Here’s what I responded to

“Why is Islam so intolerant. Buddhist in general are not vindictive like Muslims”

I stand by what I said, that you cannot accuse just one group of people for vindictiveness. Its human nature to respond to injustice, occupation, killings, rape and torture. That’s the way whichever God you believe in has made us humans. So whether it’s Christians, Hindus, Jews, Buddhists, Atheists, Pagans or Muslims if you keep attacking and occupying their lands, keep murdering their children, raping their women, they will fight you back. I will accept your point that violence is somehow inherent in Islam only if you can prove to me that a great deal of violence, much much more than what muslims are accused of doing, is not being perpetrated against muslims as well. So whether it’s the Serb Orthodox Christians trying to ethnically cleanse their country of Bosnians just because they’re muslims (although mildly), or the hindu’s in India illegally occupying the muslim state of Kashmir claiming its an unseparable part (atoot ang) of their mother India and killing 70,000 Kashmiri muslims in the process, whether it’s the violent monks in Myanmar killing defenseless muslims in the name of their religion, or the Jewish Israelis driving out innocent Palestinians from their homes and taking over their farms citing biblical evidence for the ownership of the land they occupy, we should forget the religious affiliations in all these cases and just focus on Islam. To me this smacks of double standards and islamophobia which is rampant on this blog and in the wider world. Don’t you remember that George Bush said “God came in my dream and ordered me to attack Iraq” or something along these lines. Same with Blair. Religion and Nationalism have been the refuge of scoundrels for ages. Whether its Pope Urban or Osama bin Laden. We muslims never elected Osama to be our leader. If he were to ever stand for election he’ll get a hiding of his life. You elected Bush! Twice! Don’t you realise that amongst 54 Islamic countries in the world, there isn’t even one that will give him refuge. Doesn’t it say enough of how an overwhelming majority of muslims rejects extremism. He has been hiding in a tiny strip inaccessible mountainous area for the last 10 years. How the Americans haven’t been able to nab him yet is another mystery of huge proportions. In my country, Pakistan the religious parties hardly ever get more than 5% votes even though Pakistan is an Islamic Republic as a lot of posters here love to point out.

You say global terrorism remains deeply identified with Islam. I would like you to clearly spell out what terrorism means to you. What do we muslims call atrocities that are committed against us by you? Do you believe it’s a just reward? Why this one sided terrorism accusation hysteria.

All religions and spiritual philosophies must foster an expansion of consciousness involving an ever-widening circle of love and compassion. At the core, the inner-most circle of a system of concentric circles, lies love of oneself. This love then expands to the love for ones family, expanding further to the love of one's community, yet further out to the love of other communities, and finally to the entire world. There is another ring that lies even beyond--love of one's enemies. When one crosses this outermost ring, one can truly claim to love God.

In fact, there are very few people in the world who can truly claim to love God. It is very hard to love God and saying does not make it so. And so we have Jesus Christ, the Master. Even when nails were being driven into his body, He said "Father, forgive them for they know not what they do".

AKA2:

I have no intention of defending anybody who is wrong. If there is discrimination against Muslims anywhere then it is wrong. That was not what I was saying.

A secular democracy is superior to a theocracy based on fundamental principles. In the former, discrimination is forbidden and subject to challenge. In a theocracy, discrimination is inherent and is not subject to challenge. Even in the United States, it is not as if all discrimination against blacks and other minorities has come to an end (even with the election of Barack Obama as President). Discrimination is still very much there. But the important difference is that this society is constantly evolving to a higher, more equal, plane. It is not languishing in terms of those human values. That same thing can be said for India which has millions upon millions of Muslims who are doing extremely well. Now does it mean that all discrimination against Muslims has ended? Of course not. But their society is secular by founding principles just like ours. And that fosters a just society (even as it struggles against flaws).

Now take this Islamic law stipulating that one Muslim witness is equal to two non-Muslim witnesses. This is an openly discriminatory legal system which goes against basic human values and decency. No matter which "God" says so. As I said at the beginning, even God must make sense. I have not given Him a blank check to say whatever He wants. No, peace and overall benefit to mankind stands above my need to believe in any particular religion.

I reject all forms of discrimination in the name of religion. If it means rejecting my own, I do so too.

And here is another problem with Islam. It is a package deal. A Muslim has to agree with Islam in its entirety or risk being labeled a apostate (and put to death). He/she cannot reject any part of the religion and still claim to be Muslim. This straight-jacket system of "good Muslim" "bad Muslim" is not there in the other religions. Infidels can reject parts of their religion without being called "bad Christians" or "bad Jews" or "bad Hindus" or whatever and risk being ostracized by their infidel societies. This package deal business and punishment of those who raise serious questions makes it very difficult, if not impossible, to reform Islam.

'In general, all people are essentially the same. It’s a racist point of view to condemn just one group of people. The Buddhists in Myanmar, Thailand and Sri Lanka have committed atrocities against its minorities. The Japanese atrocities during the WW in the places they occupied is well documented. And lastly who can forget the most fearsome Buddhist of all, Pol Pot.'

The difference here is that totalitarian despots in Buddhist countries don't proclaim religious beliefs or religious founders i.e. the Buddha, as the substance and foundation of their dictatorships and inhumane treatment of their fellow countrymen. It's very likely that these narcissitic individuals don't follow a religious tradition of any kind....as such despotism is completely contrary to Buddhist precepts.

The Japanese in WWII never proclaimed an affiliation with Buddhism - if anything, Shintoism was much more aligned with the nationalist fervor of that era of Japanese history.

And the fact remains - global terrorism today is deeply identified with Islam, even though Islamic supporters of terrorism consist of a small minority of believers......perception is everything, and arguments to the contrary are without substantial gravity.

In fact, the Muslim world must work very hard indeed, in order to overcome the negative image and deep impact perpetrated by the actions of a relatively few zealots. It's all about fear, and that is the most powerfully unreasoning emotion of all.

When you talk of Non-Islamic, progressive, democratic, modern state like INDIA - You talk hipocracy - The Muslim population in India is not less than 18% and what is the percentage of Muslims in Government Jobs.... less than 1%. Why??

It used to be 40% at the time of partition 1947. The pregress you have made is from to more than 40% to less than 1% muslims now in state Jobs!! Great Achievement...

Talking of Equality in India especially with minories is far from reality.

Although PAKISTAN reserves seats in parliment for minorities there is no such in Indian side. Who is fair & who is not, now you decide.

Contradictions in Islam

1. When a country is formed using religion as its basis (such as the Islamic Republic of Pakistan), that country's constitution is based on theocracy. As such, it obviously grants second-class status to minorities, those who do not belong to the Islamic faith. But this is an inferior and narrow minded constitution when others do not enjoy equal rights. The contradictions here is that Muslims want equal rights in Western and other democracies (like India). They are forever complaining against what they see as discrimination even though the rights they enjoy in secular democracies are often far greater than the rights they enjoy in theocracies like Pakistan, Iran, and Saudi Arabia. Muslims want rights but they do not wish to grant non-Muslims the rights they want.

2. The word "infidel" means those who do not believe (in Islam). Now, the concept can be applied equally to Muslims. If I am an infidel with respect to Islam, then Muslims are also an infidel with respect to any other religion. I am not saying that other religions have this concept. I am just applying the same standards that Muslims apply and trying to demonstrate the absurdity of this philosophy. So pretty soon we have a world full of infidels because somebody is an infidel with respect to somebody else. Now obviously we will have an unstable world because it is much easier for friends to get along in this world than infidels (none of us can settle on the moon--yet). Therefore, I must conclude that this is a stupid and inferior concept. (QED)

3. Now let's take Dumbo concept number 3. This involves the mixing of religion and politics. This is a big mistake which has imposed a huge cost on Islamic countries in terms of continuous political strife such as in Pakistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc.

4. Dumbo concept no. 4. Lack of womens' rights has forced Muslim women to lag behind their counterparts in the rest of the world.

I can go one but the contradictions in Islam are profound and serious. And they say this is the word of God!

A common type of faulty thinking and lack of logic and common sense that one would think people would be aware of--and, therefore, avoid--is all too evident on these pages. It shows when people attempt to make a point that all religions are guilty of committing violence and atrocities. Thus, Muslims attempt to counter charges that Muslims are uniquely prone to violence against their opponents by raising the comparisons of Nazis (Christians) against Jews, Chinese (Buddhists) against Tibetans and Pol Pot (Buddhist) against his political opponents. At least, we've managed to avoid that truly tiresome canard, Americans (Christians) against Indians.

What makes all these comparisons totally irrelevant: None of those non-Muslims were explicitly acting in the name of their religion when they committed their atrocities. No human being who can tie his shoe lace, I assume, believes that the Chinese Communists who repressed Tibet or the Cambodians who slaughtered their countrymen were acting in the name of Buddhism. Or that Nazis were simply following through on the teachings of Jesus Christ. The Nazis went after their Christian opponents as ferociously as they did the Jews. The American genocide against the Indians, whatever its twisted origins, did not march forth under a Christian banner.

People who happen to be Christians and Buddhists have, in fact, committed atrocities. But their acts plainly and palpably violated the basic precepts of their religion. Muslims, on the other hand, have all those Koranic verses about jihad and slaying their enemies to rationalize their violent acts in the name of their religion.

To make the point, one simple fact that most people--especially Muslims--tend to ignore. How did Christianity survive and prosper during the first 300 years of its existence? Not by violence. Not by raising armies. Not by having the backing of powerful governments and states. Christianity spread by appealing to the better angels of human nature. Islam, from the git-go, followed the sword.

ARIF 2:

Looks like you come from family of perverts who are blinded to real good things in life.

Clear Thinking:

Introspect your own community before commenting on others. Is it not true your people who force their women to commit Suicide(Sati) upon death of their husband. The people who demand large sum of money(dowry) from girls parents to marry. The people who pray to female sexual organ as their lord..... are today advocating women's rights.

When truth is revealed it becomes threating to you

Akafir:

Akafir is a Kafir(Denier of the truth). What ever the source you provide. His religion is denial funded by dollars not dime.

"Why Muslims around the world from Pakistan to Saudi, Indonesia to Nigeria have come to avenge the war in Iraq."

You moron! should we forget that the 42 country alliance of the Crusading Christian Nations called 'Coalition of the Willing' ganged up to rape and plunder a totally innocent country widely supported by their hatefilled populace.

and finally,

“Why is Islam so intolerant. Buddhist in general are not vindictive like Muslims.”

In general, all people are essentially the same. It’s a racist point of view to condemn just one group of people. The Buddhists in Myanmar, Thailand and Sri Lanka have committed atrocities against its minorities. The Japanese atrocities during the WW in the places they occupied is well documented. And lastly who can forget the most fearsome Buddhist of all, Pol Pot.

@ karzengawang

Nice attempt to whitewash Israeli atrocities. You didn’t respond to a single point I raised. The systematic Israeli brutality is unmatched in the modern world. Hence we have the largest number of motions in the UN condemning Israel, not China. Do you know that in Israel IDF soldiers can get away with pumping 17 bullets in the frail body of a 13 year old girl from point blank range with a Promotion in rank and $17000 for the ‘ordeal’ of going through a court trial for such a minor offense. Israeli’s and zionists also make sure that these kinds of news never get reported in the Western Press. Imagine if this heinous crime had been conducted by a Chinese or an Iranian this girl would have been a poster child for all the western propagandists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iman_Darweesh_Al_Hams

“Chinese have dropped bombs from air when they first invaded Tibet 60 years ago. Now if they drop bombs in Lhasa majority of death will be Chinese as Tibetans have become minority.”

---The official population of Lhasa according to the 2000 census is 81% ethnic Tibetan.

“Israeli never tortured the Palestinians for praying but for killing. While Chinese have tortured Tibetan monks for movement of their lips as sign of prayer”

---Israel regularly closes down the third holiest mosque in Islam and kills Muslims protesting its closure.

“Of course Chinese rule in Tibet is aparthied worst than Palestine. Tibetans are ruled by Chinese since occupation while West Bank and Gaza strip are governed by PLO and Hamas.”

---Honorable men like Nelson Mandela and Desmond Tutu (themselves victims of aparthied) have compared Palestinian situation to apartheid. None such thing for Tibetans as far as I know. A pregnant Palestinian woman in West Bank will have to go through 6-7 check points just to go and deliver the baby in her ‘self governed’ country. And if the Israeli IDF is not in good mood for some reason she will have to deliver the baby on the footpath and maybe die in the process.

“Did Israeli forced the Palestinians children to dance on the dead bodies of their parent which Tibetans children had to endure when Chinese soldiers forced the Tibetans to dance on the dead bodies of their parent.”

---I’ll need to see the proof for this. Looks to me like standard western propaganda. I do know that the Israeli’s use Palestinians (including children) as human shields while doing house to house search. It’s considered a war crime.

“Why are you not allowing Church, temple in Mecca and Medina but have built thousands of mosques in holy place of Christians, Hindus, Buddhist, Jains, Zoarastrin and Sikhs etc.”

---This done to death piece of propaganda is getting pretty boring now. There are temples and churches all over the muslim world wherever minorities live. Why do you want to build Churches and temples in a place where there are no hindus or Christians?

A norm of how non-muslims are treated in muslim countries:
http://www.energypublisher.com/article.asp?id=26956

A court in Faisalabad, Pakistan, sentenced to life imprisonment Imran Masih, a young Christian, for having insulted and desecrated the Koran, according to the Minorities Concern newsletter.

On July 1, 2009 Masih, a shopkeeper by profession, was brutally tortured by a group of Muslims, then arrested by police on charges – allegedly fabricated- that he had burned pages of the Koran.

On January 11, 2010 the judge sentenced him to prison for life, which he will serve in the federal prison in Faisalabad where he is currently confined.

The court also imposed an additional penalty of 10 years' imprisonment and payment of 100 thousand rupees (just over 800 euros), under provisions of the law prohibiting blasphemy against Islam.

Peter Jacob, executive secretary of the National Commission on Justice and Peace, sponsored by the Catholic Church, while not openly criticizing the ruling, speaks of "not a good verdict " and "lack of freedom" of the judiciary.

@Hitman2:
"You avoided my point,where were you pseudo intellecuals mounted to tell the others what your research work proves from your books and bloggings, before 2001?"

I apostatized well before 2001, but it was nearly impossible to get anyone to listen. In Europe even at present (especially in UK) it is extremely difficult to say anything openly and truthfully about Islam. Rushdie was well before 2001, and there have been people like Rushdie since then but they could not get any press. Example the egyptian writer Hayder Hayder was declared an apostate for his book "A Banquet for Seaweed". I bet you did not even know about him. Similarly there have been many quite leaving of Islam in Pakistan well before 2001. Irfan Khawaja became an apostate well before 2001 but I doubt his name means anything to you. You see you are trained to think that no one but no one ever leaves Islam. Pakistanis killed a lot of Balochis and Pathans who belonged to the socialists parties. Look up Hassan Nasir on Wikipedia and see that he was tortured to death in Lahore in 1960s. He was an apostate. You very well know that you don't declare your apostacy among the Muslims. You don't get to live very long. 2001 brought publicity but more importantly the web became easily available and that provided the anonymity that allowed the apostates to speak without being killed.

"some of the site and the personalities you praised with the intention to sell them to the readers are nothing else that a heap of garbage.
You know to whom you are worth of buying -
just the evil-mongers."

Readers can make their own mind. You are welcome to your opinions.

"The reason you tried to create is childish."

No idea what you are talking about here. What reason did I try to create?

Hitman2,

Thanks for the threatening post against Hindus in India. It shows the true colors of Islam, which is violent and angry like you.

BTW, your reference to the muslim Bollywood star shows how pluralistic Hindus in India are compared to Muslims. The Muslim movie stars seem to enjoy much more freedom to live their lives and make movies. They seem quite rich and comfortable, especially when compared to Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, & Pakistan.

A few people protesting in India is morally equivalent to Pakistani Muslims' support for Taliban, Al Queda, and Lashkar-e-Taiba in your mind. The thousands of murders of innocents are equivalent to protest of a movie in your islamic mind.

We all get it. We all see the truth. Do you?

Americans -- at least most Christian Americans -- get miffed when someone usurps "their" god. But let a few Buddhists blow up some stuff, and we'll hate 'em just as much as we do Muslims.

Hitman
"His readiness to kill those who did not agree with him, his lust for women. His desire to thigh, carnal fondling and rape of a little girl, his "favorite" wife Aisha. His voracious apatite for mischief, wars, loots and raids on unsuspecting people. His misogynic views on women, yet I myself feel whenever I re-read them, a new way of disgust, a new sense of an urge to vomit..."

Arif - He read the koran and hadith for proof; you can do it too!

akafir

You avoided my point,where were you pseudo intellecuals mounted to tell the others what your research work proves from your books and bloggings, before 2001?
some of the site and the personalities you praised with the intention to sell them to the readers are nothing else that a heap of garbage.
You know to whom you are worth of buying -
just the evil-mongers.
The reason you tried to create is childish.

@Hitman2:
Akafir

"Only you remember all the original sources of reference and that too after 2001 when such people like you were hired and full time paid workers to do a smear work on islam on the internet."

I do not get paid a dime, but would love to get paid if anyone wants to pay me for exposing Islam and Muhammad for they really are. So if you know anyone who is willing to hire me for doing this let me know, please.

"What stupid arguments you float are already available on many a websites like ali sina and the ibn ul waqt(ibn waqqar) whose book comes after 2002. where all you pseudo intellectuals were sleeping before being hired for this job.
Islam in here to live for ever."

The original sources are available on line now and via the internet it is trivial to find them. Ali Sina's site is good but not comprehensive, and ibn Warraq has quite a few books already and anyone can go to Amazon.com and look them up. I have read nearly all of them and he is very good. He is far more scholarly than Ali Sina. Ali Sina also has a book that is available at his site. It covers a lot of ground but it is in Ali Sina's style and not everyone likes it, but it is brutal on Muhammad with a lot of speculation on Ali's part. Zaki Amin's book that I linked to earlier is also very good.

Whether Islam is forever or not is really up to its followers. For example, consider yourself. You quote three Kaafirs who say nice things about Muhammad and you think that is something special. Now think, if these Kaafirs really were taken in by Muhammad, why did they not become muslims? The bottom line is that they rejected Muhammad as a prophet and Islam as their religion. Why? So what you show to the muslims is that even Kaafirs who were very impressed with the lies and half information spread about Muhammad could not really be sold on Islam or Muhammad. Think about what that says about your psychology.

Clearthinking1

You wrote"
"The epicenter of Islamic Terrorism is Pakistan and a good example of the effects of Islam."

And your epiceter is in Maharashtra where moive star Shah Rukh is locked in with RSS/shive sena.
You already got a big defeat, as you are now fearful of what will happen after the US left afghanistan.What you got by becoming an american proxy? Coming back now to the negociations table. You know why?
Control yourself you can only bite you fingers.

Akafir

Only you remember all the original sources of reference and that too after 2001 when such people like you were hired and full time paid workers to do a smear work on islam on the internet.
What stupid arguments you float are already available on many a websites like ali sina and the ibn ul waqt(ibn waqqar) whose book comes after 2002. where all you pseudo intellectuals were sleeping before being hired for this job.
Islam in here to live for ever. If the muslims as beaten your armies of evil in the past then dont be jealous and settle scores by disrespecting their prophet.
You are very fond of quoting verses and ahdees while a kafir who is a concealer of the truth do not qualify for it, that's the logical conclusion.
Malifade intentions reaps vainity and nothing expect vainity, your pains and jealousy about muslims and Islam is your punishment which do not let you sleep and makes you a habitual blogger rather a sick blogger, have you ever thought about your mental state?

The epicenter of Islamic Terrorism is Pakistan and a good example of the effects of Islam.

The real name of the country is the ISLAMIC REPUBLIC OF PAKISTAN. This tells you a lot. How many non-islamic countries name themselves after a religion. What does this say about respect for minorities, other religions, tolerance and plurality that is necessary in a modern democratic state?

Experiments in political science are difficult, but Pakistan and India are a rare example. People of the same DNA and genes that share common languages, rituals, and cultures (e.g. Punjabi, Sindhi, etc..) are separated by religion. In just 60 years, there have been clear results.
India (based on Hinduism and Vedanta) is a tolerant, pluralistic, vibrant, nonaggressive democracy. Progress is seen in politics, economics, education, etc... India has had Presidents who are Muslim, Hindu, Dalit, female; Prime ministers who are Sikh, Hindu, female; Defense ministers who are Christian, Hindu, Sikh; powerful politicians are even Italian Catholics like Sonia Gandhi. More progress needs to made in many places in Indian society, but even in America Blacks had very limited rights till the 1960's and now Obama is president. Tolerant peaceful societies make progress.
In contrast, Pakistan has become an increasingly intolerant and violent society. Pakistan used to have 40% Hindus, and now it is only 1%. The culture of Hindus of tolerance and peacefulness has made even Muslims in India relatively peaceful when compared with dominantly Islamic nations.
What a difference an advanced culture and philosophy like Vedanta can make in people so similar as Indians and Pakistanis.

YASSERYOUSUFI: Have the Chinese caged the Tibetans with an aparthied wall yet? When was the last time Chinese dropped 2000 pound bombs on densely populated areas of Lhasa using F16's, F16 and Apache's? Does China cuts off electricity, medicines and food supplies to

Tibetans? Have the Chinese ever used white phophorous to burn innocents people to death? Did the Chinese drop Cluster Bombs on Tibet making sure Tibetan children continue to long after the war is over?

