Secular radicals

As noted previously, there are "bad apples" in all religions. Unfortunately, said "bad apples" are not always excommunicated and defrocked from these religions.

Examples:

"Friday, June 16, 1995

JDL member gets life term in bombing

by TOM TUGEND, Jewish Telegraphic Agency

LOS ANGELES -- A California court has sentenced to life in prison William Ross, who, together with the American-Israeli couple of Robert and Rochelle Manning, was charged in a 1980 mail-bomb killing.

The sentence closes a case that aroused strong emotions and protests among Orthodox and nationalist groups in Israel and Los Angeles and has dragged through the federal courts since 1988.

According to court testimony, Ross, a member of the Jewish Defense League, enlisted the Manning couple, also JDL members, during the 1970s to construct and mail a booby trap."

From Wikipedia:

"The 1994 Cave of the Patriarchs Massacre, in which dozens of Palestinians at prayer were massacred by a gunman in the West Bank city of Hebron, was perpetrated by a one-time JDL member who had emigrated from the United States, Baruch Goldstein.[10]"

On December 12, 2001, JDL leader Irv Rubin and JDL member Earl Krugel were charged with planning a terror attack against the office of Arab-American Congressman Darrell Issa, in the wake of the September 11 attacks.[26] The two also planned attacks on the King Fahd Mosque in Culver City, California.

Rubin claimed that he was innocent. On November 4, 2002, at the federal Metropolitan Detention Center in Los Angeles, California, Rubin slit his throat with a safety razor and jumped out of a third story window.[12][27] Rubin's suicide would be contested by his widow and the JDL, particularly after his co-defendant plead guilty to the charges and implicated Rubin in the plot.[12] On February 4, 2003, Earl Krugel plead guilty to conspiracy and weapons charges stemming from the terrorist plot, and was expected to serve up to 20 years in prison. The core of the evidence against Krugel and Rubin was in a number of conversations taped by an informant, Jewish pride activist Danny Gillis, who was hired by the men to plant the bombs but who turned to the FBI instead.[28][12] According to one tape, Krugel thought the attacks would serve as "a wakeup call" to Arabs.[12]

Krugel was subsequently killed in prison by another inmate, on November 4, 2005."

Below is part of a much longer list of one group of Nazi Priests, who tortured Serbian Orthodox, Jews, and Roma to death, stole what they had, and deposited the loot in Vatican Bank.

Last week, in an Appellate Court, the judge ruled that the survivors and heirs could not sue the Vatican since it is a SOVEREIGN NATION. (Scroll down for articles on this.)

If the VATICAN is a SOVEREIGN NATION (and, of course, it is, replete with UN representation), how can the RCC still benefit from NON-PROFIT STATUS
in the US?

* Nazi Catholic Ustashi clergy
A Small Sampling

Here follows an incomplete list of Croat Roman Catholic clergy members who were willing participants in the Ustaša regime of Ante Pavelic and its Holocaust aimed against the Eastern Orthodox Christians, Jews and Roma.

By the end of WW II, 1500 Croat Roman Catholic clergymen fled Europe in order to escape justice. These were Roman Catholic priests who murdered Serbs and Jews with their own hands, incited others to do so or took part in their forced conversions.

