US-CONSCIENCE

Do you think or believe that Jesus is God-Incarnate?

Didn't Jesus say that He Is the Good Shepherd and we are to be as lambs led to the slaughter?

It doesn't say that there will be no more prophets, what it says is that there will be no more "prophecy", there are plenty of prophecies that have not yet been fulfilled.

By the way, God's Plan if for ALL and God's Plan will come to Fruition.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Pictures and shadow’s and types.

When the first man and the first woman committed their act of rebellion, they suddenly experienced shame for the first time. The creator compassionately covered their nakedness with the skin of an animal. The creator, by killing an animal, covered their shame. Even this is a picture of what the Creator will eventually and permanently do when the time is right.

Abraham, who the creator picked to use to bless the entire world, was tested by the Creator and told to take his only son, the one he loved, and bring him to a specific place and offer him as a sacrafice. When they arrived at the hill top and built the alter, the son asked Abraham a question. “Where is the lamb” and Abraham replied “Jehovah jirah” (meaning in Hebrew “the Lord will provide”) and right before Abraham laid the knife to his son, one was provided. This is type, a shadow, a picture of what was to come. Jehovah jirah. ( it would even take place on the same hill )

The Passover. Before the final plague, the Creator instructed Moses to tell each of the Hebrew families to get a lamb, a spotless lamb of one year of age and kill it. Then take its blood and a hyssop branch and use the branch to mark to doorway to your home with the blood of the lamb, marking both sides and above the door, so when the messenger of death comes he will see the blood on your doorway and judgment will “Pass over” your house. The Passover was a picture, a type, a shadow of what was to come.

Later, after Moses led his people out of Egypt ( a place of slavery - which in and of itself is another picture and type of what the one to come will do ) and shortly after the Creator gave them the 10 commandments so that they might know more clearly what constituted rebellion, the Creator used Moses to institute a system. It was called the sacrificial system. In this system we have three integral parts: the Prophet, the Priest and the Sacrifice. The prophet is one who speaks ( or intercedes ) to man from the creator. The priest is one who speaks ( or intercedes ) to the creator for man. The sacrifice was a lamb in whom the transgressions of the people would be imputed to and then killed as an offering. This system was instituted not to take away the effects of the betrayal or to bring the creator and us ( His creation ) to a place of peace or right standing, but instead was instituted so that we would have an understanding of the role and mission of the One who would come. He would fulfill the role and be our ultimate and final prophet, priest, and sacrifice. The sacrificial system was a type, a shadow, a picture of what was to come. All those lambs for all those years pointed to the one to come, the one who would be the Lamb of THE CREATOR.

The entire book is filled with pictures, types, and shadow’s of who and what was to come, so that when it did come, we would be able to recognize and to understand.

zebra4

You wrote, "You say, "God did not torture and kill Jesus, we did" and yet, you claim, " Jesus died for our sins". And then you say," All we have to do is, ask for forgiveness". WHAT A MUMBO JUMBO."

First, did God kill God-Incarnate or did we? Or for the same question, did God kill Jesus or did we?

Yes, Jesus died for our sins or wrongdoing, if the word sin bothers you or anyone else, and He asked us to "Follow Him", something to think about.

Considering that "people" tend to want a "pound of flesh", so to speak, and then still tend to not forgive in many instances, this may be "MUMBO JUMBO" to you but it shows something of God, His Mercy, that we tend to be rather lacking in extending, of course God can see into people's hearts whereas we sometimes can not see past the surface.

Do you think that just because Jesus "died for our sins" that it doesn't matter what one does? It seems as if some "Christians" think this way, doesn't it?

You then wrote, "The author is asking questions as to why God, the omnipotent, omniscient, and omni present allow all this."

We have free will.

You then wrote, "You can't see contradictions in your beliefs."

Not in the least, but like I said, it is God's Plan not mine and God knows all of the details, so to speak, I don't and I don't need to know all of the details and from what I hear and read, there are not that many that seem to want ALL OF HUMANITY to be with God in His Kingdom, yet there does seem to be many that "as long as they get to the 'good place' than that is 'good enough' for them.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

Ego Tripping

Nikki Giovanni (1973)

I was born in the Congo.

I walked to the Fertile Crescent and built the sphinx.

I designed a pyramid so tough that a star

that only glows every one hundred years falls

into the center giving divine perfect light.

I am bad.

I sat on the throne

drinking nectar with Allah.

I got hot and sent an ice age to Europe

to cool my thirst.

My oldest daughter is Nefertiti.