Is there any limit to the stupidity of the hate islam crackpots on this blog?

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Chinese have dropped bombs from air when they first invaded Tibet 60 years ago. Now if they drop bombs in Lhasa majority of death will be Chinese as Tibetans have become minority.

Israeli never tortured the Palestinians for praying but for killing. While Chinese have tortured Tibetan monks for movement of their lips as sign of prayer.

Of course Chinese rule in Tibet is aparthied worst than Palestine. Tibetans are ruled by Chinese since occupation while
West Bank and Gaza strip are governed by PLO and Hamas.

Did Israeli forced the Palestinians children to dance on the dead bodies of their parent which Tibetans children had to endure when Chinese soldiers forced the Tibetans to dance on the dead bodies of their parent.

Why are you not allowing Church, temple in Mecca and Medina but have built thousands of mosques in holy place of Christians, Hindus, Buddhist, Jains, Zoarastrin and Sikhs etc.

Why is Islam so intolerant. Buddhist in general are not vindictive like Muslims.

@ Mohammd A Mughal:

Wasn't your prophet Mohammed a political leader with a sword in his hand who invented Halal for meat and Jutka to kill people.

Why is Islam so intolerant about others. They won't allow other faiths in Mecca, Medina or Saudi Arabia but wants to built hundreds of mosques in holy places of other faiths in Jerusalem, Varanasi, Ayodhya, Bodhgaya etc.

Why Muslims around the world from Pakistan to Saudi, Indonesia to Nigeria have come to avenge the war in Iraq.

But Vietnamese or Buddhist round the world didn't blow American to avenge the Vietnam war.

Why cartoon of Mohamed so enraged the Muslims and angry Muslims went on rampage and killing spree while Taliban's destruction giant Buddha statues elicited compassion by Buddhist nation such as Japan by donating life saving incubators to Afghans hospitals.

Why Buddhist didn't went on rampage while Muslims went on berserk at the mere drawing of cartoons. What would happen if Buddhist spiritual leaders were to act like Islamic spiritual leaders like Mullah Omar.

To sum up you Muslims need to so self introspection and look at Mecca and that of other holy places of other faiths.

"The Han took over Tibet. The Dalai Lama and many other Tibetans are in exile. The Jews took over Palestine. Many Palestinians are in exile.

Compare and contrast the reactions of the two groups. Buddhists and Muslims."

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Have the Chinese caged the Tibetans with an aparthied wall yet? When was the last time Chinese dropped 2000 pound bombs on densely populated areas of Lhasa using F16's, F16 and Apache's? Does China cuts off electricity, medicines and food supplies to Tibetans? Have the Chinese ever used white phophorous to burn innocents people to death? Did the Chinese drop Cluster Bombs on Tibet making sure Tibetan children continue to long after the war is over?

Is there any limit to the stupidity of the hate islam crackpots on this blog?

@hitman2:
You quote Kaafirs to tell about Muhammad. You quote hindu dhimmi like Rao, or some french guy, or Watt. What would they know about Islam except they have apparently bought into the lies that muslim tell to their children. There are dhimmi scholars even at present. Karen Armstrong is one of the useful idiots for muslims.

I asked you to show some sahih ahdiat or quote some early Islamic scholar. Anyone who wants to know the truth about Muhammad then go to the original sources. Go to the writings of the muslim scholars, the earlier the better. The Apostate Zaki Amin who link I give quote some of these early sources.

Muslims like Hitman2 are raised on the lies that have crept into the biography of Muhammad because the muslims could not face how horrible and awful the charachter of Muhammad was. Nearly all the time when they tell you something nice about Muhammad, ask for the original source and nearly always you will find that it is fabricated after the 14th century.

The Han took over Tibet. The Dalai Lama and many other Tibetans are in exile. The Jews took over Palestine. Many Palestinians are in exile.

Compare and contrast the reactions of the two groups. Buddhists and Muslims.

It is impossible for anyone who studies the life and character of the great Prophet of Arabia, who knows how he taught and how he lived, to feel anything but reverence for that mighty Prophet, one of the great messengers of the Supreme. And although in what I put to you I shall say many things which may be familiar to many, yet I myself feel whenever I re-read them, a new way of admiration, a new sense of reverence for that mighty Arabian teacher."
Annie Besant, THE LIFE AND TEACHINGS OF MUHAMMAD, Madras,1932, p. 4.

"His readiness to undergo persecutions for his beliefs, the high moral character of the men who believed in him and looked up to him as leader, and the greatness of his ultimate achievement - all argue his fundamental integrity. To suppose Muhammad an impostor raises more problems than it solves. Moreover, none of the great figures of history is so poorly appreciated in the West as Muhammad."
W. Montgomery Watt, MOHAMMAD AT MECCA, Oxford, 1953, p. 52.

"If greatness of purpose, smallness of means, and astounding results are the three criteria of human genius, who could dare to compare any great man in modern history with Muhammad? The most famous men created arms, laws and empires only. They founded, if anything at all, no more than material powers which often crumbled away before their eyes. This man moved not only armies, legislations, empires, peoples and dynasties, but millions of men in one-third of the then inhabited world; and more than that, he moved the altars, the gods, the religions, the ideas, the beliefs and souls. . . his forbearance in victory, his ambition, which was entirely devoted to one idea and in no manner striving for an empire; his endless prayers, his mystic conversations with God, his death and his triumph after death; all these attest not to an imposture but to a firm conviction which gave him the power to restore a dogma. This dogma was twofold, the unity of God and the immateriality of God; the former telling what God is, the latter telling what God is not; the one overthrowing false gods with the sword, the other starting an idea with words.
"Philosopher, orator, apostle, legislator, warrior, conqueror of ideas, restorer of rational dogmas, of a cult without images; the founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire, that is Muhammad. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he?"
Lamartine, HISTOIRE DE LA TURQUIE, Paris, 1854, Vol. II, pp. 276-277.

Hate mongers like akafir are paid workers.
You can find them hanging around on these blogs for years. He dont have any other job but to spread lies about Islam. The sites he quotes are all such sites of his co-workers.
Sometimes using three four fake names to write to show how many bloggers are writing against Islam.
Such people cannot be able to discuss the merits of first few verses of Quran what to talk about going into its details.

http://www.myspear.org/islam_book.html

This book is the first of its kind. It was originally written in Arabic and is addressed and dedicated primarily to Arabs and Muslims, however all readers will find content that is interesting, well researched and informative.

Living by the point of my spear analyses Mohammad’s character and is a published account of his real biography and other facts that have disappeared from Arabic literature for 1,400 years.

It is an uncompromised and uncompromising account, showing the dark side of Mohammad and Islam, without any consideration or fear of the swords, prisons or torture by Muslim clergymen and governors.

This website, www.myspear.org, features several extracts from Living by the Point of My Spear by Zaki Ameen. To read an extract, please click one of the titles below:

From another apostate of Islam:

http://www.myspear.org/mohammed_slaves.html

Mohammed had 24 male slaves and 11 female slaves.

In his Quran, Mohammed discriminated against men according to their colour. He states: “The law of equality is prescribed to you in cases of murder: the free for the free, the slave for the slave, the woman for the woman” 1. This means that if a white man killed another white man, the killer has to be killed as a punishment for killing a human being, but, if a white man killed a black man, the white man shall not be killed as he did not kill a human being; he has to pay a fine.

Ibn Kathir2, a scholar in interpreting the Quran, explained this verse saying that the slave is a commodity, and if a slave was killed by mistake or unintentionally, no fine or compensation should be paid. Mohammed also said in his Quran:

”If one (so) kills by mistake a Believer, it is ordained that he should free a believing slave”3, meaning that if a man killed another man unintentionally, he can erase his sin by freeing a Muslim slave. Non-Muslim slaves shall not be freed from slavery. If Mohammed aimed to free slaves from their slavery, why did he set this condition? No Jewish or Christian slave shall be freed from slavery!

Mohammed aimed to increase the number of his followers and troops. He saw slaves as commodities and as part of free men’s property that can be inherited. The following incident clarifies this:

A dying Muslim man freed 6 of his slaves. After his death, his heirs complained to Mohammed. Mohammed said “If I knew what he did, I would not pray over his corpse!” 4 He felt sorry that he had prayed over a dead Muslim man who had freed his slaves! The story continues … “So Mohammed bought the six slaves and cast lots amongst them, he freed only two slaves and returned the remaining four to the heirs!

Mohammed legitimised ways to return slaves to their slavery and beat them. He said that the master could beat his slave anywhere except his/her face5, as it might deform them and decrease the value of this commodity! In another verse Mohammed regulated the punishment of an adulterous woman and used discrimination in allocating this punishment, based on the woman’s status as master or slave, by saying in his Quran:

“If they fall into shame, their punishment is half that for free women” 6. In a case where the sin of adultery was committed by a slave woman (whether married or single) the punishment should be 50 whips, while the free married woman should be stoned till death7. Again Mohammed confirmed that slaves are commodities that shall not be killed, as this will lead to financial losses to their masters.

References

Quran 2 The Cow Al Baqarah -178

Ibn kathir Pg 233

Quran , 4the women , An-Nisa 92

Musnad Al-Imam Ahmed saying number 19158

Sahih Al Bukhari , Al atik saying 2559

Quran , 4the women , An-Nisa 24

Ibn kathir Pg 463

@Aka2: "Akafir is a Kafir(Denier of the truth)"

For muslims are not all non-muslims Kafirs?

Wikipedia states:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kafir
"In the Islamic doctrinal sense, the term refers to a person who does not recognize God (Allah) or the prophethood of Muhammad (i.e., any non-Muslim) or who hides, denies, or covers the "truth"."

AKA2; Do not tell us about Islam by using Ants as an example. You are insulting the ants.

THE MIRACLE IN THE ANT (Part-4)

The ability of an ant to understand what the other one wants by a short antenna contact shows that the ants may, in a sense, "speak" among themselves. How this "antennal language" used among ants is learned by all ants is another subject to think about. Are they undergoing training on this subject? To talk about the existence of such training, we must also talk about the existence of a superior Almighty Who provides it. Since it cannot be the ants who can provide such a training, this Almighty is Allah Who, by way of inspiration, teaches all ants a language with which to communicate.
The sharing behaviour practised among ants is a specimen of self-sacrifice that cannot be explained by the theory of evolution. Some evolutionists who see the adage "Big fish swallow small fish" as the key to life on earth are forced to withdraw such words when confronted with such self-sacrifice as is displayed by ants. In an ant colony, instead of the "big ant" developing by eating the "small ant", it rather attempts to feed the "small ant" and make it grow. All ants are ready to accept the food - that is, the "provision" - given to them and definitely make sure to share the excess with other members of the colony.
As a result, what all these examples show us is that the ants are a society of living beings who have submitted to the will of the Creator and who act under His inspiration. Therefore, it would not be right to regard them as organisms which are totally unconscious, because they do have a consciousness which reflects the will of their Creator. Indeed, Allah draws attention in the Qur'an to this interesting fact and notifies us that all living things are, in fact, a community among themselves, that is, they live under a Divine order and in accordance with inspiration.
(There is not an animal that lives on the earth, nor a being that flies on its wings, but forms communities like you. We have not omitted anything from the Book, and they will be gathered to their Lord.) (Surat al-An'am: 38)

The Miracle in the Ant (Part-3)

The Role of Touch in Chemical Communications
The communications by ants by touching each other with their antennae in maintaining intra-colony organization proves that there is in use an "antennal language" in its fullest sense.
The antenna signals created by touching in ants are used for various purposes like commencement of dinner, invitations and social meetings where nestmates get to know each other. For instance, in one type of worker ant species living in Africa, workers first touch by the antennae when they meet each other. Here, "antenna shaking" means just a salute and an invitation to the nest.
This invitation behaviour is even more striking in certain ant species (Hypoponera) When a pair of workers meet face to face, the inviting ant tilts its head sideways 90 degrees and strikes the upper and lower surfaces of the nestmate's head with its antennae. Often the solicited ant responds with similar antennation.
When the ants touch the bodies of their nestmates, the goal is not to give them information but to receive information by detecting the chemicals they secrete. One ant beats the nestmate's body very lightly and rapidly with its antennae. When it gets close to its nestmate, its goal here is to bring the chemical signals as close as possible to the other. As a result, it will be able to detect and follow the odor trail its friend has just laid and reach the food source.
The most striking example that may be set forth for tactile communication is the exchange of liquid food from the crop of one ant to the alimentary tract of another. In an interesting test made on this subject, various parts of the bodies of worker ants of the Myrmica and Formica species were stimulated by human hair and were thus successfully induced to regugitate. The most susceptible ant was the one that had just finished a meal and was looking for a nestmate with whom to share its crop content. Researchers noted that certain insects and parasites were aware of such tactics and they were having themselves fed by practising this method. What the insect had to do to attract the ant's attention was just to touch the ant's body slightly with its antenna and its front leg. Then the touched ant would share its meal, even if the creature in contact with it is of a different type.

THE MIRACLE IN THE ANT (Part-2)
Communication in society
The Qur'an supplies an interesting piece of information when talking about Prophet Sulayman's armies and mentions that there is an advanced "communications system" among the ants. The verse is as follows:
(Then, when they reached the valley of the ants, an ant said,'Ants! Enter your dwellings so that Sulayman and his troops do not crush you unwittingly.) (Surat an-Naml: 18)
The scientific research made on ants in this century has shown that there is an incredible communications network among these creatures. In an article published in the National Geographic magazine, this point is explained:
Huge and tiny, an ant carries in her head multiple sensory organs to pick up chemical and visual signals vital to colonies that may contain a million or more workers, all of which are female. The brain contains half a million nerve cells; eyes are compound; antennae act as nose and fingertips. Projections below the mouth sense taste; hairs respond to touch.
Even if we do not notice it, the ants have quite a different method of communication in virtue of their sensitive sensing organs. They employ these sense organs at every moment of their lives, from finding their prey to following each other, from building their nests to fighting. They have a communication system which astonishes us, as human beings with intellect, with their 500,000 nerve cells squeezed into their bodies of 2 or 3 millimetres. What we should keep in mind here is that the half a million nerve cells and the complex communication system mentioned above belongs to an ant which in bulk is almost one millionth of a human being.
In research done on social creatures like ants, bees and termites, who live in colonies, the responses of these animals in the communication process are listed under several main categories: Alarm, recruitment, grooming, exchange of oral and anal liquid, group effect, recognition, caste determination…
The ants, who constitute an orderly social structure with these various responses, lead a life based on mutual news exchange and they have no difficulty in achieving this correspondence. We could say that ants, with their impressive communication system, are hundred percent successful on subjects that human beings sometimes cannot resolve nor agree upon by talking (e.g. meeting, sharing, cleaning, defence, etc.).

THE MIRACLE IN THE ANT (Part-1)
With their various communication methods, ants may be compared to men who can speak several foreign languages. They are able to communicate with 3-4 different languages among themselves and they are able to pursue their lives in the least problematic manner. They are able to subsist their colonies with populations of hundreds of thousands or sometimes millions, and survive all their lives without causing any confusion.
Yet this communication system we have been describing so far is just one of the miraculous features of the animal world. When we analyse both people and also all other living beings (From single-celled to multi-celled) we can discover characteristics that are different from each other, with each being a separate and individual miracle with its place in an ecological order.
For an eye that can notice all these miracles that are created around it, and a heart that can feel, it will be sufficient to look at the extraordinary communication system of the ant of millimetric dimensions to appreciate the infinite power, knowledge and wisdom of Allah Who is the sole Owner and Sovereign of all living things. In the Qur'an, Allah refers to these people who do not have this capability and who may not appreciate His might:
(Have they not travelled about the earth and do they not have hearts to understand with or ears to hear with? It is not their eyes which are blind but the hearts in their breasts which are blind) (Surat al-Hajj:46)

Islam not only honors Human Beings but all its creation

Akafir is a Kafir(Denier of the truth)

@Hitman2:
"On the very day of his death his only assets were few coins a part of which went to satisfy a debt and rest was given to a needy person who came to his house for charity. The clothes in which he breathed his last breath had many patches. The house from where light had spread to the world was in darkness because there was no oil in the lamp."

You quote a RamaKrishna Rao on Muhammad? It should be trivial for you to show some Sahih hadeeth on this. Is there any mention of this in Bukhari, Muslim, Dawood, Sa'ad,etc? Take this as a personal challenge and go look up the original references and see whether these claims have any basis in reality or whether this is the Indian "creativity" at work. When you find some real sources, please let me know for I really would like to see them. If this is true then I have made a terrible mistake in my life and would like to correct that. Do you know how many lies the muslims tell about Muhammad and without any basis at all?

We know, you are completely messed up

"What became of what he inherited from his first wife Aisha."
Correction; Khadija was the prophet's first wife whom he outlived. Sorry for the mixup.

Clear Thinking!

The people who force their women to commit Suicide(Sati) upon death of their husband. The people who demand large sum of money from girls parents to marry. The people who pray to female sexual organ as their lord..... are today advocating women's rights.

Hitman asserts:
“On the very day of his death his (Mohammad) only assets were few coins a part of which went to satisfy a debt and rest was given to a needy person who came to his house for charity. The clothes in which he breathed his last breath had many patches. The house from where light had spread to the world was in darkness because there was no oil in the lamp.”

This is history according to Hitman. This other man had at least 9 wives and one concubine and each had a house and its retinue of slaves. What became of what he inherited from his first wife Aisha, probably the richest person in all of Arabia? What became of all the lootings of the Arabian tribes and their caravans? What became of all the Jewish agricultural lands of Khaibar that he considered a gift from Allah to his person and which his daughter claimed after his death? Such allegations of extreme poverty to "the Prophet of Allah" insult the intelligence of any thinking person.

Please go immediately to the Post's editorial section here on washingtonpost.com and go to the link provided to Christopher Hitchens' latest article in Slate dealing with the very subject in this blog. Read how Muslims in Malaysia are raising hell about anyone but Muslims using the term "Allah" to refer to God--even tho' that's the word for God in the native language. Read once more about mobs and rioting, etc., because some Muslims have found something to be offensive. But do not expect Eboo Patel to report it. Stand by for his next missive on ignorance about Islam in the U.S.--the country that grants Muslims more freedom than any of their native countries.

The epicenter of Islamic Terrorism is Pakistan

The real name of the country is the ISLAMIC REPUBLIC OF PAKISTAN. This tells you a lot. How many non-islamic countries name themselves after a religion. What does this say about respect for minorities, other religions, tolerance and plurality that is necessary in a modern democratic state?

Experiments in political science are difficult, but Pakistan and India are a rare example. People of the same DNA and genes that share common languages, rituals, and cultures (e.g. Punjabi, Sindhi, etc..) are separated by religion. In just 60 years, there have been clear results.
India (based on Hinduism and Vedanta) is a tolerant, pluralistic, vibrant, nonaggressive democracy. Progress is seen in politics, economics, education, etc... India has had Presidents who are Muslim, Hindu, Dalit, female; Prime ministers who are Sikh, Hindu, female; Defense ministers who are Christian, Hindu, Sikh; powerful politicians are even Italian Catholics like Sonia Gandhi. More progress needs to made in many places in Indian society, but even in America Blacks had very limited rights till the 1960's and now Obama is president. Tolerant peaceful societies make progress.
In contrast, Pakistan has become an increasingly intolerant and violent society. Pakistan used to have 40% Hindus, and now it is only 1%. The culture of Hindus of tolerance and peacefulness has made even Muslims in India relatively peaceful when compared with dominantly Islamic nations.
What a difference an advanced culture and philosophy like Vedanta can make in people so similar as Indians and Pakistanis.

Muslims have more freedom, opportunity, and justice in non-muslim nations like the US, Europe, and India than in their own majority nations. Non-muslims and all women are horribly discriminated against in all muslim nations.
This says a lot about Islam.

@HITMAN

Point taken~!

YaseerYousafi

What a surprise? you are innocent, trying to argue with those who are void of any faith. These people are stubborn in their own foolishness,you cannot set a dogs tail straight even if you keep it in a pipe to set it straight, for several years.

Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) - Untainted and Pure
"After the fall of Mecca, more than one million square miles of land lay at his feet. Lord of Arabia, he mended his own shoes and coarse woolen garments, milked the goats, swept the earth, kindled the fire and attended the other menial offices of the family. The entire town of Medina where he lived grew in wealth in the later days of his life. Everywhere there was gold and silver in plenty and yet in those days of prosperity many weeks would elapse without a fire being kindled in the hearth of the king of Arabia; his food being dates and water. His family would go hungry many nights successively because they could not get anything to eat in the evening. He slept on no soft bed but on a palm mat, after a long busy day to spend most of his night in prayer, often bursting into tears before his Creator to grant him strength to discharge his duties. As the reports go, his voice would get choked with weeping and it would appear as if a cooking pot was on fire and boiling had commenced. On the very day of his death his only assets were few coins a part of which went to satisfy a debt and rest was given to a needy person who came to his house for charity. The clothes in which he breathed his last breath had many patches. The house from where light had spread to the world was in darkness because there was no oil in the lamp. Circumstance changed, but the Prophet of God did not. In victory or in defeat, in power or in adversity, in affluence or in indigence, he is the same man, disclosed the same character. Like all the ways and laws of God, Prophets of God are unchangeable."
Professor Ramakrishna Rao, "Islam and Modern Age"

The personality of Prophet Muhammad as seen by Non-Muslims:
"The 100 - a Ranking of the Most Influential Person in History" by Michael H. Hart, a Christian American, an astronomer, a mathematician, a chess master, and a scientist. After extensive research, he rated prophet Muhammad (PBUH) as number one and to be considered as the most influential single figure in human history.
"My choice of Muhammad to lead the list of the world's most influential person may surprise some readers and may be questioned by others, but he was the only man in history who was supremely successful on both the religious and secular levels. It is probable that the relative influence of Muhammad on Islam has been larger than the combined influence of Jesus Christ and St. Paul on Christianity. Furthermore, Muhammad (unlike Jesus) was a secular as well as religious leader. In fact, as the driving force behind the Arab conquests, he may well rank as the most influential political leader of all time. It is this unparalleled combination of secular and religious influence, which I feel, entitles Muhammad to be considered the most influential single figure in human history."