1. ABRUS, Fra IVAN: Active Ustaša and Franciscan priest.
2. ADAMCIK, Prof. BRUNO: Active Ustaša and Catholic priest.
3. ARSAMOVIC, Dr. ANTUN: Djakovo Catholic bishop. Decorated by Pavelic. Used scare and terror tactics to force Orthodox Serbs into conversion. Took over Serbian Orthodox churches in his jurisdictional area in the name of Catholic Church. He ordered the destruction of many Orthodox churches such as those in Bracevci, Major, Poucje, Depsin, Tenje, Dalj, Markusica, Kapelna, Kucanci, Budimci, Poganovci, Bijelo Brdo, Borovo Selo, Trpinje, Bobota, Pacetin, Brsadin, Cepin, Martinci Cepinski, Trnjani, Klokocevik, Topolje, and Brod na Savi. He followed the directives in the 'The Return to the Faith of our Fathers,' written and published by the Institute of St. Jeronim (St. Girolamo) in Zagreb which was under the direct control of Archbishop Stepinac.
4. ALAUPOVIC, MARKO: Catholic priest who was an active Ustaša and close associate of the bloodthirsty Archbishop Saric of Sarajevo.
5. ALAUPOVIC, ANTE: Catholic priest in New Sarajevo. Close friend and associate of Archbishop Saric and Jasenovac killer Max Luburich. Under his leadership, the property of the Serbian Cultural Society 'Prosveta' in Sarajevo was pillaged and destroyed. Very active Ustaša. Decorated by Fascist Ante Pavelic.
6. ALFIREVIC, ANTE: Catholic priest in Zagreb and active Ustaša.
7. ANDERLIC, Dr. VILKO: Catholic curate in Sotin and a very active Ustaša who used terror extensively to force Serbs to convert to Catholicism, threatening those that didn't with death.
8. ANIC, Fra SIME: Franciscan priest and very active Ustaša.
9. ANDJELOVIC, Fra ANDJEL: Catholic curate in Kraljevska Sutjeska. Very active Ustaša. Decorated by Fascist Ante Pavelic.
10. ANDRASEC, Fra DIONIZIJE: Franciscan priest who was a very active Ustaša and a close associate of Bishop Aksamovic. Personally went to Serbian churches, pillaging them, then setting them on fire. Used torture and terror to force Serbs to convert to Catholicism. Decorated by Fascist Ante Pavelic.

continued:

11. ANTIC, Don PETAR: Catholic priest who worked very closely with Fra Dr. Bilobrk, a curate in Metkovic who called on all Croats to use axes, hoes and scythes to slaughter Serbs rather than 'expensive' bullets.
12. ARBULIC, MIHO: Catholic curate in Mandaljen who was an active Ustaša and was decorated by Fascist Ante Pavelic.
13. ASTALOS, JOSIP: Catholic curate in Dalj and Osijek. Considered a Croatian intellectual. Participated in the sadistic tortures of Serbs in Dalj and Erdut. During the night, he arrested women, took them to a basement, and forced them to completely undress. Organized several Ustaša killing bands. Personally arrested the first 25 Serbs in Dalj, torturing them for several days, then killed them all. An extreme sadist. Decorated by Fascist Ante Pavelic.
14. BABIC, Fra AUGUSTIN: Franciscan priest who was an active Ustaša.
15. BABIN, Don MARTIN: Catholic curate in Bisk and an active Ustaša.
16. BADURINA Dr. TEODOR: Catholic priest and active Ustaša.
17. BAIER, VIRTOR: Catholic priest who used terror extensively to force Serbs to convert to Catholicism.
18. BAJIC, LEONARD: Fraciscan priest from Makarska. Active Ustaša who was decorated by Fascist Ante Pavelic.
19. BAKOTIN, JERRO: Catholic priest. Active Ustaša.
20. BARSIC, Dr. STJEPAN: Catholic priest and very active Ustaša. Was a trustee in Croatia of His Holiness, the Pope.

continued:

21. BAKULA, Fra ANTE: Croatian Catholic priest who organized the slaughter of several thousand Serbs during mid 1942. He personally participated in the slaughters in the county of Hrasno. Decorated by fascist Ante Pavelic.
22. BARULA, PETAR: Franciscan priest and active Ustaša.
23. BALICEVIC, DR. MARRO: Catholic curate who terrorized Serbs to force them to convert to Catholicism.
24. BALTIC, Fra VIKTOR: Franciscan priest in Ljubincic. Active Ustaša. Decorated by fascist Ante Pavelic.
25. BANDIC, Fra BRANRO: Franciscan priest in Derventa. Personally took a band of Ustaša killers to the Serbian village of Hrvacani where he had 120 Serbs arrested. All were taken to Banja Luka where they were tortured. All 120 were then

As ever, stories of the demise of religion (most recently, according to E.J. Dionne, because concern for the economy has superseded "culture war" issues) have proven to be exaggerated. Two days after E.J. wrote that epithet, an Islamic radical attempted to bring down a U.S. airliner on its approach to Detroit. And, three days ago, Brit Hume outraged the chattering classes with his suggestion that Tiger Woods should consider converting to Christianity. If religion took a holiday, it was exceedingly short.
----------------------------------------
A response to the topic: Deneen, your hubris is astonishing. Eugene James Dionne, at one point, had credibility as a liberal. That standing has been steadily eroding due to is support of Sen. Ben Nelson who stated (repeatedly) that he would not sign off on any health care legislation unacceptable to "the bishops."
Sen. Nelson, also (and not coincidentally), heavily funded by BIG PHARMA and BIG insurance, then accepted a bribe from Congress for his nonsupport.

