"The Cardinal agreed with Allen’s suggestion that that the atheism of Dawkins and Harris was “highly evangelical”

Oh well if the cardinal said it it surely must be true.

"Atheist clubs are springing up in American high schools, warns head of US Catholic bishops

By Damian Thompson
October 7th, 2009

A “triumphalistic, self-righteous atheism” inspired by the work of Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris is winning a following among American young people, leading to “atheist clubs” in high schools, according to Cardinal Francis George of Chicago.

The cardinal, who is President of the US Catholic Bishops’ Conference, says that unbelief among young people is more than a question of stopping going to church: it is part of a fashionable “new atheism” which is every bit as intolerant as Christian fundamentalism. He told John Allen of the National Catholic Reporter:

“In Chicago, we now have atheist clubs in high schools. We didn’t have those five years ago. Kids I would have confirmed in the eighth grade, by the time they’re sophomores in high school say they’re atheists. They don’t just stop going to church, they make a statement. I think that’s new. That’s perhaps a bit more like Europe.”

The Cardinal agreed with Allen’s suggestion that that the atheism of Dawkins and Harris was “highly evangelical”:

"It's an important question how atheists should organize"

I'm not of the opinion that atheists need to organize or form clubs or become a political force of any kind as a group. They should just be out, and not be censored by the taboo against criticism of religious faith. And when you dismiss that taboo, harsh criticism of most religious faith is an obvious course of action in my opinion.

"No matter how much noise atheists make they could never hope to match the deafening din of religious piety. For far too long atheists have not been vocal enough. This might have something to do with the fact that for millennia and millennia atheists were killed for speaking up."

It's also partly because it's hard to organize people around a common non-interest in a subject. There probably aren't .01% as many clubs of non-golfers as there are of golfers. I'm sure you could find many "Britney Spears Haters Clubs" on the internet, but I doubt they're terribly active among people with lives.

It's an important question how atheists should organize and what kinds of issues to take on beyond First Amendment ones. Because we do need a way to make the "We're only subjecting religious claims to the same scrutiny that social or political claims deserve" argument, without it being labeled hating the believers.

USAPDX

What makes you think that non practicing atheists would be reading this blog? Think much?

No matter how much noise atheists make they could never hope to match the deafening din of religious piety. For far too long atheists have not been vocal enough. This might have something to do with the fact that for millennia and millennia atheists were killed for speaking up.

AREYOUSAYING: If you do not believe in God or gods you are an atheist by definition. You can tell me to "bite you" as well, but it won't make you not an atheist. The only thing that will make you not an atheist is to state which god or gods you believe in.

To all the non practicing atheists, what are your views?

“And note, Muslim theocracies such as Iran and Pakistan have no tolerance for atheists.”
All those who call themselves Muslims have tolerance to none except to those whose beliefs are identical to theirs. Their intolerance is not limited to the” far” other but to the “kin” other who happens to have a somewhat variant point of view. That explains the bloody intra tribal wars since the time of the founder of their faith. Furthermore their intolerance is extreme in the sense that they believe “the other has no right to live”. That explains the planned indiscriminant slaughter of men, women and children as seen in New York in 2001 and seen daily in places like Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Nigeria, Darfur etc.

Again we come to save Mr. Patel and his fellow male Muslims who have been directed by the koran to enslave the world for Islam:

The Five Step Program for "Deflawing" Islam-

Using "The 77 Branches of Islamic "faith" a collection compiled by Imam Bayhaqi as a starting point. In it, he explains the essential virtues that reflect true "faith" (iman) through related Qur’anic verses and Prophetic sayings." i.e. a nice summary of the Koran and Islamic beliefs.

"1. Belief in Allah"

"aka as God, Yahweh, Zeus, Jehovah, Mother Nature, etc." should be added to your cleansing neurons.

"2. To believe that everything other than Allah was non-existent. Thereafter, Allah Most High created these things and subsequently they came into existence."