Fake blogger writing under three names:

Muslims believe that all human beings were created equal in the sight of God. None are born with the slur of shame on their faces, nor has anyone come into the world with a mantle of honours hung around his or her neck.

The one who is high and honoured is the one who is God fearing and serves the people with good words and deeds. Distinctions of birth and glory of race are no criteria of greatness and honour. No consideration is given to one's pedigree or parentage.

The Islamic concept of well-being promotes brotherhood, insists on socio-economic justice and seeks to fulfill both the material and spiritual needs of all human beings. The reason for avoiding discriminations is that all humans are considered God's vicegerents on earth, hence fellow beings or brothers to each other. A brother can hardly be happy, if his fellow brothers are not leading a life of happiness and tranquility.

"O Mankind! We have created you from a male and female, and made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Verily, the most honourable of you in the sight of God is he who has most righteous among of you. Verily, God is All-Knowing, All-Aware."

Where's spidermean2 when you need him? He'll be sorry he missed this one.

Hitman2,

You say *The Creator has not left us(who us? very little part of Humanity at that time) without guidance*

No,The Creator has left Chineses,Indians,Africans,Japaneses,Red Indians and American Natives,Russians,German Tribes,Turkic Peoples and many others without guidance.
The Creator always send Prophets to very small semitic groups,but,He never sent Only One Prophet to Millions on the Earth.Is this Justice ?

And,Jewish people perverted from Creator's guidance(as islam asserts),if so,Creator should sent a Hebrew speaking prophet to Hebrew people,but,He sent a Arabic speaking,unlettered man to Bedouin groups.Is this reasonable ?

And,*brought revealed books*
Those books(The Law,Bible,Quran) are different from each others.They should write same things if those books revealed by the Creator,shouldnt they ?

Evil,in islam/submission mentality,means non-islam.To wit,True Believer Muslims have to fight versus non-islam.It summarizes present situation in the world.

Hitman pontificates thus:
“The Qur'an, the Book revealed to the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), is the last and final of these books of guidance.”

If you truly believe this book was written by the Creator of the Universe, I have a bridge here in the Midwest I would like to sell you.
This book has no chronology of events or a sustained theme other than a supremacist diatribe and incitement against the other. It is replete with scientific heresies, historic blunders, mathematical mistakes, logical absurdities, grammatical errors and ethical fallacies. It is badly compiled and it contradicts itself. It lists legends from Arab and Persian pagans along with embellished stories from the Talmud, Old and New Testaments.
The book talks of flying horses, speaking ants and arguing birds. It describes an afterlife gardens with rivers of wine and honey and brimming with young black eyed receptive beauties placed there simply to service the believers and Jihadists in an everlasting super orgy, all under Allah’s watchful eyes.Halleluah!

Ok, the below was less-than gentle.

Please, good people. This won't get any better if this is all we hear when Mr. Patel speaks, though.

OK.

In the ten thousand names of the ever-loving Goddess, Mother of All...

Is anyone here actually catching the irony that *all* you 'abrahamic' guys killing each other and everyone else in sight...

'against evil,'

Share little in common but a book which claims on page one that everything that has ever gone wrong in the world came of you guys swallowing something which you were *told* (By the *bad guy in your own book, no less,) would 'empower' you to judge the difference between 'good' and 'evil?'

Which you've then spent your entire histories trying to obliterate in others, to much grief for all concerned?

Just wondering, here.

The irony is... Fffff. There's no word or measure for irony on that scale.

Hitman2 says:
Muslims are taught to fight against evil:

"Those who believe do battle for the cause of Allah; and those who reject faith do battle for the cause of Evil. So fight ye against the friends of Satan; feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan." 4:76

Note the "those who reject faith do battle for the cause of Evil." And Quran is explict on faith.

003.019
SHAKIR: Surely the (true) religion with Allah is Islam, and those to whom the Book had been given did not show opposition but after knowledge had come to them, out of envy among themselves; and whoever disbelieves in the communications of Allah then surely Allah is quick in reckoning.

003:085
SHAKIR: And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.

So much for interfaith dialog and multiculturalism. No non-Muslim should plead ignorance on where they stand with Allah and his Muslims.

Islam is a worldview and an outlook on life. It is based on the recognition of the unity of the Creator and of our submission to His will. Everything originates from the One God, and everyone is ultimately responsible to Him. Thus the unity of the Creator has as its corollary the Oneness of His creation. Distinctions of race, colour, caste, wealth and power disappear: our relation with other persons assumes total equality by virtue of the common Creator. Henceforth our mission becomes a dedication to our Creator; worship and obedience to the Creator becomes our purpose in life.

The Creator has not left us without guidance for the conduct of our life. Ever since the beginning of creation He has sent down Prophets who have conveyed His message to humanity. They are the source from which to discover God's Will. Thus we have the chain of Prophets beginning with Adam (peace be upon him) and ending with Muhammad (peace be upon him). Abraham, Moses, Noah, John, Zechariah and Jesus (peace be upon them) all belong to this golden chain of Prophets. The Prophets David, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad (may peace be upon them all), brought revealed books of guidance with them. The Qur'an, the Book revealed to the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), is the last and final of these books of guidance.

Muslims are taught to fight against evil:
"Those who believe do battle for the cause of Allah; and those who reject faith do battle for the cause of Evil. So fight ye against the friends of Satan; feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan." 4:76

Muslims are allowed to fight against traitors, hypocrites who pretend to be friends with the Muslims, such as those who deserted the Muslims at the last moment when facing a fierce battle at Mt. Uhud and which nearly caused a disaster for the Muslims. Such traitors are to be treated as enemies, just as they are by all nations at war:

@YasserYousufi:
You ask me about what muslims have done.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/06/weekinreview/06macf.html?pagewanted=all

KHOBAR, Saudi Arabia — A recent fatwa posted on a popular Islamic Web site in Saudi Arabia explains when a Muslim may mutilate the corpse of an infidel.

The ruling, written by a Saudi religious sheik named Omar Abdullah Hassan al-Shehabi, decrees that the dead can be mutilated as a reciprocal act when the enemy is disfiguring Muslim corpses, or when it otherwise serves the Islamic nation. In the second category, the reasons include "to terrorize the enemy" or to gladden the heart of a Muslim warrior.

......

The Islamic history is filled with mutilations of the Kaafir opponents. You need to go read a bit more about Islam.

@YasserYousafi:

You quote another Tafsir. I quoted ibn Kathir. Now the incident that your Tafsir is referring to is mentioned in the hadaith. Sahih Bukhari tells it as:
Volume 8, Book 82, Number 794:

Narrated Anas:

Some people from the tribe of 'Ukl came to the Prophet and embraced Islam. The climate of Medina did not suit them, so the Prophet ordered them to go to the (herd of milch) camels of charity and to drink, their milk and urine (as a medicine). They did so, and after they had recovered from their ailment (became healthy) they turned renegades (reverted from Islam) and killed the shepherd of the camels and took the camels away. The Prophet sent (some people) in their pursuit and so they were (caught and) brought, and the Prophets ordered that their hands and legs should be cut off and that their eyes should be branded with heated pieces of iron, and that their cut hands and legs should not be cauterized, till they die.

and the next hadiath in Bukhari adds:
"The Prophet ordered for some iron pieces to be made red hot, and their eyes were branded with them and their hands and feet were cut off and were not cauterized. Then they were put at a place called Al-Harra, and when they asked for water to drink they were not given till they died. (Abu Qilaba said, "Those people committed theft and murder and fought against Allah and His Apostle.") "

What is fighting against Allah and His Apostle? It is turning away from Islam. It is because they became apostates.

The other fascinating aspect is the cruel and barbaric punishments of the Quran. Killing them was not enough. Their eyes had to be branded, and they had to be bled to death, and water had to be denied to them.

You can choose to believe whatever you like but I have shown you what "fighting against Allah" means from the Tafsirs and from your Hadiaths. The iranian Mullahs have not doubts about what "fighting against Allah" means because they have charged many many apostates with that and hanged them.

Kafir,

For the last time......go read the context. This particular Surah was revealed when a tribe known as "Arniyyūn" came to Medina full of strife and sickness and asked Prophet Muhammad for help. The Prophet allowed them to live with the Shepherds and Camels and drink their milk till they regained strength. Once they regained their lost health they killed the shepherds and ran away with the camels. This is when this surah was revealed. Their punishment was for their treachery and unfaithfulness. Cite me one instance where muslims crucified or cut off the hands and legs from the opposite sides of the people they were fighting. Surely you can cite none. Yet you will ramble on. Here's the link to the tafseer

http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=1&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=5&tAyahNo=33&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0&LanguageId=2

As I said you're either a lunatic or a paid agent! Either way......you've been a waste of time. No amount of twisting can hide your inherent hatefulness. The holy Quran has guided muslims for 15 centuries towards great heights. If only for the past 200 years we've been left behind its because we've forgotten the teachings of Quran. We need to once again live our lives based upon a system of justice, equality, piety and education as the Quran says and we will once again take our deserved place in this world! This is my last post to you. Good Bye~!

""Someone who a layperson would consider having a great deal of knowledge about Bhuddism, would not answer that they have a great deal of knowledge about Bhuddism.""

Excellent point, there, actually.

Still, I think there's the simple fact that, even allowing for all the paranoia and hyperbole, Islam actually *does* kind of have the goal of converting the world.

Christians think that's OK for *them* to try and do, but are scared like anyone would be of anyone *else* trying it.

That's why they're 'enemies...'

Competing for the same thing.

Buddhism is considered generally-innocuous by even the most paranoid. Cause... That's actually even part of their belief system. And there's kung fu kinda stuff.

The fighting thing is not to be underestimated, actually: Because of *Western* notions of honor in battle and later chivalry, which go back much further than Christian times, Buddhists and Eastern civilizations in general have a tendency to be considered *honorable fighters.*

People tend to forget that Europeans have a culture, too. Have since long before Christianity or Islam were ever even in existence.

Osama Bin Laden is considered a coward and a reiver. *Saladin,* on the other hand, still enjoys a reputation as an *honorable war-leader*.

Look at who among our enemies, among Europeans, or among other cultures entirely, enjoy a certain respect.

It's not *about* religion. As many there may be on both sides who will try and make it so. It's about honor.

@YasserYousafi:

You say Tafisirs do not support what I said about 5.33. This is what ibn Kathir says:
http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=5&tid=13751
"Allah said next,

[إِنَّمَا جَزَآءُ الَّذِينَ يُحَارِبُونَ اللَّهَ وَرَسُولَهُ وَيَسْعَوْنَ فِى الاٌّرْضِ فَسَاداً أَن يُقَتَّلُواْ أَوْ يُصَلَّبُواْ أَوْ تُقَطَّعَ أَيْدِيهِمْ وَأَرْجُلُهُم مِّنْ خِلَـفٍ أَوْ يُنفَوْاْ مِنَ الاٌّرْضِ]

(The recompense of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and do mischief in the land is only that they shall be killed or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off on the opposite sides, or be exiled from the land.) `Wage war' mentioned here means, oppose and contradict, and it includes disbelief, blocking roads and spreading fear in the fairways. Mischief in the land refers to various types of evil. Ibn Jarir recorded that `Ikrimah and Al-Hasan Al-Basri said that the Ayat,"

Do you see that he says "it includes disbelief"? Go read it for yourself. You can believe what you like about who I am. It matters little. What matters is whether the other Kaafirs who visit this site start understanding the lie of Islam.

Someone who a layperson would consider having a great deal of knowledge about Bhuddism, would not answer that they have a great deal of knowledge about Bhuddism.

Surveys can be deceiving and I doubt that question in general.

I have read about Islam, have Muslim friends, and have read parts of the Koran.

It would be relative to who was asking the question if I have great deal of knowledge in Islam. I would certainly answer no to any survey...no, I wouldn't answer the question...

During 23-year period of Prophethood, the Prophet, in extremely
unavoidable situation encountered his antagonists only on three
occasions - Badr, Uhud and Hunayn. All of these three wars lasted
for only half day each. This means that the Prophet fought for only
one day and a half throughout his life and that total casualty
consisted of not more than 130 from both sides. To win over such an
aggressive and belligerent people with so little bloodshed had been
possible only because the Prophet always used to make the most of
the power of peace.

Arabia had been conquered during the life of the Prophet itself.
The wars that took place in this process took the toll of less than
one hundred and fifty people. This revolution brought about by the
Prophet of Islam was indeed a bloodless revolution. And this
bloodless revolution became possible only by the power of peace.

Below is a demonsration of the most common way Muslim children are brainwashed into hate before they even understand what that term means.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVOOKhBIAkI

yasseryousufi

Good luck trying to manipulate, influence or change the American public's opinion about Islam. Even though Eboo Patel quotes that American's do not know much about Islam, he is really saying we do not view Islam the way he wants us to. But believe me, we know all too much about Islam and it is not a pretty sight.

Posted by: shewholives | February 8, 2010 8:16 AM
Report Offensive Comment

-------------------------------------------------

looks like the whole bunch of redneck, high school dropout, foaming, hatefilled middle america has converged on Eboo's post. Dont worry gringo's we dont need to convince people with brains about the size of a pea. I for one dont give a damn about your opinions. Im looking for educated, well meaning and mature americans who im sure are out there somewhere.I guess as always they've been silenced by all the fundo's down here who as usual make the most noise~!

Islam is an empty well that offers nothing of value to Western civilization, all this "Islam is a great faith..." talk is complete nonsense. Islam is primitive, tribal, aggressive and completely repressive to women.

Oh, my. Where to start? The American people in their great common sense have weighed Islam in the balance and found it wanting.

Unfortunately, a billion people have bought into the ravings of a 7th century bloodthirsty desert barbarian. If you look at the historical Mohammed, you find another Jim Jones and David Koresh, a controlling, charismatic, violent, sexually predatory cult leader.

Islam's default is violence. The Koran contains 123 passages that praise war and killing. Mohammed specifically refers to the enslavement of non-Muslims as a reward that God gives to Muslims. Compare the Koran to the New Testament where there is only one act of violence. When the servants of the Temple came for Jesus, Peter drew a sword and cut off the ear of one of them. Jesus stopped him, told him to put up the sword, and healed the wounded man. To compare, Mohammed took the surrender of a Jewish tribe, and as he was raping the wife of the Jewish chieftain, had all the adult males behedaded in ditch, and the women and children sold off into slavery. Religion of Peace, indeed. Who thought of that line? George Orwell in 1984?

Beware of Islam. It is as predatory a philosophy as communism and fascism and a lot more durable. It is also much more subtle. It rides under the radar because of the benevolent tolerance we have learned to exercise in America. Yet, its message is essentially political, to gain preference everywhere, and when they reach a critical mass to begin to use violence to gain more power. Koranic warfare relies upon terror not for its insintric value but because it is the tool by which Islam achieves a moral ascendency over its victim. The traditionally accepted tenets of Koran warfare are based on the premise that those weak in their faith or without faith are most susceptible to terror, but that those strong in their faith are immune to its effects. Now, think a minute and reflect on which end of the American political spectrum is more vulnerable to Koranic warfare, which has little or no faith in the religion of their ancestors or in us as a people and nation. Which end of the political specturm was the most easily influenced by our old Soviet enemies?

It is no accident then that the Left and Islam have the same enemies: Western civilization, Christianity, and the United States of America.

Here's a puzzling finding from the recent "Eboo Patel is an A$$" Poll on the attitudes of Americans towards different religions.

Only two percent of Americans say they have a great deal of knowledge about Buddhism, mainly that it involves meditation and values non-violence above just about everything else, and 14 percent report feeling some prejudice towards Buddhists.

Meanwhile, only three percent of Americans claim they have a great deal of knowledge about Islam, such as the constant murdering of thousands of innocent men, women, and children around the world every year; the almost total subjugation of Muslim women; and the passionate desire to establish a global theocracy, and yet 43 percent claim some prejudice towards Muslims.

How is it that a little knowledge about Buddhism correlates with broadly positive feelings towards Buddhists, but a little knowledge about Islam is linked to frighteningly negative views of Muslims? It defies explanation. It boggles the mind! There must be some grave misunderstanding!

Ask folks to name a famous Buddhist and they'll say the Dalai Lama. Ask them about a famous Muslim and what name comes to mind? You got it. Public enemy number one: Osama bin Laden.

So how do we combat the prejudice that nearly half of America feels towards Muslims? Introduce them to another face of Islam.

My wonderful friend, Rami Dupyurass, who is the most wonderful man ever, says "I think the American population, all of us, are susceptible to what happens on a daily basis on the news. And quite frankly, over the last couple of months the news hasn't been quite great when you think about the three-second sound bite you hear that talks about Muslims."

Yeah, that's right, the last couple of months, that's it. And those three-second sound bites on the news. Forget that one million New Yorkers saw three thousand of their neighbors, friends, and family killed right in front of them with their own eyes. Forget the charred cinders of the Trade Towers and the Pentagon and the people inside. The problem is the susceptibility of Americans when they watch TV.

So I ask the media to be fair and to promote understanding of Islam. The next time Muslims kill thousands of innocent people, please show a clip of my wonderful friend, Rami Dupyurass, delivering a range of direct services and cultivating the arts in urban communities instead.

This is Untrue

While it is cetainly true that all religions have intolerant fanatics, only the muslims slaughter other human beings for religious reasons

Here's a little PR tip for Islam: Stop killing people for NOT being Islam. That might help a bit.

The violent jihadis do not exist in a vacuum. There is much support or indifference to their activities in the Ummah. How then, is this not the face of Islam?

While it is cetainly true that all religions have intolerant fanatics, only the muslims slaughter other human beings for religious reasons.

A Kafir:

Thanks for the clarification. If Muslims in Pakistan's tribal regions support drone attacks, good for them. I did not know (I must say) that there was support for such strikes. I thought the majority of the population there are angry about the strikes. Anyway, the Muslims there must recognize that the United States has no intention of killing innocents. We gain nothing from that.

The United States has always stood up for freedom and liberty around the world. We are not a force for domination of other peoples. This country has NEVER COLONIZED any country. NEVER. So what we are doing in Pakistan and Afghanistan is to take out terrorists who are plotting not only against Americans but against the whole world. US Armed Forces are fighting valiantly against these scumbags on behalf of mankind. Young American boys and girls are laying down their lives in this just and moral war. America has come in aid of the world before (to fight the Nazis for instance) and we will do so again. We are a force of good in this world and I am PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN.

Islamists routinely brutally assasinate the Buddhist village elders,teachers,etc. in southern thailand.
Are we supposed to close our eyes to this?
Of course Buddhism is superior to Islam.
Anyone with eyes to see would agree.

All religious fundamentalists brainwash their children from birth. Actually, almost all the religious do so; it is just that fundamentalists are more obvious in their teaching of dogma. What, exactly, do you think, is the purpose of Sunday School? Other than some very liberal sects, e.g., Unitarian Universalists, it is not a forum for examining all the possibilities for faith. You won't find Trinitarian Christians discussing the possibility of Christ being solely man or solely God. Baptists will not be objective in their answer to their children asking what is wrong with infant baptism. Many of the fundamentalist Christian sects hammer into their childrens's heads that the only acceptable English translation of the Bible is the King James' version. This is seemingly a fairly innocuous belief, but the fervor with which this trivial (except to the fundamentalist) notion is pushed by the members of these churches indicates the extremes they might go in defense of more weighty articles of faith. One only has to consider the number of abortion providers that have been killed or assaulted by fundamentalist Christians serves to conclude that this is not an idle concern. Koran citations about non-believers suffering the wrath of Allah are often offered to demonstrate the fanaticism and potential for violence of Muslims. If this be true, then what about fundamentalist Christians preaching that non-Christians or Christians not of their sect are damned? Was Pat Robertson being any less fanatic than a rabid mullah when he attributed the recent disaster in Haiti to their ancestors calling on a non-Christian deity for assistance in throwing off the shackles of slavery (and why shouldn’t they as believers in Christ were the ones who had enslaved them)? All religions have their intolerant fanatics that tolerate no deviation from their dogma.

Well, these are sweet thoughts. Why not take a tour of Saudi Arabia, Iran and Pakistan and bring them these insights?

The sad part is that as a brown-skinned indian-origin muslim, with a hindu-origin last name to boot, you are not likely to be taken too seriously.

My guess is that you would be treated as an american apostate from islam - I understand the punishment of that is death in islam.

Islam doesn't approve of violence against no Muslims. And I know there is a declared Fatua on any suicide bomber terrorist.

I think, Islam brainwashes Muslim children from childhood. So their minds when they become adults are not open to other ideas. A Muslim college told me his people of are of-raid of going to hell if they leave Islam. They don't like Islam but they can't leave due to fear of hell. Most Muslims are peace loving does not mean Islam is a peaceful religion. Most people of this world do want to live in peace until some thing compels them to violence. Since terrorists are mostly Muslims these days and Islam in the beginning spread by the use of the sword and all Islamic terrorists quote Quran in defence and since no declared a Fatua on any terrorist including Bin Laden, we have to believe Islam does approve of violence against no Muslims.