This bribe was then rhetorically mangled by Eugene James who not-so-deftly tried to torture it into some sort of reform move.

"Credit," of course is due to Eugene, who stated that "as a Catholic," he shared Nelson's views--of depriving poor women of their right to choose?
-----------------------------------
Still on topic: The only "chatterer" I see at present is Deneen, who works for a Catholic institution heavily funded by the Saudi Arabians.

Patrick isn't an idiot, just writes like one from time to time.

Perhaps, if the United States recognized that one cannot logically declare the Vatican a foreign nation and offer the RCC tax exempt status, that the Vatican was not above the law and logic, people like Deneen would be just a wee bit less arrogant, less convinced of their own ah infallibility.

by "posts" I mean the random readers' responses to these blog entries, not the entries themselves...even if you don't agree with or respect the author, at least respond on topic.

The reason no one takes this blog seriously (or bothers to engage in actual intellectual debates with its authors) is this ridiculously irrelevant commentary. The Post needs to weed out posts that belong on some quack's blog, not on a reputable newspaper's online publication.

If the United States designates the Vatican a foreign nation and, therefore, immune to suits by US citizens, how can the RCC receive nonprofit status?

From Wikipedia with supporting references on their site:

"Alperin v. Vatican Bank is a class action suit by Holocaust survivors against the Vatican Bank ("Institute for Works of Religion") and Franciscan Order ("Order of Friars Minor") filed in San Francisco, California on November 15, 1999. The case was initially dismissed as a political question by the District Court for the Northern District of California in 2003, but was reinstated in part by the Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit in 2005. That ruling has attracted attention as a precedent at the intersection of the Alien Tort Claims Act (ATCA) and the Foreign Sovereign Immunities Act (FSIA).

The complaint against the Vatican Bank was dismissed in 2007 on the basis of sovereign immunity, but the case against the Franciscan Order continues as of 2009. According to Hart, "the case is extremely complicated and potentially massive, considering the large class spread across many countries".[1]

[edit] Later District Court rulings (2006-2009)

On June 15, 2006, Judge Elizabeth Laporte of the Northern District of California denied without prejudice the plaintiff's motion for jurisdictional discovery and granted in part the plaintiffs motion to provide materials pursuant to Federal Rules of Civil Procedure.[21] On December 27, 2007, Judge Maxine M. Chesney granted the Vatican Banks motion to dismiss the fourth amended complaint; this effectively ended the case against the Vatican Bank on the basis of sovereign immunity.[22]

On April 14, 2009, Judge Chesney granted a plaintiff's motion for leave to file a sixth amended complaint no later than May 1, 2009.[23] The sixth amendment complaint has been filed, naming the Franciscan Order as a defendant, but no longer the Vatican Bank.[5] On September 11, 2009, the District court dismissed the case against the Franciscans without prejudice on grounds of lack of federal jurisdiction and denied Plaintiffs' motion to amend the complaint on November 13, 2009. Plaintiffs have appealed this to the Ninth Circuit."

Like the JDL, there are "bad apples" in all religions. B16, unfortunately has not excommunicated the contemporay Nazi "bad apples" in the RCC. Just one more blow to the continuation of the RCC.

Added background on the Ustashe movement, or Ustashe Croatian Revolutionary Movement.

It was an ultra-nationalist organization founded in January 1929 in the Croatian capital Zagreb by Ante Pavelic. The Ustashe (from ustanak, an uprising) were a direct response to the establishment of a royal dictatorship by King Alexandar. Rejecting the moderate tactics of the Croatian Peasants Party, they demanded the destruction of the Yugoslav state and a greater Croatia that included all of Bosnia. Forced into exile, Pavelic's Ustashe forged closer ties with anti-Serbian Macedonian émigrés and in 1934 the two groups organized the assassination of King Alexandar in Marseilles.

The Ustashe opposed the Sporazum (agreement) of 1939 between the Yugoslav government and the Croat moderates, which granted Croatia autonomy. Their moment arrived on 6 April 1941, when Germany invaded Yugoslavia (see Yugoslavia in WW II). The Ustashe seized power in Croatia with Mussolini's support and proclaimed the Independent State of Croatia (Nezavisna Drzava Hrvatska, or NDH) with Pavelic as Poglavnik (dictator).

