Examine Ghrouse's grousing in light of the sentiments of Cordoba House sharia advocates.

“Muslims are the vilest of animals…”

“Show mercy to one another, but be ruthless to Muslims”

“How perverse are Muslims!”

“Strike off the heads of Muslims, as well as their fingertips”

“Fight those Muslims who are near to you”

“Muslim mischief makers should be murdered or crucified”

Hate speech? Incitement to violence? Sounds like it to me; but a knowledgeable Cordoba House Muslim would have to disagree.

Why would Cordoba House Muslims not consider this to be hate speech? How is it that I can post these quotes with full certainty that Cordoba House won't be contacting WaPo Editors (or Congress) with wild-eyed accusations of Islamophobia?
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Articles/Quran_Hate.htm

Don't be an apologist for Islam-supremacist hate mongers your whole life, Mikey.

Leftist-fascists in NYC agencies don't hesitate to obstruct construction of houses of worship -- at least non-Islamic ones.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/08/nine-years-later-church-at-ground-zero-still-not-rebuilt-but-mad-rush-to-build-islamic-supremacist-m.html

These Leftist reprobates would sell your Catholic mother's grave to support a scatologists right to squat and plop a steaming pile of free expression.

But when patriotic Americans object to jihadists opening a 9/11 snuff porn vendor emporium (and recruitment center) on the hallowed graves of Ground Zero-- and Leftists shriek with indignation!

"Ye blind guides, that strain out the gnat, and swallow the camel!"
[Matthew 23:24]