Lets start by asking

Why don't Israel treat Palestinians and India treat the Muslims as their fellow citizens.

Eboo,
what Islam needs is a group of men (and women) with a lot of courage and money to start "The New Progressive) Islam", a new branch or denomination with a new revised sacred book.
Lot of money will be needed to build new houses of worship, new schools and plenty of security and bodyguards for the leaders.
Sure, some heads will come off the shoulders, but in the long run will be better for humanity.

yasseryousufi

Good luck trying to manipulate, influence or change the American public's opinion about Islam. Even though Eboo Patel quotes that American's do not know much about Islam, he is really saying we do not view Islam the way he wants us to. But believe me, we know all too much about Islam and it is not a pretty sight.

Alibifarmer says;
“Until the teachings of Islam are overwhelmingly interpreted for peace, something that cannot be said now, it will continue to be suspect - and rightly so.”

This is the gridlock; No way Islam can be interpreted for anything but violence, injustice and intolerance. Any other interpretation and it would no longer be Islam. It is a supremacist ideology adopted by a large numbers of people who truly have no reason to feel superior except for what a 7th Century desert warlord brainwashed them to believe. They bought into that then and are buying into it now. This is a tribute to the power of brainwashing.

I am so tired of Muslims and their moral equivalence. They justify their atrocities by comparing Israel and their treatment of the Palestinians and India and their treatment of the Muslims. We are tired of this weak and dishonest argument as we know Muslims use this to absolve themselves of any responsibility for their terrorism.

Americans will feel better about Muslims when they provide satisfactory answers to the following questions: For the Benefit of our fellow Americans
Why has Islam never produced a liberal democracy in its nstive soil anywhere, anytime? We are enough democratic & we enjoy equalilty as well as liberty.

Why are Muslim societies today the only ones still ruled by kings, queens, princes, sheikhs, emirs, etc.? It is a cleaner form of governance without currupt polity.

Why is there no respect for basic human rights and civil liberties in virtually any Muslim country? There is full respect for Human Rights and Civil Liberties

Does Islam allow for separation of church and state? It is already seperate. People dont come to Church for settling State affairs
Does Islam allow for full religious pluralism. Yes, Check with Eboo.

15 hours of Middle Eastern History is not equal to 15 hours of passing knowledge of Islam. O.K

Like You, the followers of Islam too have the courage to let their wives and children choose what faith that they will follow without the threat of violence if they choose a path other than Islam?

Each Individual has the Right to choose Islam as their religion & they are accountable for their actions on the day day of judgement.

Muslims need more than a face lift. When I was in college I took 15 hours of Middle Eastern History so I have more than a passing knowledge of Islam. I find the people and culture of the middle east very fascinating but there is no doubt that there is also a culture of honor that leads muslims to kill their wives and daughters if they do not adhere to religious dictates. The way that al-quedah treats women may not be entirely typical of all of the Muslim world but unfortunately I don't see other Muslims trying to change the way that such an organization treats those over whom they have power.
In addition a religious group that would have followers that attempt to kill a cartoonist who draws a cartoon about their religion has more than a difficulty with public relations.
When the World Trade Center was hit and three thousand people died including some Muslims, Muslims in the middle eastern coultries cheered. A nation such as Iran puts on a face that is threatening to every person in the West. Again they claim they have this right in the name of their religion.
This is a difficult problem for every Muslim. If they support the very inflamitory rhetoric of the various Muslim factions and do nothing about it, then they appear to support what is said.
If Islam is a religion of peace then they need to quit supporting the concept of holy wars which is responsible for terrorism. It's a big order and I don't see how Muslims will deal with it. So far it appears that their behaviors have made the world a much more dangerous place in which to live. For everyone.

Once more, we see Muslims shoot themselves in the foot by offering stale arguments from past history as current proof of their tolerance. Please, spare us the stuff of how Muslims treated Jews and Christians one thousand years ago.

Americans will feel better about Muslims when they provide satisfactory answers to the following questions:

Why has Islam never produced a liberal democracy in its nstive soil anywhere, anytime? Why are Muslim societies today the only ones still ruled by kings, queens, princes, sheikhs, emirs, etc.? Why is there no respect for basic human rights and civil liberties in virtually any Muslim country?

Does Islam allow for separation of church and state?
Does Islam allow for full religious pluralism?
Does Islam permit the full legal equality of women?
Does Islam allow a Muslim to change his/her religious affiliation without penalty?
Does Islam allow someone to publish a book alleging Mohammad was a fraud, without fear of sanction?

The answers to those questions will determine whether Islam is reconciliable with modern democracy.

Oh, yeah. Don't wait for answers from Eboo Patel. Like most Muslims, he's good at one-way lectures on how the rest of us misunderstand Islam. But engage in dialogue? As a child of Allah, he's too good and pure for that.

All you "moderate" Islamics should find another association. Ok, so YOU aren't bombing or plotting. But you root for the bad guys within your death-cult masquerading as faith. You remain in the death cult that hijacks, maims, bombs and spews filth and hate. Oddly, most of the victims are other Islamics. This is what you associate yourselves with, this is what you ARE.

Don't then come to the country that's been fighting this death-cult for forty years and then expect US to draw the nuance that under it all, Islam is NOT really a death-cult, that it really means well. And then Islam has the nerve to brand US racist or bigoted (a laugh, given that Islam is the greatest collection of bigots EVER) because we don't play into it.

A death-cult is a death-cult, and we're flat out of lipstick to cover THAT pig with, pardon the ethnic pun.

As a Muslim who have served in the Armed forces,I say we have a long way to go to change the narrow narrative of Islam that is taking hold in the US, and the conflict in the Middle East and Central Asia does not help matter in any way, for they are Muslim, Jewish, and Christen who welcomed this conflict for there owens reason's and profit, and by changing the tone, we start by being involved in our community, and caring about our neighbour or friends, get involved in Chambers, advisory board,PTA, PTSA, and politics be a good citizen, and invite people to our community and our mosque, and show all the good things that was done not by good people , but a good person who habend to be Muslim, lets be assured other religion are very involved in all the things that are mention or not and be sure they will care about everyone else in the world unless they are Muslim or middle easterns, so we need to lead this change for its effecting us as well as our children and there children. Thank you.

Islam needs much more than a facelift. It needs a true Reformation that will ditch the violent rhetoric of "The tree said there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him." and the hundreds of similar calls to violent Jihad, and move to a faith of peace that willingly coexists will all faiths without demanding social, religious and political supremacy over all. If Islam is not a true faith system built upon God's word and will, then it will not stand up in the peaceful struggle for the hearts and souls of humanity in the free interchange of ideas. Do the followers of Islam have the courage to let their wives and children choose what faith that they will follow without the threat of violence if they choose a path other than Islam?

Kafir

On different feuds in the Islamic World:

you wrote,

"The real sad part is that muslims have killed more muslims than the number that the west has killed in the various wars in the muslim lands."

and then you had a whole laundry list of different feuds in the Islamic world. So according to your logic, it would be ok for muslims to attack Ireland because Catholics and Protestants are locked in blood feud going on for ages. How many Christians were wiped out by their fellow Christians in the 2 World Wars? The Hutu's and Tutsi's killed over a million people on either side. What about the Croats and Serbs? Really by justifying the murder of innocent Iraqis and Palestinians you have pretty much bared you true class. There is never any justification for murder of innocents. Im always ready to condemn the innocents killed by muslims. You are obviously a heartless hatemonger who will look the other way when muslims are being killed in droves by non muslims and only focus on the reaction by the muslims.

test~!

Kafir,

I have been blogging on WaPo for almost 6 years now and during that period I have only called out three Hindus (Clearthinking, yourself and this new kid on the block ARKNS) who were masquerading with fake ID's. I have been correct 100% on all three counts so you're being true to form when you falsely accuse me of calling everyone I disagree with a Hindu.

Im am not a religous expert, neither have I ever claimed to be one. Its obvious from your posts that you arent one either. The points you bring up are childish at best. You have said many times that you've read tafseer of the Quran. Either you're a Pathological Liar falsely claiming to be an expert on something you know nothing of or as Hitman suggested, a paid agent provacateur. Did you actually read the tafseer of these surahs? I hadn't read it before you pointed it out but its perfectly clear to me after reading the tafseer the context in which it is spoken. Creating mischief on the land does not mean killing anyone who criticizes Islam. It might be a fetish for haters like you but no tafseer has mentioned as such. There is no hatred for Jews in Islam. I can only cite you facts in this regard. The Islamic Empire constituted almost 3 quaters of the known world for hundreds of years. Jews enjoyed unprecedented equality and freedom during this period. They had high posts in the muslim caliphates rising to vizirs and grand vizirs frequently. Most Jews persecuted elsewhere in the west seeked refuge in the Islamic Caliphate. Can you cite me a single instance of mass killings of Jews done by muslims during the 1000 year ascendency of Islam (700 AD till the breakup of Ottoman Empire). It's only after the diabolical creation of Israel that the seeds of discord were sowed amongst muslims and jews.

You said,

"Read the commentaries of the Islamic scholars through the ages and they tell you that the only acceptable position for the non-muslims is to accept the superiority of Islam and the Muslims and to pay Jiziya with "humiliation" to show that they accept that subservient role, and if they do not then they should be killed."

Again, as I said, your thesis is childish as best. Hundreds of thousands of your fellow hindus are currently living in Saudi Arabia and neighbouring Gulf States sending billions of Dollars back home to their poor relatives in India. How many of them have been killed for not paying Jizya? Do you even know what kind of treatment was meted out to occupied people in Middle Ages? Jizya system was by far the most just system talking in relative terms. Occupied people were given guaranteed safety of their life and property. They were even exempted from military and didn't have to fight wars for the State. In return they had to pay a protection tax. The muslim subject of the state on the other hand had to pay the Zakat Tax (which the non-muslims didnt) in addition to performing non paid military service.

It is useless to argue with Akafir(concealer of the truth).
So dont be defensive with him and dont be so serious.
Leave him in darkness because he has chosen it.

when the darkness is within, one cannot know the truth.

@hitman2:
"Do you think this is a proper forum for a serious discussion? Where I do not know your indentity but should gift you with the grace of "cross-examine" me and my religion.?Are you a kidding?"

Why would you consider telling the meaning of the verses of the Quran a cross examination? At least six different Tafsirs are now online and redily available to anyone. Why do you need to know my identity to tell where my analysis of the Quran is wrong?

"The examination and critism of Islam for your own sake? That I am sure you have already done. But alas when the darkness is within, you cannot know the truth."

That is a very Islamic attitude. Allah does promise that he seals the heart, and the ears and covers the eyes of the Kaafirs. This has implications about the nature of Allah.

"Your writings points out probably your origin is in india, which is also evident by the cramps and pain that you feel about the partition and the birth of Islamic republic of Pakistan."

You are mistaken. I am not an Indian. I am a Pakistani American. And I have never expressed any pain or cramps about the partition and birth of Islamic republic of Pakistan. However, I do agree with Altaf Hussain of MQM that Pakistan turned out to be a mistake for the muslims of south asia. It has been a boon to the non-muslims of India. If there had been no partition, the muslim population of south asia being 40 to 45%, the chances that India could have sustained either democracy or secularism would be practically nil. The sectarianism in Pakistan has created choas in pakistan and if india had not been partitioned, that chaos would have been across all of south asia. So from the Indian view point and with 20/20 hindsight, partition was the best thing that happend for them. It is the unfortunate people in pakistan that are up the creek without a paddle.

Is this the correct forum? I write here because many of my fellow citizens visit this forum and do not know about either Islam or Pakistan. I hope some of the things I say will help someone make sense of what is happening.

Useless people

Akafir

you wrote:
Why is it that any criticism and any examination of Islam is always met with this incredulity by Muslims? Yasser automatically tries to call everyone a hindu, and here you are suggesting that people (most likely I, since I am the one who is actually quoting Quran's verses) are being paid. I have never received a penny from anyone for ever posting or talking about Islam anywhere. I would not risk the harm to my close family to begin with.
But more importantly, if the Quran is such a sure guide for humanity and simple as it claims, should it not be easy for educated and dedicated muslims like yourself to easily and trivially refute any criticism that is being leveled even by paid "agents"? Why cannot you show the "paid agents" to be illogical and simply wrong? It should be trivial for you, should it not? Instead you advise hiding in shadows. Why?

My reply to you:

Do you think this is a proper forum for a serious discussion? Where I do not know your indentity but should gift you with the grace of "cross-examine" me and my religion.?Are you a kidding?
Do you think, you are so cunning and cleaver that you can get away with your malafide intentions without anyone's notice?
The examination and critism of Islam for your own sake? That I am sure you have already done. But alas when the darkness is within, you cannot know the truth.
Your writings points out probably your origin is in india, which is also evident by the cramps and pain that you feel about the partition and the birth of Islamic republic of Pakistan.
As you are a professed Kafir ( concealer of the truth) it is unreasonable to discuss the details of the verses with you.
Have"t you seen, in the court of law a case is thrown out straight-away, without going into its merits and evidence if it do not qualify admittance.

acpress says:

Ask not Muslims to give more to you , rather ask yourself when to stop taking from Muslims. New york Times reports this morning that India alone receives 15 billion dollars every year from Muslim lands for their supply of labor.

-------------------------------------------
you are pure out of your mind. Without Indian Labour (as you chose to call it)the muslim nations would be buried to neck under sand and their cities will go back to pre-1972 shambles. Middel east requires Indian expertise more than India requires their dollars. 15Billion dollars might look big to countries like pakistan. india's economy is as big as 1 trillion dollars, just a drop in ocean, i would say.

@YassirYousafi and @hitman2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO4GJuKMrak&feature=related

"This is a breathtakingly accurate assessment of various issues afflicting Muslim societies by noted Pakistani columnist Hasan Nisar. He describes how the purported "clash of civilizations" between ... "

Sorry the youtube is in Urdu without translation, but this is intended for the two Pakistanis.

A pakistani journalist, Nasir Hasan, questioning the Pakistani establishment:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xL5tbU9_Kgc&feature=related

And guess what: he has been killed.

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:kiA ... clnk&gl=us

"Asian Human Rights Commission has identified 52 torture cells in Pakistan maintained by ISI , Pakistan Army, FIA and other state agencies where political workers and activists are continued being tortured, those in these torture cells are unlucky , the chicken of Islamic Republic have more rights than these poor people. This is my crime to raise the non convenient facts, to ask bitter question for which I am labeled commie, Pinko, traitor. But I will keep asking this question. I abhor these cancers I will never accept these evils in name of patriotism. They say patriotism is a scoundrel’s last resort. They killed Hasan Nasir because according to them he was not patriot. Faiz and Fraz were also traitors in their eyes. These witch hunts are not new for us. We will keep fighting."

Hasan Nasir was a muslim. There are many Hasan Nasirs in the Muslim world and they need our help and support. They do not need us calling most muslims "evil".

There is none so blind as he who will not open his mind. We may not know a lot about Islam, but we do know certain truths. Not only is Islam not a religion of peace, but it is clearly just to opposite. To have a poor opinion about Islam is the rational response to this religion of intolerance, hatred, and terrorism. It's certainly not prejudice.

It is clear to me that religions that espouse a creed with a kind of unique path to "salvation" all have a fatal flaw. Eventually all such religions generate sects that believe non-believers are not only evil, sinful, and subhuman, but that they deserve to die. Once vilified, the poor misdirected non-believers and apostates then become easy targets for denigration, slander, vilification, and murder...all justified by some higher good...I just can't figure out what that higher good is. Frankly, these strongly held beliefs were often a vital part of the glue of primitive societies and are an unfortunate relic of human behavior and survival. Modern society needs to develop improved paradigms for belief to get past these relics of our past.

Mr. Patel, I do not agree with you that Islam needs a face lift . I believe that major religions or faiths have advanced their causes based on extra ordinary messages . There is a common message and appeal of goodness in all major religions . They agree to disagree , and there is a war on territory and area of influence . It is a very profitable business for a very large number of people . A God for some one , is just a thing or a symbol for another person . A number of wars have been fought in the name of religion , and resulted in killings of hundred of thousand of innocent people . It is about time that we all stand up against all religious' fundamentalists and fanatics . Since we have a curiosity to know and learn about our neighbor , co worker , a fellow PTA member , a business person in our community , I believe that should be our best point of first contact to learn about Islam or other faiths . Like many renowned world leaders of the 20th century, as believers of a faith and secularism , Mr. Jinnah , the founder of Pakistan , was a Muslim of Shia faith and also great believer in secularism for Pakistan . We should all seek common grounds , strengthen and work for secular societies , with freedom and tolerance for people of all faiths .

Mr. Patel, You are wrong because you choose to ignore the forest for the trees.
Let's take issue of terrorism which you and Irshad Manji and Wafa Sultan are so fond of pointing out as inhernt weakness of Islam. Terrorism of all shades should be discouraged, and Islamic terrorism is an oxymoron. Although you have chosen to address the terrorism by desperate uninformed individuals as representative of Islam, how about terrorism as practiced by the state? Your favorite country, i.e the US (and mine too on many counts except when it promotes injustice), has been responsible for the slaughter of over a million Iraqi due to sanctions in the '90's (mosty children), and another million since the recent Iraq war began.
Your second most favorite country (and Irshad Manji's favorite country), i.e. Israel is involved in torture and degradation of the entire population of Gaza for some time, not to mention the recent mass killings it carried out last year. Note that even thhough I could, I refrained from using the term Christian terorism or Jewish Terrorism when talking about the respective sponsors of state terrorism

Therefore, your article reminds me of high hypocricy when you tell some loony, misinformed individuals to behave (and more importantly, wrongly equate that with the faith in general), while not addressing the root of the problem and the state terrorism which is a million times worse

I think this analysis is way off base. There is no puzzle here. People are well able to discern real threats. What you call prejudice by 43% of Americans is a reality based realistic appraisal. In multiple regions in the world, where majority or close to majority Muslim and non-Muslim populations interact, from Sudan to Nigeria to Malaysia to Pakistan there is a recurrent patterns of grassroots level violence from Muslims attacking their neighbors. In Muslim countries there are severe anti-Muslim laws. Add to that a long term pattern of massive bomb attacks all around the globe by Muslims. People who fear Muslims have solid evidence based reason for their fear and that is not prejudice.

Until the Koran's passages that call for world domination, female oppression and death to all apostates and infidels are deleted, no non-Muslim would ever think about opening a copy of the Koran.

Hopefully someday soon, we will hear Caliph, Mr. Rami and Mr. Patel demand these deletions.

Case in point:

"Fri, Feb. 5, 2010

Blasts kill 40 at height of Iraq Shiite pilgrimage

The Associated Press

BAGHDAD - Twin car bombs tore through a crowd of Shiite pilgrims packing a highway as they walked to a holy city south of Baghdad on Friday for a major religious observance, killing at least 40 people and wounding 154 others, Iraqi officials said.
It was the third deadly bombing this week hitting the ceremony in which hundreds of thousands of Shiites have been converging on the city of Karbala. Friday's attack struck during the culmination of the pilgrimage.
"

Isn't it odd that some muslims believe that because the enemy of my enemy is my friend (the CIA and the Taliban) that that somehow excuses the killing of civilians by al qaeda, that islamic terrorist that targets civilians is the same morality as the US military that targets killers hiding amongst civilians. How many of the college students in Pakistan were CIA agents?

Are you so afraid to face yourself that you can't see the difference between Bin Ldaden and yourself. And if you are no different than bin Laden, then isn't the US quite reasonable in wiping you out who threaten it.

No, the US governement has supported your governments (more often than it has over thrown them), the US people have supported the rights of your people more than you have yourselves. Muslims are free to be muslim in India and the US because these countries, though imperfect, in general value the individual. Muslims are less free in the islamic world because they don't rise up to fight for their justice.

The Afgahanistani who is so proud of not giving in to England, the Russians, and the US, proudly gave into the islamists that stopped schools, supported sharia, the stoning of women, the killing of thousands of civilians in a far off land.... The Afghanistani people, and the Pakistani people, and the people of Saudi Arabia, and the people of Iran (as much as they are trying).... these need to stand up to their true oppressors: their own governments and their own imams.

If what you want is human freedom, we Americans will support you (if you want money and weapons, then you should wonder perhaps you really don't have the will to fight your own fights and just want someone else to bear your burdens to freedom). If what you want is power, we Americans will fight you, not because we want to oppress you like your own have oppressed you, but because we don't sit by while you talk and act hate towards us.

hariaum

This article asked the question: "How is it that a little knowledge about Buddhism correlates with broadly positive feelings towards Buddhists, but a little knowledge about Islam is linked to frighteningly negative views of Muslims?"

Here is MY theory...Buddhists do not shout "death to America" in gleeful frenzied mass riots. Ever. Buddhists priests are not known for sanctioning acts of terror in the name of 'enlightenment'. While Muslims.....turn on cnn.

So needless to say the next time someone whispers "Muslim" in my ear Rami still has to contend with the Ayatollah Ali Hoseyni Khāmene’i just for one, his following is less parochial then Rami's so is more representative of shiite Muslims anyway. The divide get even greater when we include Sunni imams from Saudi and Pakistan or even get really wild and throw in Sufism from some windswept exotic land. Just because a single moderate Chicago imam impressed the author does not make him the defacto spokesman for Islam, the key to mending Islams tarnished image in the global community. Nor should "Rami" be paraded around as such in some sort of PC inspired masquerade.