The Ustashe state was a dependency of the Axis powers. It introduced Nazi-style racial laws against Jews, gypsies, and Serbs, along with concentration camps, most infamously at Jasenovac. It exterminated most of the NDH's urban Jews and gypsies, but pogroms against Serbs, who made up 30 per cent of the NDH population, only fuelled a rural rebellion. From mid-1941 it confronted the pro-communist partisans led by Tito. The Partisans won support among many Croats after Pavelic conceded parts of Dalmatia to Italy in May 1941. After Tito entered Belgrade in November 1944 the NDH began to crumble and on 8 May 1945 Pavelic fled to Austria, eventually reaching Argentina.

After Croatia declared its independence from Yugoslavia in 1991, the Serb-led army justified its war against Croat independence as a struggle against a revived Ustashe, a claim the Croats naturally rebutted (see Yugoslavia (former), operations in).

Perhaps this 'Culture War' the author is trying to defend and cram reality into...

Is actually what's obsolete and ineffective at 'protecting' people, never mind getting anything else right.

The short article below by one of the world's most respected journalists (no exaggeration) will be followed by a report on the recent decision by a UNITED STATES Apellate Court, which affirmed the Vatican as a foreign nation, entitled to protection from a law suit by surviving Jewish, Christian Orthodox, and Roma and their heirs.

That would be survivors of 200 Nazi Priests (names to follow), who owned and operated death camps, tortured victims to death, stole what they had, deposited the loot in Vatican Bank, where it resides.

On a positive note, Italy appears to be developing cojones, and has announced that it is looking into investigating irregularities in Vatican Bank.

Following this hideous affair, which will end in a Supreme Court request, there will be links with photographs of current Priest Nazis, the notorious Rat Lines, the facts about Pope Benedict and the Hitler Youth (that would be FACTS).

Finally, an appeal is in motion for the Vatican to start assuming financial and other responsibilites for guarding Catholic holy sites, which Jews have died protecting.

This appeal will not only call for funds but also for men to be on the ready for the next attack. I will blog on this as it takes shape.

Post-finally, a request to the United Nations that the Vatican be pressured to release its WW II archive is in the works, but I"ll believe it when I see it.

If and when I do, I'll report on it here, of course.

Right here.

Tied up in the Rat Lines
By Yossi Melman

It is possible that within a short time a court in the United States will prohibit the publication of the account before us. In the meantime, Haaretz has obtained the testimony given last month by William Gowen, a former intelligence officer in the United States Army, at a federal court in San Francisco. The testimony contains historical and political explosives. It links Giovanni Battista Montini, who later became Pope Paul VI, to the theft of property of Jewish, Serb, Russian, Ukrainian and Roma victims during World War II in Yugoslavia. Many studies and stories have already been written about the thundering silence of Pope Pius XII, who reigned in the Vatican during World War II. Now the former intelligence officer's testimony has revealed that after the war, Montini, who during the war served as the Vatican's deputy secretary of state under the pope, helped hide and launder property that had been stolen from, among others, Jews and was involved in the sheltering and smuggling of Croatian war criminals, such as the leader of the Ustashe movement, Ante Pavelic.

The smuggling and hiding of Croatian war criminals was part of the extensive network known as the Rat Lines. Senior officials at the Vatican were involved in hiding and smuggling Nazi war criminals and their collaborators so they would not be arrested and tried. Hundreds of war criminals were provided with church and Red Cross papers that enabled them to hide in safe houses and then flee from Europe, mainly to the Middle East and South America. Among them were Klaus Barbie ("the butcher of Lyon"), Adolf Eichmann, Dr. Josef Mengele and Franz Stengel, the commander of the Treblinka death camp.

The Vatican network was also used by leaders of the Ustashe - the nationalist Croatian Catholic movement that was active in Croatia and collaborated with the Nazi occupation. "The Reverend Dr. Prof. Krunoslav Draganovic seemed to be in cooperation with the Ustasha network. And he was given a Vatican assignment as the apostolic visitator for Croatians, which meant he reported directly to Monsignor Giovanni Battista Montini," states an American document based on a report from the Italian police; the document was recently placed in evidence at the court in San Francisco where Gowen testified.