The tears from my birth pains

created the Nile.

I am a beautiful woman.

I gazed on the forest and burned

out the Sahara desert.

With a packet of goat's meat

and a change of clothes,

I crossed it in two hours.

I am a gazelle so swift,

so swift you can't catch me.

For a birthday present when he was three,

I gave my son Hannibal an elephant.

He gave me Rome for mother's day.

My strength flows ever on.

My son Noah built an ark and

I stood proudly at the helm

as we sailed on a soft summer day.

I turned myself into myself and was Jesus.

Men intone my loving name.

All praises all praises,

I am the one who would save.

I sowed diamonds in my back yard.

My bowels deliver uranium.

The filings from my fingernails are

semi-precious jewels.

On a trip north,

I caught a cold and blew

my nose giving oil to the Arab world.

I am so hip even my errors are correct.

I sailed west to reach east and had to round off

the earth as I went.

The hair from my head thinned and gold was laid

across three continents.

I am so perfect so divine so ethereal so surreal.

I cannot be comprehended except by my permission.

I mean...I...can fly

like a bird in the sky...

There were undoubtedly gods of the fathers but there is no God the Father.

Understand that and you'll save your brain/mind a lot of wheel-spinning.

Maybe you're missing something, here, Tak: this is a discussion board, not a chatroom. It's not about shouting into a stream of talk.

It's more like writing letters. About a topic. Take your time.

"i missed Susan K. Smith much but i am not able to send messages to Her articles. OnFAith thanks for my comment, and it does not appear in the list."

Err... Tak?

You spam. A lot. This is not appropriate etiquette. Try pausing to formulate your thoughs and present them in a digestible form, rather than posting twenty random things in a row.

I must say I am very pleased that God the loving Father has seen fit to bless us here in the USA and not treated us the way He has those raped and pillaged folks in Africa.
They must have done terrible things to deserve all that.

ThomasBaum wrote:

"And then, "never saw Human as having created a sin so great that it required the torturing to death of His only begotten Son, should He have had one, which is unimaginable."
All we have to do is ask forgiveness and mean it for what we do wrong and since God is God, He knew some would never ask forgiveness so that is why God has His Plan.
God did not torture and kill Jesus, WE DID.
God is beyond imagination, yet He is ever so close.
***************************************************

Lot of rhetoric!

You say, "God did not torture and kill Jesus, we did" and yet, you claim, " Jesus died for our sins". And then you say," All we have to do is, ask for forgiveness". WHAT A MUMBO JUMBO.

The author is asking questions as to why God, the omnipotent, omniscient, and omni present allow all this.

You can't see contradictions in your beliefs.

taksimbirki:

In some parts of Malaysia, the society is matrilineal. Descent is traced from mother to daughter, to grand-daughter.

There are numerous tribes in Africa, Latin America, and Northern India that practice matrliny.

Pick up an introductory text book in cultural anthropology, you will find innumerable examples.

I think a lot of the 'God the Father' stuff in Christianity, complete with misappropriated hebrew stories, may just be the model for most familial *abuse* today, actually.

Even Jesus is portrayed in terms of this dynamic: through suffering and submission, ...enabling, some might say, he's taken to validate the 'sacrificial' aspect of that king-god.

It seems to me that in Christian myth, real human fatherhood takes a back seat ...Joseph, is kind of the third wheel in things, doesn't really do much. ...but stay out of the way of a vengeful, commanding, unaccountably sacrifice-demanding character.

This article kind of shows the abusive dynamic, in a way: on the one hand, the horrors are acknowledged, and as quickly, unaccountably... denied or displaced somewhere.

'God the Father' doesn't *teach* about fatherhood, just displaces it and demands submission: Jesus in a way being the suffering child who's supposed to scapegoat the 'sins of the father.' However irrational the demands, you could even say.

People *imitate* this in bad ways, with all the terror, insecurity, and Stockholm Syndrome of an abusive household.

Don't stop there, with 'Aren't we glad we say we aren't like that.'

I don't know which came first, that myth or that kind of abuse, but it needs looking at.

Farnaz1Mansouri1

You wrote, " As a Jew, though, nonobservant, I assure you, the God of Abraham (a) would never have incarnated an aspect of Himself,"

You are right, the God of Abraham did not incarnate an "aspect" of Himself, He incarnated His Very Self, LOVE.

And then, " cherishes humanity, suffers with him, as Heschel so brilliantly put it,"

Right again, not only does He suffer along with us but He became One of us to suffer as One of us.