I respect the "spirit" of what Eboo Patel is trying to generate in his blog, but he is over simplifying a very complex and volatile issue. Way over simplifying.

Americans equating muslims to terrorists becasue of benladen is same as muslims equating americans with serial killers becasue of jeffry dahmer

Two decades earlier Osama bin Ladin n Afghnese jihadese were fighting the SOVIET UNION. These guys were supported as "freedom fighters" by the President Reagon n they were financed by the CIA. It is a historic fact. The great American President Reagon invited Afgani leader in the white house at the end of Soviet defeat

Now these guys are bad guys n terrorists.

Maybe 10 years from now China challenges America n then the CIA will re-recruit Osama bin Ladin n taliban to fight china.
They will become the heroes again.

So now, my friend, what about YOU n ME
what if this is last day for us. Are you ready to meet your Lord? I am ready.
God is not going to ask you about democracy, politics, parties, terrorists, violence. He is going to say what did you do for ME whether you are a Jew, Christian, Hindu, Buddhist or a Muslim.
While we are talking here thousands of our fellow human beings are leaving this world n many are being born new.

We know American justice, once they find a crime, it doesn't matter if it is Marth Stewart or Govt or CEO, they put him or her in jail. If we didn't do what God wants us to do or we break His laws. There is prison in the world, I have seen it in the vision.

SO HOW COMPARISON OF OSAMA BIN LADIN WTIH DALAI LAMA GOING TO HELP YOU N ME N MR PATEL??? JUST THINK FOR A MOMENT?

Following is the proof which Criminal Internation Agency (CIA) has created Al Qaeda and this is known to whole civilzd World:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1R2GGLL_en&q=CIA+Mujahedin+Al+Qaeda&aq=f&aqi=&oq=

Rest is in:

http://home.att.net/~kgmowla

Stop lies and false propaganda like WMD in Iraq and Iran.

AgainIslam was spread by greatst Saints most of them were bon in Iran and they spread around this world with message of peace not war like following:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1R2GGLL_en&q=Report%3A+Israeli+warships+on+way+to+Persian+Gulf+U.S.+Senator+Lieberman%3A+Impose+sanctions+on+Iran+or+attack+it+&aq=f&aqi=&oq=&cad=h

Islam did not create Criminal Agency to kill and destroy. So please stop Ghorar Dim in Bengali (Egg of horse)like Al Qaeda as those were brought by Criminal International Agency (CIA) from Arab World/Muslim World to defeat USSR and later to occupy Iraq, Afganistan and Pakistan with great game and that game is conituing to occupy last Muslim land i.e. Iran. So stop all these nonsense on CIA/Al Qaeda.

Rest is in:

http://home.att.net/~kgmowla

Thanks,

While it's an effective rhetorical device to pit one individual against another, the real issue for Islam is the sum of its believers overall.

NO other religion has fostered the hatred, violence, or terror that Islam has in the 20th century. It need not be this way, but it certainly has been.

Islam will have to cure itself. Islam will have to cast out the murderers. Until the teachings of Islam are overwhelmingly interpreted for peace, something that cannot be said now, it will continue to be suspect - and rightly so.

@Hitman2:

"Pls note there is a difference between a believer in Quran and a non-believer.
It is useless to argue with them about the details of verses.
Most of them are doing this as a full time job for which they are paid."

Why is it that any criticism and any examination of Islam is always met with this incredulity by Muslims? Yasser automatically tries to call everyone a hindu, and here you are suggesting that people (most likely I, since I am the one who is actually quoting Quran's verses) are being paid. I have never received a penny from anyone for ever posting or talking about Islam anywhere. I would not risk the harm to my close family to begin with.

But more importantly, if the Quran is such a sure guide for humanity and simple as it claims, should it not be easy for educated and dedicated muslims like yourself to easily and trivially refute any criticism that is being leveled even by paid "agents"? Why cannot you show the "paid agents" to be illogical and simply wrong? It should be trivial for you, should it not? Instead you advise hiding in shadows. Why?

I just wanted to address the issue of the posts suggesting we go to war against Islam and disparaging one of the three major monotheistic religions of the world that encompasses one fifth of the world's population-let me start by stating that I am a Christian myself and I have been guilty of the same bias and prejudice; however, what we are dealing with is not Islam itself but rather prejudice, ignorance, fundamentalism and the legacy of conflict between the Christian and Islamic faiths that goes back to the Crusades; as for those who post that Islam is inherently violent or irrational, I want to remind them that it was the Arabs under Islam in the Middle Ages who preserved the Greek classics and taught the Europeans about medicine (Avicenna, or Abu Sinna), mathematics (including Algebra, or Al Jabr, and the concept of the zero), astronomy, etc. Arab civilization under Islam was advanced far beyond European civilization and included concepts of personal cleanliness and individual freedom, including property ownership and inheritance rights for women. The Arabs introduced the first university in Europe that sparked the Renaissance in Italy. The current state of many in the Islamic world is the result of backwardness, fundamentalism, ignorance, poverty, radicalism, lack of opportunity, and the domination of a conservative clergy that gains their strength in large part as the only alternative to repressive governments (by the way, we supported some of the most corrupt and violent regimes in the Islamic world, including Sadam Hussein and Osama bin Laden-they are our creations). These regions have been in constant conflict and war for decades. I in no way condone terrorism-I believe in the Rule of Law-the posts advocating the destruction of a religion shows the same stupid fundamentalist mentality they purport to abhor-these are the same stupid people who led us into a war in Iraq without even knowing at the time that the country was populated by two major schisms in Islam, the Shiites and the Sunni, obviously the height of arrogance and stupidity-enough of the stupidity, this kind of arrogance and ignorance needs to be challenged before these ignoramuses get us all killed-by the way their brilliant overseas maneuvers are destroying our economy as we are paying potentially trillions of dollars for the privilege of killing people overseas without getting any tangible benefit other than further radicalization, a nuclear race (do you think we would have invaded Iraq if they had nuclear weapons?)and greater influence in the region for Iran, China and Russia.

To those writing in favour of Islam.

Pls note there is a difference between a believer in Quran and a non-believer.
It is useless to argue with them about the details of verses.
Most of them are doing this as a full time job for which they are paid. So dont be defensive with them and dont be so serious.

Leave them in the darkness because they have chosen it.

To know Islam please google
Rumi Shams Tabrizi Abdul Qadir Jilani Khawaja Moinuddin Chishty ra

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&rlz=1R2GGLL_en&q=Rumi+Shams+Tabrizi+Abdul+Qadir+Jilani+Khawaja+Moinuddin+Chishty+ra&aq=f&aqi=&oq=&fp=a048890d3c90c6fc

All of them were born in Iran and spread to whole world with love and peace. Rest is in:

http://home.att.net/~kgmowla

Please don't related Islam with Criminal International Agency (CIA) sponsored Al Qaeda Ghorar dim in Indian language (egg of horse) which was created after USSR invasion of Muslim land of Central Asia and Afganistan.
Thanks

To know Islam please google

Rumi Shams Tabrizi Abdul Qadir Jilani Khawaja Moinuddin Chishty ra

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&rlz=1R2GGLL_en&q=Rumi+Shams+Tabrizi+Abdul+Qadir+Jilani+Khawaja+Moinuddin+Chishty+ra&aq=f&aqi=&oq=&fp=a048890d3c90c6fc

All of them were born in Iran and spread to whole world with love and peace. Rest is in:

http://home.att.net/~kgmowla

Please don't related Islam Criminal International Agency sponsored Al created after USSR invasion of Muslim land of Central Asia and Afganistan.

Thanks

cont'd:

In this small world the muslims are part of "us" and are not the "others". They have not been able to bring their religion into the modern world and have never learned how to deal with open criticism of their religion like the other religions. At least recognize that there are fanatics in other religions as well except they are marginalized because the majority of people are no longer willing to follow the rantings of the loony fundamentalists. Most muslims around the world what all other humans want but they have the additional handicap of having to deal with the violence and hate embedded in Islam. They really do not know how to deal with it, and there are many different intellectual ways that are being attempted but none really successful so far. We have to accept that it is not going to be possible to wall off one fifth to one fourth of humanity, and it really is "immoral" to even try. What we can do is be honest to ourselves and to them. Treat them as equals and talk to them honestly and truthfully. We cannot give into stupid PC mores and limit free speech to examine any religion including Islam. People who criticise Islam and Muhammad may be wrong, but they must have the freedom to speak their minds without fear of getting killed. The best indicator of whether we are succeeding is to see how the minorities are treated in muslim countries. Historically and at present the minorities are treated worse than second class citizens. As long as the muslim countries treat their minorities as less than equals, we should know that they are still stuck in the middle ages and we need to keep our guard up.

@ARKNS:

It is obvious that you think of the "Muslims" as the other. This world is increasingly small and in reality it is impossible to wall off anyone off from others. When you don't have a democracy then you don't have political parties. Muslim countries do not have democracies and do not have developed political parties. Obviously you have not lived in muslim countries or very likely know many muslims. I have spent a life time in muslim countries and most of my family are still observant muslims. It is not a question of "every single Muslim" for you are condemning "Most" Muslims.

If you would have bothered reading Farhat Taj's article whose link I provided you would have read: "I would now draw the attention of the US to the Peshawar Declaration, a joint statement of political parties, civil society organisations, businessmen, doctors, lawyers, teachers, students, labourers and intellectuals, following a conference on December 12-13, 2009, in Peshawar. The declaration notes that if the people of the war-affected areas are satisfied with any counter-militancy strategy; it is drone attacks that they support the most. Some people in Waziristan compare drones with the Quran’s Ababeels — the holy sparrows sent by God to avenge Abraham, the intended conqueror of the Khana Kaaba." At least acknowledge that ordinary muslims are publicly praising the killing of the Jihadis via Drones and totally contradicting the official position of the Government that Drones are hated by the muslims. At least accept that these brave people are voicing this in the face of actual terrorists bombings and killings taking place around them in Peshawar on practically daily basis.

This journalist is clueless. I trained
with and lived with Middle Eastern Muslim Soldiers when I served in the war-time
US Military and have read The Koran twice,
and once again went thru the highlighted
areas I had marked out. I also double
majored in Psych & Phil and then graduated
a Federal Law Enforcment Academy. The
Prophet started out in life as a free-
lance mounted swordsman who hired himself
out to caravans as a security guard. He
was "a merc", as we would say now. Or, a
"private contractor". He got lucky and
married a rich trader's widow and moved
up. Then he personally led his followers
in battle against Infidels many times
and exhorted his followers "To Spread
Islam by Fire & Sword". My Muslim GI
buddies were very proud that The Prophet
was a "Great Warrior" and that Islam was
a "Warrior Path". Since right after WWII
we have been witnessing the 4th or 5th
Global Islamic Jihad, depending on which
history books you read. Muslims honored
Suliman as The Great Lion of Islam, they
honor their Great Leaders as Saracen
Blades and their Soldiers as Janissaries.
Islam has always been based upon The
Mid East, North African & Central Asian
"Desert Warrior Mystique". Don't pull my
chain, Mr Journalist. You're the ignorant
one here, not your readers.

Mr. Patel is clueless as always. It's not only Osama bin Laden, it's the demented hatred that streams out of almost every corner of the Muslim world. Hatred against Jews, Christians, gays, apostates, independent women, Hindus, you name it.

Islam does not need a face lift, Mr. Patel, Islam needs open-heart surgery.

So, all of the news reports about Muslim terrorism around the world is just bad PR? We infidels should ignore or disbelieve news reports? They are just prejudiced reports? I see. What we should believe is commentary that ignores the violence and intolerance actually perpetrated by Muslims and simply praises Muslims as good community organizers.

Please, these disingenuous discussions about religion are rather silly. This is not a religious issue, it is is primarily an ethnic divide. Personally, I don't care what you worship. However, there are certain behaviors, such as the recent "marriage" of a 12-year old girl to an 80-year old lecher in Saudia Arabia, that are beyond the pale. This is not a matter of religion, but fundamental issues of human dignity and human rights. I don't condemn this deplorable attempt to "save" the girls family from the shame of her sleeping with someone out of wedlock on religious grounds, but rather because it is so deliciously hypocritical. Really, let's not shame the family, but instead the whole nation or group (in this case Saudia Arabia -- which was, incidentally, the country of origin of the majority of 911 bombers) that condones such a base perversion. For God's, or Allah's sake, an 80-year old man who has three pre-pubescent wives already? I have a name for that: sexual predator.

Many religions, and ethnicities, use their peculiar world views and creeds as excuses to do atrocious things to other groups. This probably stems from conflicts over resources. Come to think of it, resource conflict isn't an old issue, now is it?

A Kafir:

You miss my point. I am not painting every Muslim with the same brush not am I bigoted. I am merely pointing out facts as they stand in the world. What is bigoted about that. You say that Muslims are trying to bring democracy. What will that achieve until the nature of the parities themselves change? In Pakistan, are the parties all that different among each other? I don't think so.

The true strength of democracy is measured by the plurality of views among the parties. In the United States, the Democratic and the Republican parties have quite different philosophies. In India, the sheer range of political views from extreme left to extreme right is amazing. I am not sure that kind of plurality of views exist in Islamic cultures. They do not and cannot think outside the box imposed by their religion. So minority rights have suffered. There is nothing bigoted about these facts. Also, in this blogs people draw some cultural tendencies and practices among the majority of Muslims, not among every single one of them. Just read the posts. I think the posts are basically correct and well balanced. The kafirs are all angry but they are rightly angry. They cite facts why they are angry. Now does that mean we accuse every single Muslim of these charges? No, we do not.

@YasserYusufi:

"Where is the confusion in the Surah you quoted about killing innocents being the most abhorrent crime and saving an innocent life being the most rewarding one? You said you’ve read the tafsir of Quran many times. Why didn’t you bother to put the context of the next Surah you quoted?

How many dissenters/spies have actually been executed by Iran?"

The confusion that you cannot get rid of is that Ayet 5.32 tells you that do not kill a human (except for murder or spreading mischief in the land)was told to the jews and they even disobeyed that. Do you see the constant and continuous hatred of the jews in the Quran? The jews are portrayed disobeying Allah all the time and spreading mischief on this earth. They are not allowed to have their own religion at all. The second verse is a continuation of the 5.32 and the punishment for "waging war against Allah and Muhammad" is given as death by crucifixion etc. What is waging war against Allah? Is a non-muslim who refuses to accept Allah as God waging war against Allah? Is a non-muslim who does not accept Muhammad as a prophet waging war against Muhammad? Read the commentaries of the Islamic scholars through the ages and they tell you that the only acceptable position for the non-muslims is to accept the superiority of Islam and the Muslims and to pay Jiziya with "humiliation" to show that they accept that subservient role, and if they do not then they should be killed. That is what your Quran 5.32 and 5.33 are saying and you want to tell the kaafirs that these verses means that Allah loves Mankind? Can you see the confusion now? Iranians have killed in the many hundreds under the provision of "waging war against Allah" since the revolution of 1979.

The real sad part is that muslims have killed more muslims than the number that the west has killed in the various wars in the muslim lands. How many muslims did saddam kill? How many Bangalis did the pakistani army kill (I know you being a pakistani will deny the millions that the Bangladeshi claim)? How many did Assad kill? How many iraqis did the iranians kill? How many kids did the mullahs of iran send through the mine fields fighting iraq? How many muslims have been killed by the jihadis in pakistan over the last 10 years in the sectarian warfare? How many muslims have been killed by the chechans? How many muslims have been killed in Darfur by other muslims? You see not once has the OIC or any muslim country ever condemed the killing of muslims by other muslims. Why? Think about it. Open your mind a little and think and read and see how many muslims have been killed by other muslims through out Islamic history?

US Christian Religions should look in the mirror before attack any other religion. We see the Church support the man who murdered Dr. Tiller. We see Priest who not only molest kids but have father children with woman of the church. We see Priest havingn sex with men. The Church supports torture of innocent Foreigne men/woman/children. Resently we've seen Christians stealing kids in Haiti for money. Rick Warren used the Oral Roberts trick of saying God wanted people to give him 1 million dollars by the end of the year. Those with no sin case the first stone and the US Christian Religions can't toss that first stone.

Um, hey, could it be because jihadis make NO EFFORT to hide the fact that THEY WANT US DEAD?? (Pick any "us," even muslims from other sects want to kill muslims with different views.) Add to that the fact that they try to do this often, and the large majority of muslims don't seem to have a problem with it? And even distribute candy and dance in the streets when jihadis achieve their goals?

And when was the last time Buddhists set out to kill Americans..... hmmmmm. I mean Buddists as *Buddhists*, not as part of say, the Viet Cong. When was the last time a Buddhist acted weirdly on your flight, wouldn't listen to the flight attendents, and ended up being escorted off by the FBI? Hmmmmm.

Its old, Eboo. Getting really, really old. Why do we have a negative view? Shouldn't one have a negative view of people who just want them DEAD???

Eyes open, NO SUBMISSION!

Could the difference in attitudes toward muslims and buddhists have anything to do with the number of suicide bombers associated with the respective religions? Could it have anything to do with the fanatic, screaming muslims who carry posters of old bearded men and burn our flag while the buddhists are peaceful?

Naaah, I'm sure it doesn't have anything to do with that at all. I guess we Americans are just plain racists as the muslims accuse us, even if muslims are not a race. Oh yes, and thanks for reminding us that Islam is "the religion of peace." For some reason, and I can't imagine why, it's easy to forget sometimes ...

Its wise to be on good behavior when you are a minority.

Still don't know the real Islam.

Here's is another example that Islam is not just in need of a face lift: as a few among 150,000 others, my family had to flee Iraq twice, in 1948 and then for good in 1951, for being Jewish. Period. No other reason. Also please check how the current version of the Koran refers to Jews: as "najas", a word that has no equivalent in English and means "unholy filth".

I am happy that there is still some opposition to the American way in the world. China will make the U.S. look like a dwarf in some years. Lift your own faces as long as you want but dont apply your dream to others.

Eboo, I know a few Muslims, and work alongside one I consider a friend every day - but you know what my picture is of Muslims and how they relate to the west? It is not OBL, it is not my friend at work, and it is not even his imam who, from my friend's struggles, seems to constantly speak against the government. I know that basing opinions on individual people can skew perception in any way.

My image, the one that is burned into my mind, is of all the Muslims celebrating and cheering when informed of the 9|11 attacks, of the mass celebration at the death of so many non Muslims. This was not one or two people skewing the perception, this was (and is) entire communities and traditions celebrating in the pain and suffering of those who don't believe what they do. This 'faith' is not a group of people who cherish all God created life, but a group who celebrate and participate in it's ending.

This cannot be fixed by a face lift of the religion, an entire culture change is needed, one that I fear will never happen.

Face lift is an artificial surgery. You just want Muslims to be like Buddhists (example you gave in your article) and stop killing civilians every day(and worshipping bin laden and other terrorists). So according to your article Muslims should stop being Muslims and be more like Buddhists. I will second that.

Islam is more a barbaric cult of violence than a religion. Any country that allows Muslim immigration invites trouble. They will not assimilate and barely conceal their contempt and anger as they wait for the day they can impose Shariah on their hosts.

Islam is a gutter 'religion' that glorifies death, violence, and the subjugation of women.

How is it that a little knowledge about Buddhism correlates with broadly positive feelings towards Buddhists, but a little knowledge about Islam is linked to frighteningly negative views of Muslims?

------------
Buddhists do not explode car bombs or fly planes into buildings. There, does that clear up the confusion ???

This column is a joke. I am a new Christian and have read this column several times. The articles I've read were nothing but antagonistic to the Christian faith.

Islam only needs a facelift among Islamophobes and the enormous Islamophobic propaganda machine flooding us with daily dosages of hate and lies about Islam. But that won't happen unless there is a heart-transplant first.

Islam needs a face-lift?!?
How about a soul-transplant!

S D Rodrian
http://islamisbad.com

.

hey i have a better theory. Buddhism enjoys relatively lower negative prejudice because its not waging a war on the west! Call it a hunch! No suicide bombers, hijackings, beheadings etc that require little more than 3 seconds to deliver their message. I have a good one that recently popped up in the news: "Turkish girl buried alive for talking to boys" http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArtVty.jhtml?sw=turkish+girl+buried&itemNo=1147823. That doesn't have much to do with Osama as the face of Islam.

Mr Patel,
Islam doesn't need a faeclift.
The west needs to stop ganging up on Islam, as has been going on since the crusades. Political Islam is a non-entity since the West combined forces to disintegrate the Ottoman empire after WWI. You can only kick someone so much even after they are dead. So, please tell the other side to stop kicking the guy who's almost dead, instead of telling the victim to have good manners or get a facelift instead.

Ehsan Jami, a former Muslim who lives in the Netherlands has made a short film entitled "An Interview With Muhammed." That film addresses some of the questions that the op-ed piece by Eboo Patel has brought up:

http://kleinverzet.blogspot.com/2008/12/interview-with-mohammed-now-online.html

Edward J. Cunningham
Rockville, MD

I am sure that the Pakistanis killed by Bin Laden, and the civilians killed by their car bombs are spurring other pakistani to hate islam.

no wait.

I am sure that the Pakistanis killed by American drone, and the civilians killed by their car bombs are spurring other pakistani to hate America.

yes, the latter is true, the former is false. I wonder why the dichotomy. Could it be that hate from within is excused while hate from without is not. Perhaps we would have a better society if hate from wherever was not excused. The number of muslims killed by their more islamic muslims is far greater than the number of muslims killed by the West. Then intolerance of muslims by their more islamic brothers is far greater than the muslims killed by the West.