The leaders of the Ustashe headed by Pavelic are the ones who stole the victims' property: art and jewelry - silver and mostly gold. After the war they fled with the treasure and laundered it with the help of Vatican institutions. According to Gowen's testimony, Montini, who in 1964 became the first pope to visit the State of Israel, was also involved in the Vatican's help in laundering the wealth.

Continued:

Still terrified

In 1999 a suit was filed at a court in San Franciso against the Vatican Bank (Institute for Religious Works) and against the Franciscan order, the Croatian Liberation Movement (the Ustashe), the National Bank of Switzerland and others. The suit was filed by Jewish, Ukrainian, Serb and Roma survivors, as well as relatives of victims and various organizations that together represent 300,000 World War II victims. The plaintiffs demanded accounting and restitution.

One of the lawyers representing the plaintiffs is Jonathan Levy. "Many of the plaintiffs have been reluctant to be pictured, after all these years," says Levy. "Many are still terrified of the Ustashe, the Serbs particularly. Unlike the Nazi Party, the Ustashe still exist and have a party headquarters in Zagreb."

The Ustashe was founded in 1929 as a Croatian nationalist movement with a deep connection to Catholicism. From the day it was founded the movement made its aim the establishment of an independent Croatian state and declared to fight the monarchy in Yugoslavia. The movement was banned and its founders, Pavelic and Gustav Percec (who was later murdered at Pavelic's orders) were condemned to death in their absence. The Ustashe was linked to the assassination of Yugoslav King Alexander and French foreign minister Louis Barthou in Marseilles in 1934.

Upon the occupation of Yugoslavia, the German Nazis and the Italian Fascists formed an "independent" state in Croatia, which was basically a Nazi puppet state. Pavelic was appointed poglovnik, the leader of the country. He hastened to meet with Hitler and allied himself with the Fuehrer. When Hitler invaded the Soviet Union, Pavelic sent Ustashe units to fight alongside the Nazis and then joined the declaration of war against the United States. Ustashe leaders declared they would slaughter a third of the Serb population in Croatia, deport a third and convert the remaining third from Orthodoxy to Roman Catholicism. Anyone who refused to convert was murdered.

Immediately upon the establishment of its puppet government, the Ustashe set up militias and gangs that slaughtered Serbs, Jews, Romas and their political foes. Catholic priests, some of them Franciscans, also participated in the acts of slaughter. The cruelty of the Ustashe was so great that even the commander of the German army in Yugoslavia complained.

Continued:

Himmler of the Balkans

Under the leadership of Pavelic's right-hand man Andrija Artukovic, who earned the nickname "the Himmler of the Balkans," the Ustashe set up concentration camps, most notably at Jasenovac. According to various estimates, about 100,000 people were murdered at the camp, among them tens of thousands of Jews (it is interesting to note that some of the heads of the Ustashe were married to Jewish women). Throughout Croatia about 700,000 people were murdered. The partisans, led by the Croat Communist Josip Broz Tito, and the Chetniks - Nationalist Serb royalists - fought the Ustashe.

After the war, Pavelic and other Ustashe heads fled to Austria and, with the help of the British intelligence and their friends in the Vatican, found refuge in Italy. They hid in Vatican monasteries and were provided with false documents that gave them a new identity. Secret documents that were disclosed at the court in San Francisco show that at the end of the war, British intelligence took Pavelic under its wing and allowed him and a convoy of 10 trucks that carried the stolen treasure to travel to the British occupation zone in Austria. The British did this with the intention of using him as a counterweight to the Communist takeover in Yugoslavia.

The Ustashe brought the treasure convoy to Rome, where they put it into the hands of the Croatian ambassador to the Vatican, Rev. Krunoslav Draganovic. Draganovic also saw to hiding Pavelic and his aides in Vatican institutions and safe houses in Rome. American military intelligence located Pavelic's hiding place. But according to a secret document Gowen wrote in July 1947, that was submitted to the court, Gowen's unit received the instruction: "Hands off" Pavelic.

This was an order from the American Embassy, stressed Gowen in his testimony. It is also stated in the document, which is classified as top secret, that Pavelic, via his contacts with Draganovic, was receiving Vatican protection. From Italy, Pavelic was smuggled on the Rat Lines to Argentina, where he served as a security adviser to president Juan Peron (Peron granted entry visas to 34,000 Croats, many of them associated with the Ustashe and Nazi supporters).