And then, "never saw Human as having created a sin so great that it required the torturing to death of His only begotten Son, should He have had one, which is unimaginable."

All we have to do is ask forgiveness and mean it for what we do wrong and since God is God, He knew some would never ask forgiveness so that is why God has His Plan.

God did not torture and kill Jesus, WE DID.

God is beyond imagination, yet He is ever so close.

You then wrote, "He, therefore, gave Noah a code, Moses, the principles, with which to redeem the world. That is what is necessary. Not the bleeding to death of Himself incarnate on the cross."

Many people never look beyond the "physical" of the cross and never think of or even imagine the "spiritual" of the cross. Jesus went to the uttermost depths of hell, which, by the way, is individually built by the occupant and also went thru "spiritual death".

Jesus also extended the invitaion to "Come follow Me", if you think about it, it may give you and others an idea just what "Christianity" is about, as opposed to what so many seem to be spewing out.

Then you wrote, "And that God cherishes all he created."

This is true and that is why God has His Plan.

Take care, be ready.

Sincerely, Thomas Paul Moses Baum.

"God the Father is father to the fatherless, protector of widows, women without male protection in a patriarchal culture. He houses the homeless and liberates prisoners. "

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Does the author know that there are matrilineal and matriarchal societies in the world as well? We in the West do not know about them.

Interesting, but erroneous. I'll save the Jewish philosopher Jacques Derrida for another day.

Let me begin by saying that Judaism holds human sacrifice as an abomination. The hand of Abraham was stayed in an effort to end human sacrifice forever. I am, of course, being interpretive. NO literalist, I. But, then, Judaism is not a literalist's religion.

On the matter of Jeptha's daughter:

"Firstly it is important to emphasize that Judaism has always viewed human sacrifices as a reprehensible abomination. Regarding the Canaanites, Moses says: "For every abomination to G‑d which He hates, they did to their gods; for also their sons and their daughters they would sacrifice in fire to their gods."3

Based on this idea, many of the biblical commentators4 maintain that Jephthah did not offer his daughter as a sacrifice. In fact, his original vow, "whatever comes forth . . . shall be to G‑d, and I will offer him up for a burnt-offering," had a dual intention: If it will be a person, then it "shall be [consecrated] to G‑d." and if it should be an animal, then "I will offer him as a burnt-offering." (The Hebrew prefix "ו" which precedes the words "I will offer him" can be translated as "and" or "or.")

According to this interpretation, Jephthah's daughter was sent to the mountains to live in seclusion. She never married and dedicated her life to the service of G‑d.

Other biblical commentators5 disagree. Though Jephtah was one of the Israelite judges, he was chosen for the position because of his bravery and might, not because of his Torah scholarship—indeed, he was woefully ignorant.6 And though he was not bound whatsoever by the vow he made—as it clearly transgressed the rules of the Torah—he ignorantly went ahead and offered his daughter as a sacrifice.

Had he only consulted with Phinehas, the learned High Priest of the times, he would have been informed of his error. But that didn't happen. Jephtah was too arrogant to travel to Phinehas to receive guidance: "I am the general of the Israelite forces, and I should go to him?!" And Phinehas was too proud to unilaterally go to Jephthah to advise him: "He needs me, why should I make trip?"

The hubris demonstrated by these two leaders cost an innocent girl her life. According to the Midrash7 both were punished. Phinehas lost the divine spirit that had hitherto rested upon him. Jephtah became ill, and he lost many of his limbs. Because his limbs were buried in many locations, the Bible says that Jephthah was "buried in the cities of Gilead."8"

The above is the Chabad summary and it is fine. Consistent with mainstream Judaism.
______________________
Judaism holds that it is not for Jews to question other religions. However, it abominates human sacrifice. As a Jew, though, nonobservant, I assure you, the God of Abraham (a) would never have incarnated an aspect of Himself, (b) cherishes humanity, suffers with him, as Heschel so brilliantly put it, (c) never saw Human as having created a sin so great that it required the torturing to death of His only begotten Son, should He have had one, which is unimaginable.

That deity would never have incriminated humanity in such a horror. That deity understood that Human had a tendency to err. He, therefore, gave Noah a code, Moses, the principles, with which to redeem the world. That is what is necessary. Not the bleeding to death of Himself incarnate on the cross.

To live justly. That is what we must do, and that is what we have the means to do. The God of Abraham is construed in Judaism as the omnipotent, the all-loving, the all merciful, the beginning and the end. And that God cherishes all he created. Always has. See Talmud.

Happy Father's Day.