Yet, the west is blamed for being unfair, inhuman, etc.

Islamic imperialism rides rampant wherever islam goes, yet western imperialism is the evil one.

Yet, the west is blamed.

Hinduism is the oldest extant religion in the world, yet muslims claim Hinduism doesn't have staying power, while islamist kill muslims and refuse to let them get education in universities while playing volleyball.

EP, You need to change the face of islam to the muslims. When they stop killing each other about the right way to be muslim (say by Sufi teachings), they might appear more tolerant to us infidels. You need to change the image of islam to the muslims in the middle east, say for examply, that they should demand democracy now in the name of allah (which, btw, the Malay muslims have shown is a name not a word).

So hitman and yussef can hate all Hindus, feel all Hindus hate muslims, though Muslims in India and America have more personal freedoms in those states than in most islamic countries.

But how will you change the face of islam if the muslims don't want to change it? When sect kills sect, men oppress women, children's minds are closed by their enforced lack of education, when the recurrence of polio in the world is due to islamists that refused to take a few drops of vaccine? How will you change the face of islam if you don't first hold up a clear mirror?

hariaum

All muslims are human, as humans they are the beloved of god. Just as all humans (Hindus, animists, pagans, christians, buddhists, atheists, communists...) are the beloved of God. We do not hate muslims.

All monoideologies, that claim that they are the one and only way to god that all men must follow, are the creations of men with greed in their hearts. These are to despised (regardless of scriptural origin). But, if the human insists on the execution of the ideology, that human suffers the karma of that choice. (not a koranic eternal damnation, but a karmic lesson plan from Tat Sat - the way it is.)

So let the muslims rise up and say to their brother islamists: there is no hated of god, there is no infidel, there is no jihad but the spiritual one, there is no right by birth to being an Imam or a king, there is no right of men over women... And then we infidels may well say: cool, thanks, welcome. I have met many a muslim that believes much of this, now belief has to be translated into governance.

hariaum

Mr Patel, you're wrong.

Islam doesn't need a facelift. People need more education about what Islam stands for. Osama Bin Laden need not represent the Islamic faith just as John Wayne Gacy, Jeffrey Dahmer, Adolf Hitler, and Pope Urban who called for mass slaughter during the first crusade need not represent christianity or Meir Kahane and Baruch Goldstein need not represent Judaism. Second, the entire media and the western society should stop ganging up on Islam which has been their goal since the first crusade. Third, I have heard Mr Rami several several times in person, and he seems to be a good individual, but you are clearly wrong when you say he is the most qualified or the best muslim to represent US Islam or Islam in general at present.

A little education can be dangerous. So please don't give your readers a little education. Give them more than that.

Islam doesn't deny Prophet Jesus or Prophet Moses.

It is deplorable to note total stigma against Islam.

Looks like every stupid person on earth is writing garbage in Eboo's column

"Its never too hard to whip up hate frenzy amongst the ignorant masses who usually follow propaganda like blind sheep."

Sure isn't - it's especially easy right after Friday prayer.
---------------------------------------------

Or right after you’ve taken your daily dose of Robertson, Buchanan, O Riley, Beck followed by the Ann Coulter Kool-aid~!

Patel, I will believe what you tell me when the majority of Muslims stand up and condemn Bin Laden publicly AND call on on all "moderate" Muslims to root him out and bring him to justice. Condemning acts of violence is not enough, Muslims are not going out and DOING anything about it. Like you, they say we are about peace and love, there are only few extremists. But I clearly remember the huge riots and violence Muslims all over the world participated in when certain cartoons were published. It was so bad the media is afraid to print anything bad about Islam and many pulled the cartoons due to the high number of death threats they got.

Islam needs a facelift?

No, it needs a beheading.

Kafir,

I cannot convince the person who has locked up his mind and denies even the most clearly spelled out words. Where is the confusion in the Surah you quoted about killing innocents being the most abhorrent crime and saving an innocent life being the most rewarding one? You said you’ve read the tafsir of Quran many times. Why didn’t you bother to put the context of the next Surah you quoted?

How many dissenters/spies have actually been executed by Iran? Every state has a responsibility toward safeguarding its populace. Ahmedinejad won the Iranian election in a landslide majority. Those few American backed people masquerading as pro democracy protestors cannot change the will of the people. The overwhelming majority of Iranians love the Islamic Revolution of Imam Khomeini. Find me one single poll that indicates otherwise. Don’t we know that CIA has invested billions to bring about a rebellion in Iran. They failed! So now they must try again through propaganda.

You keep posing as a humanist in your posts pinpointing bad things done by muslims. What don’t you speak out against the excesses committed against muslims. Your Indian government has killed more than 70,000 Kashmiris since the freedom movement started in 1989. What about those half a million dead Iraqi children murdered by Americans and Brits by not allowing even life saving drugs and powdered milk to enter Iraq. What about the dead in Iraq, Afghanistan, Gaza, Beirut, Chechneya and Bosnia. If you take off your hate islam glasses ever, you will see that all of Islam’s suicide bombings, beheadings, kidnappings etc don’t even equal a fraction of the terrorism that is directed by non-muslims against muslims.

What does the poll taken in Muslim countries state about Christians? Since Muslims appear to be very willing to burn & loot Christian's churches/homes, etc in Islamic countries, I'd venture a guess that Muslims don't like Christians much, if at all.

Where's that million Muslim march for peace we've been waiting for since 9/11?? Be afraid Americans, be very afraid!!

"Perhaps some education about the good parts of Islamic history and art would be in order."

Sure, I've got five minutes; go right ahead.

Don't confuse a religion with the people on which that religion is forced.

I wonder what the Islamic-invaded Europeans would have to say about Islam. I'll bet it wouldn't be nice. In America, the concept of "freedom of religion" was developed before all this global Islamic madness.

The founding fathers are spinning in their graves. They would also be astounded & disgusted at the sheer number of irresponsible people receiving public assistance. With the corporate thieves, the foreign invaders and the domestic deadbeats, it's just a matter of time...

It is simple. Everyone knows fundamentalist Christians. They are in just about ever town. When a fundamentalist Chrisitian does something horrific (murder, for instance) just about everyone can say to themselves "That person is a loony, and is not like the other fundamentalist Christians I know." He doesn't represent fundamentalist Christians to people, because they KNOW he is not the norm.

Many many people in the US don't know ANY Muslims. None. When they see a fundamentalist Muslim do horrific acts, it is very easy for those Americans to think "They are all evil. I don't know a single 'good' Muslim."

It is simply stupid to think that all Muslims are evil or terrorists. Blindly stupid. It is slightly more understandable, though, when you realize that the most xenophobic, small-town, buck-toothed Americans don't know any better.

There is no act that speaks of jealousy and hatred for others than blowing up a whole bunch of civilians in the name of your Allah- as Muslims seem to do every day (speaking negatively or even abusively on Islam on this board does not even come close).

And there is nothing more insulting than calling yourself an Islamic republic and openly insulting any non-Muslims who still happen to be living inside that country.

Perhaps some education about the good parts of Islamic history and art would be in order. The story of King Babar should be required reading for all high school students. Persian art should be part of the education of one's first art course.

During the days of 9/11 I saw Palestinian mothers dancing in the streets.
In Iran and elsewhere it's always Death to America, Death to this person or that person. Death to cartoonists.

Blowing up discos, attacking hotels full of tourists, blowing up trains, planes, and automobiles in other countries.

Conning young men into strapping on explosives and walking onto a bus or into a grocery store or a laundromat to kill people just trying to live their lives.
Beheading women in Saudi Arabia, burning women in Pakistan, mutilating genitals in Africa ... a neverending list of the most barbaric behavior ever committed by humanity throughout our common history.

Only the Muslims are doing this today, they will do it again tomorrow.

Once upon a time there were people in Islam who created ... well, here, the Book of Fixed Stars: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Fixed_Stars

What happened to Islam? Why is it so barbaric today? Certainly it is not the fault of the other religions.

Just painting a new face on it isn't going to do it Patel. You moderates are going to have to stop the barbarity. We don't owe you sh!t until you do, we do not owe you a positive view of your religion.

"Its never too hard to whip up hate frenzy amongst the ignorant masses who usually follow propaganda like blind sheep."

Sure isn't - it's especially easy right after Friday prayer.

--------------------------------------------

43% sounds really low.

Also, you can't treat terminal cancer or homicidal/suicidal psychoses with a facelift.

I am still trying to sort out the real Islam. Is it a religion of peace? I read articles claiming that Christians are being persecuted and encouraged to leave "Muslim countries." If that is true, then perhaps we should discriminate against Muslims in our immigration system and take care of Christians instead.

What is the real Muslim world?

Still puzzled.

"Facelift" is a most apt metaphor because it changes the appearance without changing the substance.

Patel should commission a survey of those of us who do know something about Islam; my guess is the favorable rating would be even lower.

Islam has always been a religion of violence. When the prophet was forced from Mecca he and his adherents buckled on the sword and began a series of wars butchering those who opposed the prophet.

This same pattern was repeated as Islam spread around the Mediterranean Basin. Those who opposed Islam were put to the sword. Those who succumb to the onslaught became slaves and second class citizens unless they converted to Islam.

Consider the Crusades; the Crusades were not an unprovoked war upon Islam but rather a plea from the Byzantine Empire for help from the West to defend themselves against Islam.

When the Muslims finally captured Constantinople, once the capitol of the Byzantine Empire, the Sultan commanded three days of pillage, rape, and enslavement of the population, because they dared to defy Islam.

Without leaders such as Charles Martel and nations such as the Hapsburg Empire all of Europe would have fallen to Islam.

This same belief and action continues to this day. On September 11 the Muslim world rejoiced when the Trade Center Towers were bombed. Although Muslim governments may have appeared sympathetic to America, the Muslim "street" celebrated this great Muslim victory throughout the Muslim World.

Bin Laden doesn't want to just drive Westerners from Saudi Arabia and the rest of the Muslim World. Rather he sees that as the first step in converting all mankind to Islam by force if necessary.

Even here in the US if Muslims should ever gain a majority we would see the end of the US Constitution and the imposition of Sharia.

Islam is nothing more than a combination of Arabian tribal religion, where black stones, never seen before in the Arabian Peninsula, were worshiped and Ebionitism, a Jewish-Christian religion. The latter religion was what Mohammad founded Islam upon.

Just the introduction of some guy by the name of some moderate Muslim like Rami Nashashibi by Iboo Patel is NOT going to whitewash the fundamental jihadist character of Islam.

Ever since its inception in seventh century, political arm of Islam has been waging a terrorist holy war against non-believers all over the world. Islamic jihadists have perpetrated innumerable massacres all over the world in the name of spreading the word of Koran. The world knows even if Iboo Patel does not, that Afghanistan was all Buddhist before Islamic invaders forcibly converted it to Islam.

The massacres perpetrated by Muslim invaders in India are unparalleled in history. In sheer numbers, they are bigger than the Jewish Holocaust, the Soviet Terror, the Japanese massacres of the Chinese during WWII, Mao’s devastations of the Chinese peasantry, the massacres of the Armenians by the Turks, or any of the other famous crimes against humanity of the 20th Century.

In the aftermath of the iIslamic nvasions, in the ancient cities of Varanasi, Mathura, Ujjain, Maheshwar, Jwalamukhi, and Dwarka, not one temple survived whole and intact. This is the equivalent of an army marching into Paris and Rome, Florence and Oxford, and razing their architectural treasures to the ground. It is an act beyond nihilism; it is outright negativism, a hatred of what is cultured and civilized.

In his book The Story of Civilization, famous historian Will Durant lamented the results of what he termed "probably the bloodiest story in history." Muslim invaders "broke and burned everything beautiful they came across in Hindustan," displaying, the resentment of the less developed warriors who felt intimidated in the encounter with "a more refined culture." The Muslim Sultans built mosques at the sites of torn down temples, and many Hindus were sold into slavery. As far as they were concerned, Hindus were kafirs, heathens, par excellence. They, and to a lesser extent the peaceful Buddhists, were, unlike Christians and Jews, not "of the book" but at the receiving end of Muhammad’s injunction against pagans: "Kill those who join other gods wherever you may find them."

The perpetrators of these massacres were not military thugs disobeying the ethical teachings of their religion, as the European crusaders in the Holy Land were, but were actually doing precisely what their religion taught. And one may note that Christianity has grown up and no longer preaches crusades. Islam has not. As has been well-documented, jihad has been preached from the official centers of Islam, not just the lunatic fringe.

@Arkns:"Great--then how is it that they never manage to get those things anywhere in the world. Point to me ONE Islamic country which truly practices secularism (such as minorities in positions of power) or democracy (with free and fair elections)."

There is no muslim country that is either secular or democratic truly. The closest to being that is perhaps Turkey at the moment but even there the treatment of the very tiny minority is atrocious.
However, it is incorrect to say that muslims as a people do not want democracy or secularism. That is a denial of what is going on in Iran, or in Pakistan, or in Indonesia, etc. Real people are dying to achieve modernity. Painting everyone with a broad brush and being bigoted will achieve nothing.

Yosufi says:
“Mughal's post below for reference to instances where Allah (SWT) talks about love for mankind. Chill out on that Arab Barbarism thing; try to look for the beam in your own eye!”

Those references to love in the Quran were not absolute but conditional. They all revolve around Mohammad and those who are willing to fight for his cause. You never hear a verse that says Allah loves women, for example, because women could not join Mohammad armies. Forget about Allah’s love for the “infidels. The whole cult was mobilized to give its prophet the wealth and power he sought. The fact that over a billion people can’t see through that even today is a tribute to the power of brainwashing.
As to the so-called “Arab Barbarism”, Arabs are not inherently bad people. It is the Muslim ideology that drove some of them to extreme acts of violence. There are many non-Muslim Arabs who are not associated with any of the violence that paint the front pages of newspapers all over the world. Many of them are themselves victims of the Muslim violence.

To all of the apologists for Islam, I have only one request! READ THE KORAN and then try to make the case that Islam is a peaceful and tolerant religion that is consistent with human rights and equality. LOTS OF LUCK IN YOUR IMPOSSIBLE TASK.

@yasseryousufi:

"So in the Quran muslims are asked to do good deeds and yes that includes serving other humans (go and look for tafseer of the Surah’s Mr. Mughal quoted). There’s a widely quoted Surah that says “If you killed one innocent human it’s as if you killed the whole mankind and if you saved the life one innocent being it is as if you have saved the entire mankind”. We have lots of stories from Prophet Muhammad’s life of mercy towards non muslims and its an obligation for all us muslims to follow Prophet Muhammad’s example."

Yasser I have read the Tafsirs for many a years and I have not found any that talks about serving other humans. There is about being good to other muslims but nothing on serving and absolutely nothing on being even kind to nonmuslims. Please show the many many hadiaths where Muhammad was good to non-muslims. There are one or two daef hadeeth about not being able to smell the perfume in heaven but not much more. There are a lot of claimed stories that muslims tell the kaafirs but without any hadiath references.

Now the Sura you reference to is
005.032
YUSUFALI: On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. Then although there came to them Our messengers with clear signs, yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land.
005.033
YUSUFALI: The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter;

You see "spreading mischeif in the land" and "fighting Allah and Muhammad" has been explained by Islamic scholars include those who voice opinions against Islam. Right now in Iran the dissenters are being labeled Moharrab (against Allah) and hanged to die.

I agree with Navin1. The reason Muslims get such a bad wrap is that the extremists produce videos and commentary about how they want to kill Westerners and showing it, while the non-extremists simply complain about how Islam has a negative image in Western eyes. They are so busy defending their good name that they forget that those who would do the West harm have a much better publicity machine. It's simple marketing. Al Qaeda tells us what they want to do and the non-extremists expect us to simply understand that they don't mean us harm. Actually, this column is a perfect example.

Like you said Eboo, when asked to name a Buddhist most Americans name the Dalai Lama. When was the last time he produced a video showing Buddhists cuttng of the heads of the unfaithful and exhorting his followers to kills Westerners?

The world would be a far happier place is there was NO religion at all - and yes, that includes Christianity, which teaches that it's ok to enslave your neighbors, sell your daughters, invalidate a marriage if the woman isn't a virgin - after executing her - and on and on. All these "holy" books were written when people still thought the Earth was flat, so why do people insist they have any value in the modern world? I am an atheist and I lead a purer life than many so-called religious people. I don't need a book to tell me how to lead a moral and conscientious life. More killing is done in the name of religion - whether defensive or offensive - than for any other reason.

There is nothing "puzzling" about 43% of Americans being "prejudiced" about Muslims.

How silly. Reverse the poll Patel. Take the poll in Iran or other major Islamic nation. I assure you 43% will be exceeded Mr. Patel.

As for Rami Nashashibi. He need not be an muslim to work for social justice, deliver a range of direct services, and cultivate the arts in urban communities. Atheists do this as welll.

And as for "meeting another face of Islam"? Why?

The Angry world of Islam will not change by your weak piece.

The media, simply reporting incidents, cannot be blamed for public prejudice due to the attitudes and actions of militant Muslims.

Without doubt, antipathy toward Islam, and Muslims as a people, is far more prevalent than is reported in any poll. Not just in the United States, but around the world. Many people will not publicly voice such prejudice.

If moderate Muslims were to stand up to the growing militancy of Islam, not in a shy way, perhaps non-Muslims would find some credibility in the claims of a gentler, humanitarian Islam. It is telling that they do not. One of their own scholars, Salman Rushdie, learned that lesson.

No one can disagree that Muslims ( and all others ) need to engage in positive lifestyle. More than 15000 Muslim MDs in the US and a contingent of volunteer Muslim doctors in Haiti are taking care of the sick right now. But Muslims have a right to request that they be left alone and not be asked to fight and finance wars for the colonial designs of the West (eg. Afghanistan against Russia, Pakistani soldiers in Iraq & Somalia, Turkey in NATO, Saudi money everywhere etc. );they be not dispossessed from their lands and resources (eg. oil)and their wealth be not transferred to Western banks via corrupt leaders supported by the West ( read Browning New York Times- 1/19/09 & 2/3/10).Ask not Muslims to give more to you , rather ask yourself when to stop taking from Muslims. New york Times reports this morning that India alone receives 15 billion dollars every year from Muslim lands for their supply of labor. And talking about the positive things, India yesterday successfully launched a nuclear capable missile able to reach half of the world away from New Delhi with the help of US supplied technology..

Without love the people perish.

Love is absent in political Islam. The Sufis could teach the Wahabists a thing or two about love.

Love your enemy and you defang them.

Christian militarism, political Islam, Han and Zionist nationalism will all implode. It is just a matter of time.

The greatest threat to mankind is ethno-nationalism dressed up as religion. Get a grip-- resource scarcity is driving the geostrategic re-mapping. It is a foot race.

The problem with Islam is that it is revenge filled and void of love of those not of them.

Had we loved and forgave the Wahabists and Salafis that attacked us on 9/11 (unfathomable) we would have begun to demonstrate the Truth.

Forgive us for we know not what we do.

Translation - lock and load for a loaf of bread.

I think we'd all be better off loving our neighbor as we love ourselves (think self perservation and then why...)

Selflessness my friend, there we begin.

Dear hitman2:
Yes, there are 1.7 Bn Muslims in this world. However, 1.5Bn of them are illiterate and never ventured beyond 25 miles of their homes. Their education level is – just madrassa schools, where the only thing they learn is to recite Koran from memory. Most do not understand the Arabic in which it is written. Most do not comprehend the sands of Arabia. Most have never seen a Camel. Most do not understand what they are reciting other than what their imams tell them what they need to know. I was in Indonesia on peace corps. A Muslim nation, no one I met there understands a single word in Arabic, the language of Islam. Leaving Islam, or even questioning it is punishable by death – often by beheading for males, and stoning to death for females. The mullahs can hand it out, and it will be done with glee in public. No police will stop it.

While it is perfectly all right for men to molest females of other faiths, it is forbidden for Muslim females to even touch other males. With the sanction to have as many wives as he wants, a man is free to produce as many children as his wives are capable of producing. Every family I know, there are at least 15 children per father. That’s why their brood keeps on multiplying at geometric scale. That’s why there are 1.7Bn of you, and you keep on growing. Again, most of these 1.7Bn live in slums and with no education whatsoever. That’s why you cannot change them or improve their minds. A closed mind is a death trap. That’s why you can get a healthy teenager to go out and blow himself up for 70 virgins. You know that. We all know that. Except that you don’t like to admit that. Right?

It is really, really hard not to stereotype Muslims and every day you read the proof in the news. What kind of religion is it that condones violence against women, their fellow co-religionists, and we "unbelievers"? If it were just one or two isolated incidents it would be one thing, but it isn't--it happens all the time. Face it, Islam lives in the Middle Ages...this is like living in 15th Century Italy. Not all Muslims are terrorists, but the vast majority of terrorists are Muslims. You people have a very long way to go to join the modern day community of man.

And the worst thing is no Muslim is allowed to question any aspect of their religion. If anyone does, he/she will be branded a heretic and then off with the neck. You enter but you cannot get out. The price for just wanting to get out is also death. The whole cult/political system/"religion" is run Mafia style.

Islam is practiced by 1.7 billion Muslims.
A smear attempts by pesons such as Helocels1, Karfir, navin1 and clearthinking1 most of them hindu banias,transmitting their pains of hate and jealously. How you can change 1.7 billions minds with a smear compaign? and that too by hiding behind internet or by writing books by ghost names such as ibn waqqar or stupid like ali sina etc.
They practice this religion everyday everyhour, do you comprehend what it means.