In 1957 there was an attempt to assassinate him, in which he was wounded. The operation was attributed to Tito's Yugoslav intelligence, although the possibility that this was an attempt at revenge by a Chetnik activist was not dismissed. Pavelic had to leave Argentina and found refuge with the Spanish dictator Franco. Two years later, in 1959, he died as a result of complications caused by the wound. The Ustashe has continued to exist over the years and until the 1980s its operatives were involved in acts of terror against diplomats and other Yugoslav targets abroad.

Continued:

Montini complains

The suit filed at the court in San Francisco is based on earlier investigations and reports from American government agencies, the Simon Wiesenthal Center and committees of historians who researched the matter of the Jewish property in Swiss banks. The case was preceded by successful legal battles by attorney Levy and his colleagues against the CIA and the American Army to obtain secret documents. The defendants, on their part, led by the Vatican Bank and the Franciscan order and others, deny the charges against them and made every effort to have the charges dismissed. So far, the court has rejected these efforts outright and determined that the deliberations would continue. But the defendants are tenacious and now they are demanding that publication of Gowen's testimony be prohibited.

After the end of the war Gowen served as a special agent, meaning an investigations officer in the Rome detachment of American counter-intelligence. This unit's role was to track down, among others, Italian Fascists, Nazi war criminals and their collaborators, including the Ustashe leaders (Gowen said another mission included, at the request of British intelligence, surveillance of Irgun and Lehi activists). The code name for the unit's actions was "Operation Circle."

Parallel to the counterintelligence unit, other American army intelligence units, and mainly the Office of Strategic Services (OSS, from which the CIA developed) and British intelligence were engaged in contradictory actions. They made contact with Nazis and with the Ustashe people and enlisted them in their service as agents, collaborators and informers, with the intention of forming a front against the Soviet spread into Eastern Europe and the Balkans. "To try and find Pavelic you had to discover how the Ustashe network in Italy was constituted, how it operated, what were its bases," testified Gowen.

A key person in the Pontifical Croatian college was Rev. Draganovic, the Croatian ambassador to the Vatican. Draganovic and the college issued false papers to Croatian war criminals, among them Pavelic and Artukovic. "I personally investigated Draganovic - who told me he was reporting to Montini," emphasized Gowen.

Gowen related that at a certain stage Montini learned, apparently from the head of the OSS unit in Rome, James Angleton, who nurtured relations with Montini and the Vatican, of the investigation Gowen's unit was conducting. Montini complained about Gowen to his superiors and accused him of having violated the Vatican's immunity by having entered church buildings, such as the Croatian college, and conducting searches there. The aim of the complaint was to interfere with the investigation.

In his testimony, Gowen also stated that Draganovic helped the Ustashe launder the stolen treasure with the help of the Vatican Bank: This money was used to fund its religious activities, but also to fund the escape of Ustashe leaders on the Rat Line.

Each religion has its share of "bad actors".

To wit: from Wikipedia and associated references therein-

"The Jewish Defense League or JDL is a Jewish organization whose stated goal is to "protect Jews from antisemitism by whatever means necessary".[1] While the group asserts that it "unequivocally condemns terrorism", and claims to have a "strict no-tolerance policy against terrorism and other felonious acts,"[2] it has been characterized as "a right-wing terrorist group" by the Federal Bureau of Investigation,[3] and as a hate group involved in "anti-Arab terrorism" by the Southern Poverty Law Center.[4] According to the FBI, the JDL has been involved in plotting terrorist attacks within the United States.[3]

Founded by Rabbi Meir Kahane in New York City in 1968, JDL's self-described purpose was to protect Jews from local manifestations of antisemitism.[1][5] Its criticism of the Soviet Union garnered support for the group, transforming it from a "vigilante club" to an activist organization with membership numbering over 15,000.[6] The group took to bombing Arab and Soviet properties in the United States,[7] and targeting various alleged "enemies of the Jewish people", ranging from Arab-American political activists to neo-Nazis, for assassination.[8] A number of JDL members have been linked to violent, and sometimes deadly, attacks in the United States, including the killing of American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee regional director Alex Odeh in 1985, and a plot to kill U.S. Congressman Darrell Issa in 2001.[9]

The 1994 Cave of the Patriarchs Massacre, in which dozens of Palestinians at prayer were massacred by a gunman in the West Bank city of Hebron, was perpetrated by a one-time JDL member who had emigrated from the United States, Baruch Goldstein.[10] The JDL maintains, on its website, "we are not ashamed to say that Goldstein was a charter member of the Jewish Defense League."[11]

Many Jewish groups have long been hostile to the group. According to one Anti-Defamation League official, the group consists only of "thugs and hooligans".[12]

Italian Catholic Priest Welcomes Believers with Swastika On His Right Arm

A priest has shocked parishioners by welcoming them to church wearing a swastika armband.