Evolution and the Big Bang or the "Gib Gnab" (when the universe starts to recycle) are more plausible and the "akas" for Allah should be included if you continue to be a "creationist".

"3. To believe in the existence of angels."

A major item for neuron cleansing.
Angels/devils are the mythical creations of ancient civilizations, e.g. Hittites, to explain/define natural events, contacts with their gods, big birds, sudden winds, protectors during the dark nights, etc.

No angelic thingies ever visited or talked to Mohammed, Jesus, Mary or Joseph or Joe Smith. Today we would classify angels as fairies and "tinker bells". Modern devils are classified as the demons of the demented.

"4. To believe that all the heavenly books that were sent to the different prophets are true. However, apart from the Quran, all other books are not valid anymore."
Another major item to delete. There are no books written in the spirit state of Heaven (if there is one) just as there are no angels to write/publish/distribute them. The koran, OT/torah, NT etc. are simply books written by humans for humans.

Prophets were invented by ancient scribes typically to keep the uneducated masses in line. Today we call them fortune tellers.
Prophecies are also invalidated by the natural/God/Allah gifts of Free Will and Future.

"5. To believe that all the prophets are true. However, we are commanded to follow the Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) alone."

Mohammed spent thirty days fasting in a hot cave before his first contact with Allah aka God etc. via angelic Gabriel.

Common sense demands a neuron deletion of #5. #5 is also the major source of Islamic violence i.e. turning Mohammed's "fast, hunger-driven" hallucinations into horrible reality for unbelievers.

Accept these five steps/"cleansers" and we guarantee a complete recovery from your Islamic ways!!!!

Mr. PATEL:

You and Greg EPSTEIN have lots of Audacity/Nerve to sound like an Expert in what an "ATHEIST" is nor what an "AGNOSTIC" is; yet cunningly trying to equate or put in the same league that deceptive, sel serving word, "SECULAR HUMANIST."

You are trying to get into HARVARD or ride Greg's cottails and then lodge your ISLAMIC self in a Jewish SECULAR HUMANIST contradictions or made-up, as be a Religion for some 20% Of America's Youth [Market-FOR-BOOK-Share].?

Note: Today; Your Leader, Mr. OBAMA, of the "Faith-Based Council" (Needs to be Obolished; and if not; will cause this Prez to be a Lame-Duck and will haunt you later or soon) just filed his TAXES and revealed that he made $ 4,000,000 off his Books alone?

Ahhhhhh, so You and Epstein are Laughing all the way to the Bank Too, like your "Faith-Based-Office" Leader? Ahhhhhh, So your tryin to be like Rick WARREN, aye? Or is it like Mr. Hitchens and Mr. Dawkins?

Mrs., IMMAM "TAYLOR" (An American Islamic Moderator Here) Should put-out a "FATWAH" on your Head, not only Rushdi!

Note: The "PEW" people are really just that, PEWEE and you and Greg are smelling like them. Your Mother should be ashamed of You. Because you should be embarrased. And Greg Epstein should be ZENilly kicked-out of Harvard for PLAGIARISM, Croaninism and for being infiltrated by a Pakistanian, Islamic Triple Agent!!! more!

I (WE) can prove this you Know!?

Much of the supposed atheist "aggression" is simply the overreaction of theists to even a hint of criticism of their faiths. Most people in the USA are used to treating religions with kids' gloves. Voicing criticism of skepticism of religion publicly automatically brands you as "agressive" or "shrill". But direct, open criticism of religion is exactly what the world needs in this age. Religion is an institution like any other and we will all be better off when we can treat it as such.

Secular Democracies (USA and the coalition of the willing), Athiests (Mongol Horde)and Commies (Maoists, Lenin, Stalin) they have all indulged in wholesale murder, rape and plunder of people. Its a really stupid argument that only thiests can be accused of all these misdemeanours!

WOuld someone please pay some attention to the scumbag YEAL!! He's begging for it :)

The fact remains that the koran demands that male Muslims (including Mr. Patel) should rule the world and they should use any means to do so.