Mr. Patel: You ain’t kidding. As a Muslim, you are compelled to defend your religion. But, please, please do not equate Islam with Buddhism. You are comparing crab-apple to apple. Mohammad was a murderer and a thief among other things, who talked to God while he was not otherwise engaged. Buddha was the most humanitarian who never harmed a single living thing less alone a human. You do not hear about Buddhists blowing themselves up in a crowd to please their God. While every day, dozens of devout Muslims do just that to reach Allah, and the virgins. So, you can cut this crap trying to impress the rest of us about how mis-understood your great faith is. We understand it perfectly; you are the one with the problem. Why don’t you and your islamic leaders go on a real jihad to re-write your Koran and your Friday sermons to re-educate your people about everyone’s civil rights, say - life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, instead of trying to impress us with your barrage of nonsense on WPO? It ain't going to be easy nor pretty. It's either this, or you can remain under your rock to crawl out once in a while complaining how much it hurts to be despised by everyone else. Good luck.

Dear A Kafir:

You say that there are many, many examples of Muslims who want democracy and secularism that even in Pakistan they want these things for their children. Great--then how is it that they never manage to get those things anywhere in the world. Point to me ONE Islamic country which truly practices secularism (such as minorities in positions of power) or democracy (with free and fair elections). I am hard pressed to come up with just ONE such country. Their bastion of Sunni religion and culture--Saudi Arabia--is a barbaric state living in the Middle Ages. Their other bastion of Shia faith--Iran--well we all know what those mullahs are up to. Let's forget about these two--even Indonesia and Turkey--examples of Islamic liberalism that Muslims love to uphold--are a far cry from true democracy or secularism. In Turkey, it is impossible to get a government job if you do not have a Muslim last name. In Indonesia, attacks against minorities are common and the courts cower against radical parties. So if we have all these liberal Muslims wanting democracy and secularism, how come they are not able to make their voices heard anywhere? The reason is simple--people get the government they want. I must remind you that in Pakistan, their love for democracy and secularism is so strong that they routinely let go the worst offenders against "infidels". Sorry, I don't buy your argument.

Islam denies Jesus. Therefore, it is a damnable lie. Islam is of the devil.

Eboo, your smarmy denial of the crimes committed by Islamic terroists is typical of the muslim community in general. The overwhelming silence of muslims regarding the atrocities committed in their name is a fact, not a media invention. Your piece suggests our negative perception of muslims is a branding error that needs to corrected by the marketing dept. Face reality - Islam is NOT a religion, it's a political system.

Poor, misunderstood Islam. The usual whining Muslims, heaping blame on everyone else for not understanding their glorious religion. The problem is, we understand it all too well.

The Holy Quran is as relevent today as it was 1400 years ago.

Yup, toilet paper in book form. Handy for camping.

One out of a few million?

awabnavi and those who think like awabnavi(because,same sample being given by some posters over and over again)

Pol Pot was a Communist(Red Khmer).Pol Pot did in the name of Communism,not Buddhism.Pol Pot never said *I'm doing for Buddhism*
But,Osama and his followers in all over the world are always saying *we are doing our actions in the name of islam* or *we are fighting to promote islam*
There is Big Difference between two cases.

Correction:Invasion,wrongly written as invesion in my last post.
Correct sentence:Umayyad invasion in Spain shouldnt be labelled as Golden Age.

This columnist needs to read headlines and take his meds. Wash Post you are out to lunch to even publish such lunacy on line.
Please answer this question. Why is it only Muslims are trying to blowing up planes? Where are the Buddist terrorists?

"Here's my theory. "

Is this columnist living under a rock? He wonders why people have feelings towards Buddhists and don't like Muslims?

Seriously?

I mean he gets close to the answer talking about Osama Bin Ladin, but then he jumps away like that was merely bad spin by the press.

If he wants to see the answer, look in the mirror. A failure to acknowledge the problems being created by Muslims and no accountability by the mosques is the answer.

What can't the local imams get together and take a strong stand that these guys who shoot up army bases, blow up buildings, run planes into building, blow themselves up is wrong, teach their followers that it's wrong, actively stop this sort of subculture within their ranks.

You can't have it both ways here. Right now, you're either part of the solution or part of the problem.

eboo said "Ask folks to name a famous Buddhist and they'll say the Dalai Lama. Ask them about a famous Muslim and what name comes to mind? You got it. Public enemy number one: Osama bin Laden."

I actually think the percentage of people holding a negative of islam is far too low, and this is the reason.

If you as a Buddhist who they look up to, they'll tell you the Dalai Lama. Ask a muzlum who they look up to and you got it. Public enemy number one: Osama bin Laden."

Imagine no religion...All religions have a dark side, fanatics who think they hold the truth and use their Holy Books to back them up. However, that said, I would also appreciate more media coverage of prominent Muslims coming out against the terrible treatment of women, use of terrorism, and such in the world. Believers in Islam need to present the progressive face of their faith more often or most will continue to view Islam with prejudice.

Ha, ha. Any criticism of Islam is seen as hate speech and have Muslims and secularists calling for censorship by media before those comments are published. Remind me of Nazi era.

Meanwhile Muslims are free to spew their hate venom on Jews/ Hindus. Not only that they regularly massacre them, along with Americans, of course (9/11).

Like the New York Times and other publications, I believe the Washington Post should be revewing the content of these comments before they are published and if they do, the Post should do a better job. I'm all for freedom of speech, but some of these comments are way out of line. Thank you Dr. Patel for your insights.

What a crock that some Muslims write. Mohammed was a murderer, child molester, deceiver and robber among other "professions". His religion very much follows in his footsteps. When you strip out the God part, Islam looks a lot like Nazism.

How is it that a little knowledge about Buddhism correlates with broadly positive feelings towards Buddhists, but a little knowledge about Islam is linked to frighteningly negative views of Muslims?
=============

Although a few radicals are responsible for giving Islam a black eye, billions of Muslims who "follow the teachings of peace and love Islam" refuse to do anything to take back their hijacked religion.

The only time we hear the Muslim community speak out against the radicals is AFTER they commit an atrocity - and that is more out of self-preservation than to denounce the radicals.

One has to presume the silent majority who allow radicals to overshadow the true teachings of Islam are dominated by the radicals or quietly support the radical philosophy.

It is the quiet majority who are the true threat because no one knows who they really are, or when they will become a weapon for the radicals.

Until the followers of the Islam of Peace and Love stand up and publicly renounce the radicals, it is not unreasonable to presume they are not our friends.

Well, as a moderate muslim who respect all religions and after I travelled to the region of the middle east spesifically state of Qatar and after I saw how muslims treat each other and how they treat their women, I have so much doubts about this religion and I am thinking seriously to change to christianity as a religion of peace, believe me you have no idea how this culture and religion work in the real world in the middle east until you live their and see for your self.

Muslim integration into our society is much more further along than in many other places and consequently being Muslim is not as important as being American. Having said that never forget that religious intolerance was a major factor in the pursuit of our independence and the creation of our country. At those times when being Muslim is a higher duty than being American and is used to justify killing attitudes will harden in a very negative way, and very quickly.

"The worst, most violent thing I ever saw a Buddhist do was set himself on fire to protest the war in Viet Nam. And I have to go back more than 40 years to find that." HMM! Have you ever heard of POL POT?

Posted by: awabnavi | February 7, 2010 4:18 AM

Read the first paragraph in this opinion: "Here's a puzzling finding from the recent Gallup Poll on the attitudes of Americans towards different religions."

I have heard of Pol Pot, but I never saw him. Did Pol Pot claim that his religion was the reason he did these things? Did he use it as the reason he killed all the people he did? Did he blow up airplanes in other people's countries? Did he promote the killing of apostates, infidels, and all the other things we see muslims doing today?

And lastly, are you trying to excuse the murder being committed by muslims today by pointing out a single murdering buddhist?

This is truly pathetic. This is the kind of thing someone does when they want to divert attention away from themselves, away from their interests. "Hey, we're not the only murdering scum on the planet, look at these other murders... how dare you notice our murdering ways without also noticing theirs ..."

Pathetic.

The problem is not with religion. The problem is with fanatics that hide behind religion to commit evil deeds. That has been the case for about 1,500 years. Christians have had fanatics much longer than Islam has had fanatics. Medieval Christians had their own form of Taliban - they were called Crusaders and roamed about Europe killing heretics long before they went to the Holy Land to take it away from Muslims and Jews (a heretic was anyone who had a different viewpoint than the crusader). They also burned people accused of being witches. People should put their own house in order before criticizing someone else's religion.

Spin it any way you want. Islam is a monster religion bent on world domination. Is anybody else hijacking planes and flying them into buildings. Every time I have to go through security at an airport, I think of the "religion of peace".

Kafir,

The Quran is a guide book where one can find references to every aspect of ones life. The Hadith and Prophet Muhammad’s life compliments whatever is written in the Quran and clarifies those things that are not clearly stated in the Quran. So in the Quran muslims are asked to do good deeds and yes that includes serving other humans (go and look for tafseer of the Surah’s Mr. Mughal quoted). There’s a widely quoted Surah that says “If you killed one innocent human it’s as if you killed the whole mankind and if you saved the life one innocent being it is as if you have saved the entire mankind”. We have lots of stories from Prophet Muhammad’s life of mercy towards non muslims and its an obligation for all us muslims to follow Prophet Muhammad’s example. There are also details of punishment in the Quran reserved for those (muslims and non muslims) who stray away from the righteous path as in those who kill innocents, commit rape/adultery, who defalcate etc. In that the Quran is no different from other religious books that are considered to have brought the message of God.

Wherever that paper is from, its obviously not a reliable one. Why couldn’t you find that story in a mainstream newspaper? There are too many false publications when it comes to Islam on the internet for haters like you to gobble up. The fact is that the case is being fought by very able lawyers and there is no way that Shazia’s murderer will escape punishment. You can bring your inherent hatred into it and condemn Islam for every crime committed by a muslim but that doesn’t change the facts.

@ARKNS

I thought you were gonna take on us muslims with your “Philosophical Points”. I see no response to my post yet?? Are you the news CCNL of this blog? All bluster no substance!

And you seriously need to take some history lessons. Muslims aren’t killing hindu’s in Kashmir, it’s the other way round. India illegally occupies Kashmir (according to UN resolutions) with the largest concentration of troops in the world. Mindanao has been illegally occupied by the Philppines. And you are OK with Tibetan’s seeking independence from the Chinese and not the Uyghurs? Aren’t those typical racist double standards? East Turkestan was never part of China traditionally. The UN and all other Human Rights Declarations allows occupied people to resist occupation. Why aren’t you OK when muslims resist their inhumane occupation.

"The worst, most violent thing I ever saw a Buddhist do was set himself on fire to protest the war in Viet Nam. And I have to go back more than 40 years to find that." HMM! Have you ever heard of POL POT?

Islam does have a figurehead - it is the Islamist in a ski mask holding an AK47. Islam has allowed the Islamists to define the narrative of Islam in the modern world. The majority of the Muslim world is at least sympathetic to this narrative because I suspect they see it as a way to break the Infidel hold on the real levers of power: economic, educational, political, technological, etc.

It is a vain hope that a discredited interpretation of the Quran will result ultimately world domination. They hope that people will be dense enought to believe what they say rather than what they do.

I suppose living in denial is a kind of faith.

To those saying Buddhists are not pushing violence upon the world where some Muslims do and therefore one is worse, please study Sri Lanka.

Alert islamist scum Patel, Buddhists aren't blowing up Buddhists and other people on a daily basis.
The Western countries that now have more muslims are so much better off now. In the bad old days, I don't know how I ever got through the Christmas holiday without an underwear bomber or shoe bomber on our planes. How our military prevailed in World War II without muslim officers/soldiers running around gunning down their fellow soldiers is beyond me. I just can't wait until we all have to come to a stop 5 times a day for islami wailing coming from minarets. Sharia law, fatwahs, etc have so much to offer Western civilization, so lets keep importing the religion of peace, beauty, and love. Muslim judicial concepts such as whipping rape VICTIMS and throwing them in jail are way ahead of our jurisprudence. And it is so cute how the islami pranksters are always trying to blow up something in the countries that take them in. Keep up the good work importing these treasures USA and western Europe.

Islamist scum like Patel are incapable of logic or rational thought. Tolerance of this islamist filth and its imported muslim brethren will be the death blow for what is now left of Western civilization.

Really, Mr. Patel, what planet do you live on? The worst, most violent thing I ever saw a Buddhist do was set himself on fire to protest the war in Viet Nam. And I have to go back more than 40 years to find that.

Every day, Muslims are blowing each other up in Iraq and Pakistan. This is when they aren't trying to kill people who *aren't* Muslim.

The metaphor you're using, the face lift - done to fight the affects of aging - it does nothing to change the underlying fact that the person with the face lift is still getting old.

A facelift for Islam is meaningless until the slaughter ends. Deal with that first.

@Mughal:
The problem for Muslims is as you clearly state: Allah loves those who behave like Muhammad.
Well the problem is as I stated earlier that Muhammad is a very violent and harsh personality. Muhammad beheaded people and is it a surprise that pious muslims behead Kaafirs and wave the Quran and shout Allah hu Akbar in front of video cameras these days. Muhammad married a little child. So an 80 year old can marry a 9 nine year old in many of the OIC countries today. Muhammad married his adopted son's wife and since then muslims cannot adopt children and raise them as their own. Muhammad raided and looted the Kaafirs; he tortured those who opposed him; he beheaded and put up the heads of his opponents in the desert. He went to war over 200 times to spread Islam in Arabia. And this is the Man that Allah says that he loves those who behave as Muhammad did.

Can you see the Problem?

Allah loves those who love him, do good deeds, who ask him for forgiveness, who purify themselves,who fear him, who are steadfast, who rely on him, who are just, who follow Muhammad's example, who are righteous,

@Mughal,

What is so special about loving someone who loves you, who does good deeds, who asks your forgiveness, who keeps himself 'pure', who relies on you, who is just, who does the 'right' thing? Even the worst tyrant in human history would have no problem with any of these conditions. So why is it such a big deal that Allah does it? Now you quote 2:143 and that is what it says:
002.143
YUSUFALI: Thus, have We made of you an Ummat justly balanced, that ye might be witnesses over the nations, and the Messenger a witness over yourselves; and We appointed the Qibla to which thou wast used, only to test those who followed the Messenger from those who would turn on their heels (From the Faith). Indeed it was (A change) momentous, except to those guided by Allah. And never would Allah Make your faith of no effect. For Allah is to all people Most surely full of kindness, Most Merciful.

Here Allah is saying that he has made the Muslims into an ummah and he changed the direction of prayer from Jerusalem to Mecca to divide Mankind into followers of Muhammad and the non-muslims. And then the Quran is filled with Allah warning and hating those who do not want to follow Muhammad. So tell me where is the love for Mankind? The perpetual division of Mankind into Muslims and the hated Kaafirs (non-muslims) is not love. Where is the love for the sinner? Where is the love for the lost soul? Where is the love for ignorant?

You quote 7:156 and here it is:
007.156
YUSUFALI: "And ordain for us that which is good, in this life and in the Hereafter: for we have turned unto Thee." He said: "With My punishment I visit whom I will; but My mercy extendeth to all things. That (mercy) I shall ordain for those who do right, and practise regular charity, and those who believe in Our signs;-

In this verse it is Musa (Moses) who is asking to ordain for the jews that which is good, and what does Allah say: "My punishment I visit whom I will". First scare with punishment and the punishments are certainly awful in Allah's hell. And then his mercy is reserved for those who beleive in his signs. Is this love for Mankind for you?

So tell again where is the love for Mankind that you think exists in the Quran? I suggest that you ask a christian or a buddhist or a sikh or a hindu about how their Deities Love Mankind and you might find a bit more subtle answer.

Associate Professor,

What you call Golden Age is bedouin invesion in Spain.Can Invesion Period be named as Golden Age ?

Islam/Submission is not only problem from Western(right word is Civilization) standpoint,but,from India,Africa,China and within muslim countries as well.Islam is problem in Pakistan,India indeed.
Umayyad Invesion in Spain shouldnt be labelled as Golden Age and shouldnt be flattered too much.

How is it that a little knowledge about Buddhism correlates with broadly positive feelings towards Buddhists, but a little knowledge about Islam is linked to frighteningly negative views of Muslims?

because Buddhists are not terrorists, and Muslims are, you stupid!

Who cares what war mongering Americans think?

The Empire must expand, violently, no matter the cost.

We must sacrifice education, health care, infrastructure, and common decency and humanity to ensure that every resource on the planet, no matter how obscure, and every ruler of every country is within our scope of influence and readily available for exploitation--either by bribery or by force--by the greedhead capitalist war mongers and profiteers.

We must ensure that nobody on the planet can resist our brutality, murder and mayhem. We will stop at nothing, NOTHING, to make the rest of the world conform to our needs, our greed, our way of life. We must "defend" that way of life no matter what.

RAH RAH RAH!!! USA! USA! USA! KILL KILL KILL!!!

Islam needs a facelift? More like it needs to be wiped off the face of the Earth.... A false, violent, contradictory faith that preaches hatred, breeds terrorism and lacks moderation.

Re: Post by AKAFIR: 1)Mughal rambles without ever quoting the Quran....2)Show me where in the Quran Allah talks of love for mankind....3)I have studies Quran for yrs n there is no love in the Quran.

See here the Love in the Quran:
1. Allah loves those who love Him. 5:54Q
2. Allah loves those who do good deeds
2:195Q
3. Allah loves whose who ask Him for
forgiveness 2:222Q
4. Allah loves those who purify themselves
2:222Q
5. Allah loves those who God fearing 3:76Q
6. Allah loves those who are steadfast 3:146Q
7. Allah loves those who rely on Him 3:159
8. Allah loves those who act justly 5:42Q
9. Allah loves those who strive for His cause 61:4Q
10.Allah loves those who follow the Prophet's example 3:31Q
11. Verily, those who believe and do deeds of righteousness, the MOST GRACIOUS (Allah) will bestow LOVE for them (in the hearts of the believers). ch Mary 19:96Quran
12. And His the Most Forgiving and full of LOVE. 85:14Q
13. Ask pardon of your Lord and then turn unto Him. Lo! my Lord is Merciful and LOVING. 11:90Quran
14. MY MERCY COVER EVERYTHING. 7:156Q
15. And never would Allah make your faith of no effect. FOR GOD IS TO ALL MANKIND FULL OF PITY AND MOST MERCIFUL. 2:143Q

There are many more places in Quran the Love is mentioned. So Akafir my friend I can help you see and feel the Love of Allah n Love for all mankind. Love of God
All the great messengers came with the message of Love.
Jesus said Love thy neighbor
Mohammad said: If your neighbor is in discomfort due to your actions, your prayers will be of no use.

Mohammad A Mughal
Global Islamic Society for Peace n Love Inc. Florida (recently started education work)

The answer is right there; daily reports of intolerance, hatred, and unspeakable terror pracised by many Muslims all over the world. And we know it has to come from their source- quran; otherwise why would young Muslims be blowing themsleves up for 72 virgins?

Why are you so puzzled?

I don't recall Buddhist teachings including killing those different or who won't convert, or mistreating women and gays.

This is a no brainer.

@Arkns:
"Democracy and secularism are incompatible with Islam. Muslims have no concept of these things."

Democracy and secularism may be incompatible with Islam but many and I would say most muslims have a clear concept of these things and they want it for their children. You are confusing between Islam and muslims.
I give you links to couple of muslims writing in Pakistani newspapers and they clearly understand what is needed in this modern world. Condemning all Muslims is egregiously wrong. There are many many examples of very intelligent and good Muslims who understand the role of religion in the modern world and do not necessarily buy into the mindset of the jihadists.

Drone attacks : http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2010\02\06\story_6-2-2010_pg3_4

http://munirattaullah.com/default.aspx

Dear Daniel12:

I loved reading your post. It is right on the mark. Please read my post. I gave examples from across the world. These are facts that no Muslim can deny. And we cannot spread democracy in Iraq, Afghanistan, or any other Muslim country. Democracy and secularism are incompatible with Islam. Muslims have no concept of these things.

@YasserYousufi:
"Or read Mr. Mughal's post below for reference to instances where Allah (SWT) talks about love for mankind"

Mughal rambles without ever quotng the Quran and he even mangels the hadiath he gives. As someone pointed out his Global Islamic Society for Peace n Love does not even exist. So why don't you show where in the Quran Allah talks about his love for mankind. I have studied the Quran for years and there is no love in the Quran.
You are quite parochial obviously with a hindu around every corner and behind every post. But then Islam does engender paranoia in most believers.
The paper is not indian but from italy. And the news is not that the leading Lawyer tortured and murdered the poor girl but that the Lawyers of Lahore are threatening to burn anyone daring to represent the christians. Yes it was all over the news .. just as the bombing and killing of Shias in Karachi has been in the news for the last few days. Again the love in Islam is evident in the news from the Islamic world.