Fascist Father Angelo Idi, 51 – who once saw off a charity box thief with a truncheon at his church in Vigevano, Italy – confessed: “I am proud of my right wing beliefs. But people shouldn’t care about my politics, they should care about how good a priest I am.”

In northern Italy where former dictator Benito Mussolini comes from the far right Italian LEGA NORD (Northern League) have their political stronghold – and there have been several instances of priests with far right views that have embarrassed the Catholic Church.

Last month a right wing Italian priest who is a member of Richard Williamson’s Pius fraternity was caught giving the Hitler salute at a neo-fascist rally – but claimed he was just trying to bless his flock.

Catholic priest Giulio Tam, well known for his extremist right views, raised his right arm when speaking at a rally of the neo-fascist Forza Nuova party in Bergamo, northern Italy.

The ultra-conservative Pius fraternity hit the headlines recently as British Catholic bishop and Holocaust denier Richard Williamson is a member.

After a picture revealed Tam raising his right hand, he argued: “The young people of the Forza Nuova wanted me to bless them. I’ll always be on their side.”

Tam regards Italian dictator Benito Mussolini as a martyr and has in the past held masses at Mussolini’s grave.

http://news.ronatvan.com/2009/05/02/italian-catholic-priest-welcomes-believers-with-swastika-on-his-right-arm/

Interesting Deenen fails to include, in his list of dangerous radical extremists, Hume's Huckabee pastors who cherry-pick Psalms 109 to pray for the death of the President of the United States and a pox upon his family and terrorist Catholic clergy who molest little boys and then hide behind the apron strings of the Cardinals' $10,000 red dresses.

Please don't give Americans another reason to dismiss science as less important than the humanities.
Most of jobs available are for those with science and technology backgrounds.

All engineers are not evil. I am an electrical engineer. I happen to believe that religion should not interfere with government. I happen to be non-religious. But I don't necessarily represent all engineers. I want to live my life free of anyone elses faith.
Others can believe anything they want as long as it doesn't impose on my law-abiding life. It's hurtful to be thought of as evil to believers. I do not need to pray or believe in a deity to be a good human.

Once again for Farnaz's benefit since she still cannot come to grips with her obvious problems:

Hmmm, Farnaz would like me to leave so she can possibly continue her violation of the Torah's ninth commandment and violation of On Faith's rules?? Now would that be fair to those who play by the rules??

And please note, reiteration is a major tool of education and indeed On Faith readers are getting one with respect to the errors and flaws in the history and theology of the major religions although considering the few followers of Judaism these days, should we even consider Judaism in the discussion? Even Farnaz has given up on said religion being a professed atheist. Actually, if not for said Judaism being the mythical foundation for Christianity and Islam, there would be no need to bring up the errors and flaws in Judaism.

And if Farnaz needs added clarification, she can contact the likes of "Schaum", "Zebra4", "DOUG_WHITE", "Carstonio" et al.

Farnaz1Mansouri1

You wrote, "And, btw., Oh Loonatunum, lover of pitty wingy things, Judaism has as much to do with Christianity as a candle does with fish."

You also seem to think that Judaism has nothing to do with God, don't you?

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

And, btw., Oh Loonatunum, lover of pitty wingy things, Judaism has as much to do with Christianity as a candle does with fish.

Gee, that great Bible scholar sans cerebral cortex, CCNL1, sure has found himself a bunch of conspirators.

Interestingly, the natives (victims) throughout the blot are getting restless. Will they succeed in persuading his mommie to make him take his meds?

And in the meantime we say unto him, "Deus vobiscum, Loonatunum.

Hmmm, Farnaz would like me to leave so she can possibly continue her violation of the Torah's ninth commandment and violation of On Faith's rules?? Now would that be fair to those who play by the rules??

And please note, reiteration is a major tool of education and indeed On Faith readers are getting one with respect to the errors and flaws in the history and theology of the major religions although considering the few followers of Judaism these days, should we even consider Judaism in the discussion? Even Farnaz has given up on said religion being a professed atheist. Actually, if not for said Judaism being the mythical foundation for Christianity and Islam, there would be no need to bring up the errors and flaws in Judaism.