This issue supersedes all other discussion and will do so until the koran is significantly changed and/or deleted all together.

And note, Muslim theocracies such as Iran and Pakistan have no tolerance for atheists.

Posted by: areyousaying "Do I qualify to be branded as an "atheist" for this? Do you find my beliefs "aggressive" as well?"
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For that single statement about jesus, no, that does not label you and atheist. However if you do not beilve in a god or gods, then regardless of how aggressive or not you are about your line of thinking, then yes, you are an atheist.

Unfortunately the early backlash and intolerrance from the religious communities pushed many atheists toward agressive stances sort of making them "evangelical and militant", which gave the rest of us a very bad name.

Posted by: schnauzer21

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I am far from being athiest. Bite me.

THEISM has been torturing, killing, violating, and punishing human beings for thousands of years, and historically with the cooperation of endless governments. NOW you cry when we've stood up and finally said, STOP! NOT ONE MORE TIME. Your doctrines and dogmas of ignorance are coming to an end.

When theists stop telling me I'm going to hell, I'll stop being aggressive.

I politely refuse your request that we athiests shut up and stay quiet. I also politely refuse your suggestion that we become a formally organized religion. The whole point of being an atheist is to have your Sundays (or Saturdays) to yourself. And while it is quite nice to help out, and I think everyone should try to do charity work, I don't think its up to the individual.

I don't think there is a really nice way of saying "sorry, we don't think you're gods exist at all." I think Hitchens and Dawkins serve there purpose quite well as being firebrands. If you read Dan Dennet's study on atheists in the clergy, you see that their books are read, and are helpful in letting people that not having religion is not as terrible as the religions make it seem, and that it can be a much more intellectually honest way of living.

Posted by: areyousaying "Do I qualify to be branded as an "atheist" for this? Do you find my beliefs "aggressive" as well?"
--------------------------
For that single statement about jesus, no, that does not label you and atheist. However if you do not beilve in a god or gods, then regardless of how aggressive or not you are about your line of thinking, then yes, you are an atheist.

Unfortunately the early backlash and intolerrance from the religious communities pushed many atheists toward agressive stances sort of making them "evangelical and militant", which gave the rest of us a very bad name.

The best way to deal with obnoxious atheism is to practice and advocate responsible Humanism, which can be defined as an "inclusive sensibility for our species, planet and lives."

That may sound simple, but there is a lot of tolerance in there, together with a mandate to deal with what we can, and must.

Junior philosophies like atheism will be supplanted by a sophisticated Humanism when we also come to embrace a world parliamentary system, to enable species governance, and to finally throw in our lot with our own kind.

At no point do we need to discuss the supernatural, however, before or against - it is the wall paper of the past.

Interesting how religious pundits and other who can't categorize those that don't fit into one religious box or an other as "athiests"

Although I believe Christ was the best teacher if one follows his words and discards all the other twisted scripture cherry-picking the "religious" so enjoy to make the case for whatever is their political agenda or by the fact that they are not in control of everyone else, I reject all of the Abrahamic religions for their intolerance, arrogance, ignorance and their my-way-or-the-highway stubbornness but believe in a common energy and intelligence that is us all.

Do I qualify to be branded as an "atheist" for this? Do you find my beliefs "aggressive" as well?

Yadda yadda yadda

I was just thinking about a similar subject the other day, and it occurred to me that even the most hardcore atheists and the most hardcore fundamentalist Christians could agree on at least one point... bringing down the hardcore fundamentalist Muslims! How's THAT for interfaith cooperation!

The fact remains that the koran demands that male Muslims (including Mr. Patel) should rule the world and they should use any means to do so.

This issue supersedes all other discussion and will do so until the koran is significantly changed and/or deleted all together.

The spate of atheist books came out earlier this decade because 9/11 proved to all the world that religion can be a bad thing. No one ever said values were, which is what we can agree on.

Religion = The Golden Rule + Traditions + Superstitions

If you put either of the latter two before the first, you're a religious extremist; if not, you can be interfaith.