Eboo's point is pathetic. The point is Muslims are finding it difficult to live with others across the world. They are fighting against the Hindus in Kashmir saying they want a separate country or align with Pakistan. Muslims are also fighting against the Philippines because they want to separate. They are also fighting in Thailand for the same reason. Then of course, there is Russia where the Chechnya wants to separate. The Muslim Ughurs are fighting against China. All I can say is that if you are fighting against one, I can give you the benefit of the doubt. But if you are fighting against the whole world, the problem is not with the world, the problem is with you and your religion, your thinking and your way of looking at the world. May be the mullahs here have not thought of that. Then Eboo wonders why Muslims get a bad name? Is this fellow serious? The Koran recommends that when Muslims are in a majority, they should form their own country to be ruled under the Sharia. What a wonderful recommendation for living peacefully with the rest of humanity! I don't care which God said it OK? It's pretty stupid.

The problem with Islam that Western people do not understand is that Islam although called religion is more political philosophy than religion. Islam is identical with laws and we can see in the great Islamic writers of the Golden age--writers such as Averroes--that in defending philosophy or another religion with respect to Islam one must reconcile such philosophy or religion with the laws of Islam.

This is why Islam is such a problem from the Western standpoint. It is political philosophy rather than religion in conflict with the West. Political philosophy by divine creation. This means that Islam cannot possibly be reconciled to democracy--democracy is a completely other political philosophy. A religion such as Christianity is compatible with democracy (admittedly only to a degree) because Christianity is not so much political philosophy as dogma and the need to believe in such, such as the belief in Christ as the savior.

And it must be added that precisely the terrorists are the true Islamic people because they seek to impose Sharia law everywhere, seek the clear laws of Islam--the political philosophy which it is under the guise of religion--to be imposed on all people. Islam cannot be Islam apart from the laws of Islam. The laws of Islam are more foundational and identical to it than the ten commandments are to Christianity.

We are not speaking of a religion that can flourish within democracy or any other political structure but a political philosophy which intrudes on any other type of society. This is why Islam is such a problem everywhere. And why we have the face of men such as Bin Laden as representative of Islam. Bin Laden knows Islam is political philosophy and seeks to realize such philosophy. The religious leaders of all other religions make no pretense to political philosophy. Their religions are not equivalent to such. They are honored and they and their religions can exist in any political structure which allows them without harming the structure to the degree Islam does. Islam is incompatible with any other political philosophy than its own laws. It will contine to be a problem until its laws go. But that will also be the end of it as a religion.

Kafir,

I've been around these blogs long enough to know all hindus who go around with their fake ID's. I think most of your hatred is directed towards us because we've ruled you for so long.

The fact that Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism etc. couldn't stand the test of time has no bearing on us. The Holy Quran is as relevent today as it was 1400 years ago. All religions have their share of terrorists, including hinduism. If you got half your brain left, pick up the real Quran and read it for yourself not some excerpts taken out of context from some hae islam websites. Or read Mr. Mughal's post below for reference to instances where Allah (SWT) talks about love for mankind. Chill out on that Arab Barbarism thing, try to look for the beam in your own eye!

And FYI, these fake Indian websites you quote fools no one. Shazia Masih, a dirt poor girl working in the house of a high profile lawyer was the biggest news in Pakistan for atleast 2 weeks. Her employer is behind bars and has been charged with the murder of the girl, so whats your point. And pray tell how the hell does Islam come in all this issue. Are you trying to say that every crime that happens in a muslim country has something to do with Islam? Do all those under age sex workers in India exist because of Hinduism?

The love in Islam is so so evident in Pakistan these days. Eboo, this the reason why people around the world no longer believe the lies of Islam.

http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Lahore,-Muslim-lawyers-will-burn-alive-anyone-who-defends-murdered-12-year-old-Christian-17559.html

Lahore, Muslim lawyers will "burn alive" anyone who defends murdered 12 year old Christian
by Fareed Khan
No lawyer comes forward to defend Shazia Bashir, the servant girl murdered by her employer. The powerful association of lawyers in Lahore, arrayed in defence of the murderer, launches death threats and prevents access to the Court. ....

@YasserYousufi:

You called me a hindu as well. Why do you call Arkns a hindu? Why are Pakistani Muslims so obsessed that they call anyone they disagree with a hindu?

Do you understand that all religions, christianity, judaism, hinduism, buddhism, sikhism, etc. change with time because none claim that their scriptures are the literal word of God. They discard and reinterpret their religions as man's knowledge increases. Except Islam. Muslims are stuck with the Quran and take pride in that not one dot can change because it is the literal word of Allah. And anyone with half a brain can easily see that the Quran is stuck with the knowledge of the 7th century and as people learn more it becomes more and more obvious that the Quran represents what man knew 1400 years ago. Is it surprising then that the muslims trying to live by its rules appear as barbaric as the 7th century arabs?

"I THEREFORE TOTALLY REJECT THE ISLAMIC PHILOSOPHY. IT MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE TO ME. THIS IS A PHILOSOPHICAL POINT ON WHICH I CAN ARGUE AND WIN AGAINST THE MOST LEARNED MULLAH YOU CAN FIND."

Dear Crazy Hindu!

Its a bit rich for Hindus to come here with their equality of mankind crap. What do you say about the status of women in hinduism? Which religion asks women to burn themselves if their husband dies? Which religion asks a widow to never wear colorfull clothes once her husband dies. The Brahmin amongst you would kill an untouchable if he as much as touches an upper caste hindu. They cant cross your paths, shake hands with you, go to your temples. Why dont you round up that racist thug Bal Thackeray and take him to the nearest Police Station? Frankly, hindus are by far the most racist people on the face of the earth. I can prove that against the most learned hindu pandit you can find me~!

Rejoinder to Mr. Mungal

Loving God means you love his infinite diversity. You are completely indifferent between His different manifestations. A fellow Jew, a Hindu, a Christian, is as dear to you as a fellow Sunni. You do not see any difference between animals. They are no "dirty" animals either as there are no infidels. Nothing is outside God because God is infinite. IT IS COMPLETELY FALSE TO CLAIM TO LOVE HIM BUT AT THE SAME TIME DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN HIS INFINITE MANIFESTATIONS. WHEN YOU CAN SHOUT FROM THE TOP OF A ROOF THAT YOU LOVE A INFIDEL AS MUCH AS YOUR FELLOW SUNNI, THEN YOU CAN TRULY CLAIM TO LOVE GOD. I THEREFORE TOTALLY REJECT THE ISLAMIC PHILOSOPHY. IT MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE TO ME. THIS IS A PHILOSOPHICAL POINT ON WHICH I CAN ARGUE AND WIN AGAINST THE MOST LEARNED MULLAH YOU CAN FIND.

The problem I have with the Muslim world is this: they talk about Allah in every breath--Allah hu Akbar, Allah this and Allah that. Then in the very same breath, Muslims also vent their anger against all and sundry. They see themselves as separate from the rest of humanity. So this division has been created in their minds. If someone draws a cartoon of Prophet Muhammad, Muslims become violent. Where is the tolerance? Osama Bin Laden is considered to be a hero in the Muslim world. If Muslims love humanity why don't they hand over that evil character to the nearest police station? So just saying something does not make it so. If you say you love humanity then show through your actions. Forswear terrorism, recognize the right of Israel to exist, stop supporting terrorists. And get rid of hate mongering mullahs. Separate your religion from affairs of the state. Recognize and grant minority rights. Follow and defend secular principles. No, Muslims have a long, long way to go. And strike out all intolerant and contradictory passages from the Koran. Remember, EVEN GOD HAS TO MAKE SENSE. NOT JUST NOW BUT FOR ALL TIME. HIS WORDS MUST BE UNIVERSAL TRUTHS CLEAR AS DAY AND NOT SUBJECT TO MISINTERPRETATION.

From Google: "No results found for "Global Islamic Society for Peace n Love".

As noted previously:

Until the Koran's passages that call for world domination, female oppression and death to all apostates and infidels are deleted, no non-Muslim would ever think about opening a copy of the Koran.

Hopefully someday soon, we will hear GISPL786, Mr. Rami and Mr. Patel demand these deletions.

Case in point:

"Fri, Feb. 5, 2010

Blasts kill 40 at height of Iraq Shiite pilgrimage

The Associated Press

BAGHDAD - Twin car bombs tore through a crowd of Shiite pilgrims packing a highway as they walked to a holy city south of Baghdad on Friday for a major religious observance, killing at least 40 people and wounding 154 others, Iraqi officials said.
It was the third deadly bombing this week hitting the ceremony in which hundreds of thousands of Shiites have been converging on the city of Karbala. Friday's attack struck during the culmination of the pilgrimage.
"

Re: One of the fundamental disagreement with muslims n Islam is that you cannot love God without loving mankind. Loving God is very difficult.

I am a spiritual muslims who is focused on the Islamic Path of Loving God n His creations. So I am saying this from experience n not from Theory. LOVING GOD IS AS EASY AS BREATHING. GOD HAS PROMISED HE WILL MAKE lOVE SO EASY IF ONLY ONE IS INTERESTED.

Prophet Muhammad says; On the day of judgement there will be people who will have prayed too much but God will say to them you did not care for me. They will say we prayed to to day n night. God will say remember one poor person came to your door for food n you rejected him but I was with him. You didn't care for Me. There was one who came to you for clothing. I was with him but you didn't care for Me. there was one who needed shelter I was with him but you didn't pay attention you were too busy in praying.

In Quran, there is God's attribute Al-Wadud which is Loving, Love, Source of all Love. Actually is more than the word love.
God says He will create Love in those who pray worship Him alone and Do Good Deeds.

So when one Loves God, He CREATES LOVE IN THE HEART OF THAT PERSON FOR LOVE OF MANKIND. Islam teaches to love people because of WHO IS THEIR MAKER N CREATOR.
WE SHOULD ALWAYS LOOK FOR SOMETHING GOOD IN THE OTHER PERSON. MAYBE SMILE, MAYBE SILENCE, MAYBE HUMILITY,
JESUS was once going along with his students, they passed by a dump n students said O! look at the caricature of a donkey so ugly. JESUS said but look how beautiful Teeth He got. Islam teaches when You Love God, He will create love in our hearts for the neighbor or all humanity. I deal with Christian people, Jewish people, Hindu people, Buddhist people and the aeithiest.
I see who made this face, these eyes, those hair, that is GOD ALLAH YEHWEH call what you may. So I forget their religion.
THAI IS NOT MY ACT. THAT IS FROM GOD
May God have Mercy on all of the humanity.

Mohammad A Mughal
Global Islamic Society for Peace n Love

One of the fundamental disagreement I have with Muslims and Islam in general is this feeling that one can love God without loving his creation. According to my book and my philosophy that is IMPOSSIBLE TO DO.

If one has not passed high school, how can he go to college? Grade 9 is loving yourself, Grade 10 loving your immediate family, Grade 11 loving your community, Grade 12 loving all, including those who do not belong to your community. If we have not passed these tests, it is foolish of us to say we love God. That's like a high school dropout saying he loves University! LOVING GOD IS VERY DIFFICULT.

So the next time you hear a Mullah, any of your political leaders, your political parties saying "Allah hu Akbar" (God is Great!) and then inciting you to hate "infidels" tell him/her to go to hell. You say THERE IS NO GOD BUT GOD. I SAY THERE IS NO GOD BUT MAN! Learn this before you practice anything else before you learn the Koran by heart. IF I HAVE TO CHOSE BETWEEN GOD AND MAN, I WILL FORSAKE GOD AND CHOSE MAN KNOWING FULLY WELL THAT TALKS ABOUT LOVING GOD WITHOUT LOVING ALL HIS CREATION IS LAUGHABLE!! It is like failing in school and wanting to go to University. These stupid mullahs need basic education. So love everything--dogs, cats, pigs, so-called "infidels", roads, bridges, buildings, trash cans, etc, etc....for only then can you love God.

WE ARE ALL BLOOD RELATIVES THRU ADAM N EVE

God says in Bible, if you will knock the door, it shall be opened. In Quran, it says: Those who strive towards God (Allah), doors will be opened for them (men/women).
In an earlier email I mentioned that, thru God Grace, I had the opportunity to meet Jesus and Moses and Muhammad. That was in visions.

Most of the debates and arguments are unwinable because if a Grade 1 student is arguing with the University student. They can never reach conclusion because of the difference of knowledge between them. When the Grade 1 student reaches University level, he will find out what the other student was talking about. That is what happens on these boards. But if the

Some people don't even believe in God. While the others have a regular communications thru prayer n different media. Some people don't believe in the next life or hereafter, while the others God has enabled them to experience things of the other life, like paradise or people who left the world. So how can they debate or argue. It is like someone telling Neil Armstrong I don't believe America can land anything on the round ball like moon.

So the key is to pray to God n serve fellow human beings n help others. Instead of negatives we focus on positives. Obey the laws. If anyone says negative things about Jesus, Moses or Muhammad or Buddha,
just by reading things, one day they will meet that person n find out that those fabricated things were not true. They will feel ashamed. Everything we say or do is captured in a invisible cd/dvd n one day person will have to see his own cd/dvd
God will say: "Read n watch your own book, today you are sufficient to judge your ownself." Quran. So if I see I did care for my neighbour's plight, my parents, brothers, sisters, daughters, sons, wife, grandparents, fellow human beings, or I hurt innocent. The innocent person will be there asking his right. What we will do then?
We can prosper, have nice houses, nice cars, everything nice but we should be nice to other people too regardless of their religion or no-religion because we are all blood-relatives thru ADAM N EVE.

Mohammad A Mughal

First of all I want to say God Bless America n I condemn terrorism.

I am a spiritual muslim. I believe muslim poet RUMI is more popular in America than Dalai Lama. You can see in any bookstore
I follow the path of love in Islam. Whatever a person wants from Bible, Torah n Quran, he can find it. If they want love they can find love, if they want the opposite. God guides people according to their intentions. I have a relationship with God, thru His grace not thru my own ability. Thru Grace of God I have met Jesus face to face, even though I am a muslim n Moses and Muhammad whom we consider the last msgnr of God. They had the same light n same msg.
With all due respect for Dalai Lama, he is a political n religious leader n not a spiritual leader. Because if he follow Buddha, he would not ask for Tibbet because Buddha left power n govt. He went to jungle. While with due respect Dalai Lama is going the opposite direction of Buddha. If he was a spiritual leader God could give him Tibbet on a silver platter.

Jesus said if you have faith like a mustard seed you can tell the mountain to move n it will move. God has given faith far bigger than the mustard seed.
Believe me there is not a single question which I request which I don't get answered from God.
Bottom Line: There is so much damages done by terrorism that now muslims have to work hard to do the positive and loving things
regardless of percentages.
Islam is surrender to God, it is never affected. It is the muslims who do wrongs and they get hated. Islam n God is always same. Someone dislikes Jesus, it does not AFFECT JESUS BEAUTY OR PLACE IN HEAVEN.
People have the right to dislike muslims but Islam is always pure the same message brought by Abraham, Moses, Jesus and finally Mohammad may God's peace n mercy be on all of them and on all of us.
May be world which started as one family can start behaving like one family again.

Mohammd A Mughal
Global Islamic Society for Peace n Love

Eboo, it is not Bin Laden that is the problem it is who Bin Laden emulates: it is Muhammad that your Quran declares to be the perfect man http://www.ummah.net/Al_adaab/muhammad/perfect_man.html

Now your perfect man had people who disagreed with him assassinated, he killed and tortured people who opposed him, he raped, he married a six year old and had sex with her when she was nine. Sharia to this day cannot have a lower age for marriage for girls because the example that perfect man set. That is why only last week a poor child of 10 married to an 80 year old in Saudi Arabia and her mother succumbed to pressure and withdrew their attempt to annul the marriage. As long as a culture will insist on calling that ruthless 7th century warlord as the perfect man, people within that culture will have problems living peacefully in this increasingly small world.

His Holiness the Dalai Lama works everyday to make sure to teach the core essence of Buddhism to the world and is in the public's face, on the internet, in the news, in blogs and etc. This is current and the most recent knowledge of Islam or even the questioning of what Islam is has just recently been generated due to Bin Laden and September 11th. It is sad that Islam has been associated with Bin Laden, but as a news reporter and a journalist, you should know that people and news always focus on what is most current and what impacts everyone the most. I am a Tibetan and emphasize with this article for it states one important point. American, Muslim,Tibetan, Chinese or African, gain knowledge before making general assumptions. I have met the best of Muslims in my short lifetimes and i have met the best Buddhists as well, but they are only the best in their interpretation of their religion and their practices which is both for the cause of peace in the world. As you can see by the response in comments to your article, it has ended up dividing people's opinion and brought out more problems. To minimize harm, i suggest you write a profile on Rami and his organization which is a wonderful organization by the way, i'm very familiar with IMAN. In doing so, you will adhere to people's curiosity and introduce a new perspective on Islam and Muslims in general. Forget the gallop pole, write what you know and we will listen.

Dalai Lama is Buddhist version of mujahadeen. Charlie Wilson’s War is still on.

Eboo,
You & most "moderate" muslims just don't get it. For example you write:

"He dedicates his life to lifting up and acting on the shared values of service and community building between Islam and America."

Islam is a religion, and America is a country - get it. We all see that Islam is a political religion - its more about politics and power than about sprituality and personal evolution.

That's why Buddhism is more liked and likeable. Everyone understands this intuitively.
Either Islam becomes something better than it has been by shedding its supremacist ideoogy and penchant for power and politics, or it will lose control (especially over women) in the modern world.

Islam, in particular the Koran, is in dire need to a major revision. As i always said, in my book--the Hindu-Buddhist tradition, EVEN GOD MUST MAKE SENSE. HE CANNOT SAY I AM GOD AND I CAN SAY WHATEVER I WANT. IN THAT SENSE, GOD IS LIMITED EVEN WHILE HE IS INFINITE. The problem with the Koran is that it is extremely intolerant with regard to non-Muslims and it preaches violence. Besides, it has a number of (pardon me) extremely stupid ideas such as dividing the world into "believers" and "non-believers" into the region of Islam (the faithful) and the infidels and so forth. This is extremely stupid ideas and there is no other way to put it. Until you stop dividing man and man, there will be no peace. This philosophy of intolerance and love of violence permeates relations among the Shia, Sunnis, Ahmadias, and other Muslim sects. They are intolerant of each other so much so that there are daily bombings and murder. I must therefore conclude that the religious texts must be thoroughly revised in favor of tolerance and peace. No, God does NOT have a license to say whatever He wants. What He says must uphold the sanctity of life and must promote tolerance of diversity. Differential treatment between the faithful and the "infidels" is a stupid idea. God or no God.

To quote Warren Buffett:
"It takes 20 years to build a reputation and five minutes to ruin it. If you think about that, you'll do things differently."

The bombings continue on a daily basis. Rami better get many Muslims to work with him on building the reputation of the religion because there are several members who are wrecking it constantly.

Until the Koran's passages that call for world domination, female oppression and death to all apostates and infidels are deleted, no non-Muslim would ever think about opening a copy of the Koran.

Hopefully someday soon, we will hear Mr. Rami and Mr. Patel demand these deletions.

Case in point:

"Fri, Feb. 5, 2010

Blasts kill 40 at height of Iraq Shiite pilgrimage

The Associated Press

BAGHDAD - Twin car bombs tore through a crowd of Shiite pilgrims packing a highway as they walked to a holy city south of Baghdad on Friday for a major religious observance, killing at least 40 people and wounding 154 others, Iraqi officials said.

It was the third deadly bombing this week hitting the ceremony in which hundreds of thousands of Shiites have been converging on the city of Karbala. Friday's attack struck during the culmination of the pilgrimage.
"

Good Point Eboo!

Its never too hard to whip up hate frenzy amongst the ignorant masses who usually follow propaganda like blind sheep. American are stuck too much in their Super Bowl's and Tea Parties to take out time and find about people who they hate just becoz their media asks them to hate.

Staying on the topic, another face of Islam could be the dervish like social worker of Pakistan; Abdul Sattar Edhi! How many Americans would know that he started with a sum capital of about $50 and today is running one of the biggest charity service in the world including the biggest private ambulance service according to Guinness. His organization recently donated 1 million dollars in releif efforts in Haiti. This kind of news probably doesnt titilate the muslim haters enough so it never gets reported over there and Osama continues to remain the face of Islam.

*Introduce them to another face of Islam*

How many faces of Islam ?
Which face in Afghanistan ?
Which face in Saudi Arabia(homeland of islam)
Which face in Iran Islamic Republic ?

If there are many faces of islam,how can one trust one of faces ?

Real solution around real problems(first,they shall not create problems) are Contemporary Values.
Problem(core issue) is not Knowledge about Islam/Submission.Americans,Indians,Europeans,Africans will not learn anything,but,muslims shall learn,yes,muslims shall learn Contemporary Values,Human Rights and Democracy.This is the best antidote.

"Only two percent of Americans say they have a great deal of knowledge about Buddhism, and 14 percent report feeling some prejudice towards Buddhists. Meanwhile, only three percent of Americans claim they have a great deal of knowledge about Islam, and yet 43 percent claim some prejudice towards Muslims."

Could it have something to with the fact that Buddhists generally do not fly airplanes into buildings or blow up embassies, hotels, clubs, markets, airplanes, etc.?

So, yet again, does one man stand for islam or does a history?

I am sure there were good Nazis. Do they stand for Naziism of the history?

The reason is that the muslims not attached to Bin Laden also want to destroy us. Thus far, we have not heard of any Buddhists trying to destroy our culture.

Could Mr. Rami go to Mr. Bin Laden and please explain to him that islam is a religion of peace and that Mr Rami, not Bin Laden, is the true face of islam before he tries to convince us that he is the true face. I am happy to take your example, but are the Afghanis, Saudis, Iranians, Egyptians, Turks, Malaysians, etc also willing to stop funding Al qaeda, etc.

hariaum