It's possible that a big part of the problem is lack of involvement with the opposite sex, for which both Islam and studying math or engineering are probably barriers to having the kinds of relationships a modern young man wants.

The attackers at Fort Hood, Virginia Tech and the Pittsburgh health club all cited lack of females as part of their general life-failures.

The Golden Age of the Arabs began its dwindle when their theologists placed their faith in Allah above their faith in reason. This is why there is now virtually no theoretical science carried out in the lands of the prophet.
We faces this struggle today.

zebra4:

A blogger has finally discovered the meaning of CCNL1's acronym: Cerebral Cortex Not Located.

A lot of us report his comments, easily done by clicking on to "report offensive comments."

Thus far, no luck in ending his miserable career here. But who knows.

Maybe, one day he'll go back on his meds and post sanely. I rather doubt that, too, though.

Excessively long and mildly ridiculous, Patrick. Engineering is one of the most common areas of specialization in the Middle East, Asia, and Africa.

Now, if you'd deign to do a bit of reading on these vast areas, you might learn why. Failing that, perhaps, you might chat with a political economist.

As for the notion that studying the humanities makes for humanness, old and very tired.

Three quarters of the participants at the Wansee Conference, whose objective was to design the final solution to the Jewish Problem, held the PhD.

Let us move on, Patrick.

And "zebra4" continues his/her charade and of course his/her violation of the Torah's ninth commandment. Note said "zebra4" does not deny using an alias!!

Mr. Deneen:

Others have also noted the apparent connection between some of the exact sciences, such as engineering, and fundamentalist religious views. One such self-identified "engineer" stalks this very forum espousing Intelligent Design views and warning of firey apocryphal ends for non-believers. You are fortunate not to have had your threads hi-jacked by that particular individual.

I would disagree, however, that the connection is between a materialist worldview, per se, and radical religious fundamentalism.

Mathematics and most religions share a belief that certain axioms are objectively, eternally, necessarily (i.e. non-contingent) and immutably true. 2+2 always = 4. Allah is always great. 3 > 2 -- always. The Bible is always the inerrant word of God. The common denominator (pun intended) I see, therefore, is absolutism. By way of corroboration, I point to the fact that biologists, physicists and cosmologists -- scientists whose materialistic fields rarely allow for any but provisional "conclusions" -- are overwhelmingly non-religious.

I agree with you that any well-educated person should be exposed to the Humanities, if for no other reason than to develop their empathetic sensibilities. I would go one step further, perhaps, and include in such a well-balanced education comparative religious studies. (Secularists I know don't want to ban religion from the public sphere, they just oppose government favoring Christianity, or any other religion, over all other religions.)

AAnd some peoply continue to impose their "impostering" upon us thus violating the ninth commandment of the Torah. e.g. "zebra4" ?????????
Posted by: ccnl1
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And is CCNL1 a real and not fictitious name of the evil person?

Did readers ever found any postive things this evil person had to say about anybody?

"Can secularism attain the capacity for self-doubt necessary to question its own complicity in the pathologies of modern belief? I have my doubts."

As do I. I have often stated that legalism is not sufficient to get people to act in a way that takes others and society in general into consideration and the legal system is not equipped to deal with huge numbers of people that act only on the fear of punishment. We need a moral compass to guide our actions. Acting "naturally" is not good enough. Certainly acting in community spirit does come naturally, but so does ruthlessness to any we decide are "others".

What strikes me in suicide bombers is there common alienation from the fairer sex. Muhammed Atta's fear and loathing/attraction is well documented. Farouk seems to have had similar tendencies and the godfather of of radical Islam, Sayid Qtub's writings reek of the same spirit. Outside of Islam, the Unabomber fits the same profile.

Perhaps having women in tight or revealing clothes acting as profilers at boarding gates to gauge the reactions of travelers might be the ticket to greater safety.

Beside that, it might sell more tickets.

And some peoply continue to impose their "impostering" upon us thus violating the ninth commandment of the Torah. e.g. "zebra4" ?????????

No good deed will go unpunished. Some evil bloggers show their presence by denouncing good people of faith.

Do we really care what a person who works for a university that sold its soul to Islam says and thinks since said sale taints everything these Georgetown commentators put forward!!!!!