Dear Mr. Brown and Secular

Mr. Brown, how is it an insult? You are speaking like those right wing Muslims who were intolerant to see the Cartoons in Denmark, they act like cry babies, getting insulted for every little thing. How are you more civilized than them?
~~~~~~~

Secular,

Secular, thanks for your input.

Indeed, Saudi police have prevented a man from worshiping his Hindu Icon, and Muslims have condemned it unequivocally. I hope you are not suggesting we the Americans emulate them as an example. This is one of the reasons we need to support the mosque, so others can learn from us.

There are indeed temples in most of the middle east except in Saudi Arabia, so are the Churches, please do the fact check. I was in Saudi Arabia and attended a Mormon Congregation and there were Catholic Congregations as well. Saudi Arabia does not have any citizens who are not Muslims, most people are on a work visa.

Really, the right wingers among us are acting exactly like the right winger Muslims who were destructive against the Cartoons in Denmark. Do we want to stoop that low like them? Of course not, we are civil society and shamefully we have to endure our right wingers who are just a small fraction of our population, but as loud as those right winger Muslims in other lands.

We are a civil society and we need to be an example to other nations, how the civil societies function.

Though not an American, I am one of those strongly opposed to building a Mosque and an Islamic Cultural Center overlooking the killing field of 9/11. Apart from their brazen insult in choosing this site, these folks think that Americans are idiots that do not understand the brazen significance of their naming their organization "Cordoba."
I have a prediction. This structure will never never never never be built. Never. No matter what craven and stupid New York politicians might think.

C. ALEXANDER BROWN
Rockcliffe Park, Canada
Baden-Wuerttemberg, Germany.

Continuing from below

3) The common refrain I hear from moderate muslims is do not lump us all together. However, when there is something offensive they do not hesitate to lump all the muslims int one monolith that every one is offended.

4) You also claim respecting other places of worship is embedded in islam. I have to take exception to that claim. This has not been my experience. I have seen a Saudi immigration official destroying an old lady's Hindu scripture. The unfortunate incident took place as we were being bussed to the hotel due to an airline equipment failure. Not only that in all teh OIC countries there are no permissions given to construct temples or churches, etc. In one of my posts I have cited the example of a temple that was finally allowed in Dubai, which is by and large considered quite liberal. Even there were several restriction put in place that the temple could not be built per the obligatory manner.

4) lastly while I concede that constitutionally the mosque construction may go off. But one has to consider that is it necessary to construct one at the place chosen. The principle claim that it is their attempt foster greater understanding of Islam in the US. There are two issues in this regard. Why is it that people of other religions do not try this hard to sell their religions? The second one is that minorities in the western societies are not in any grave danger. On the other hand the intolerance in OIC countries even in places like Malaysia, Indonesia is by comparison very high. Wouldn't it be better to build such centers in OIC countries to foster greater tolerance. Without that all the rest are to naught.

Hello Mr. Ghouse, thank you very much for responding to my comment and reaching out to me. You take issue with many of my assertions. I will try to respond to your critique of my positions.

1) I agree with many a characterizations of the politicians demagoguing the mosque issue. But this had to be expected of from some of those quarters, So beating your chest about them is a non-sequiter, unless their demagoging goes beyond words.

2) Now coming to your claims of opposing the Danish Cartoon,South Park your positions may well have been a tolerant one and in western liberal tradition. Nonetheless in the muslim world the popular opinion, media opinion and that of the clergy was far from it.

3) You claim that there were hardly 50 people doing the destruction an dthe rest were gawkers. That is the problem in all cases that is what happens. The so called gawkers did not stop the 50 odd people. They are nearly as complicit as the 50. The community at large did not challenge the clerics from Denmark, instead they were given a platform in the OIC counties to incite the people. The countries in which normally assembly of more than 10 people is tightly controlled, such riots were allowed to occur. It was not in one country but several countries. Which makes for difficult to anyone to swallow the claim that only a1/10th of 1% were the miscreants. That claim is probably true, but off the 99.9% a far away majority were not unsympathetic the happenings. Your denouncing them from the safety of US, while commendable, is a non-starter. The fact still remains that there were hardly anyone in the OIC countries who dared to confront those clerics to nip the whole thing in the bud. That is the critique of Islam.

3) Compare that with the what happened in the US immediately after 9/11. While there were sporadic case of hate crimes against muslims and inadvertently against others too. However, what we did not see is any organized or whole scale riots against the mosques or any of the muslim embassies and interests. Even in case the mosques issue we see lot of letters, people expressing their view and prejudices. To lump them all together as prejudice is a mistake. At the same time you also see lot of pro statements as well. The pro people are not cowed down by the anti people either. That is teh difference

I love this country for its values and its wonderful people. I came here as a child and would give my life to defend all America stands for, and that includes protect our values, our people and our territories from those who want to harm us. Regardless of the political affiliation or the multiple creeds that peaceful co-habit this land I DO OPPOSE to have a mosque near ground zero.
Muslims peaceful or not only "tolerate us because this is our land" please show me how many christian or other creed churches exist in their "religion based countries?
how many people of other creeds do their charities assist? the answer is none.
We must stop being naive when trying to be tolerant or politically correct. They are peaceful now but the minute they grow in numbers which they are already they will try to take over. its seen in any group animal or human...a larger group will try to swallow a smaller one.
Muslims do not give back to our society, they only take. no matter what they consider western societies infidels that is why the marry within themselves. What is moral anyway? a set of rules that we humans created based on our values- theirs are different therefore we should apply their set of values- intolerance, arrogance. Let them build mosques in their countries- they are guests here

Dear Secular:

I hope you are not falling in the same trap as the right wingers without checking for the facts; facts don’t matter to them and I hope they do matter to you.

We must all stand up for freedom of speech i) Danish Cartoon, we prayed for the well being of the artist and suggested those few right winger Muslims to do the right thing; pray for the well being, the article has gone world over ii) Muslims have made firm commitment to stand by the producers of South Park and defended their positions iii) Muslims have opposed the UN bill to prevent insulting religious figures or criticism of Holocaust iv) Muslims like every moderate person in the world is for free speech. I don’t know if I can give all the links on this forum, but it is on the site world Muslim Congress dot org or simply log on to my website listed in the article and check it out. Everything I have said above is posted there.

Americans are not offended; Google it out, the Rabbis, Pastors and the religious people from different faiths in unison defending the religious freedom. Check the Dallas Morning News piece, there are many here at the post and on Miami Herald. The right wingers are acting to be offended, and messing with the emotions of the people who lost their loved ones in the 9/11 terrorists attack by invoking patriotism against religion. It should not work, the right wingers cannot dupe Americans for too long. There is always a political or financial gain to them as they have done with other issues. It is a political ploy.

How many Muslims have facilitated constructions of place of worship? Too many to list, Google it up bud. Respecting other places of worship is embedded in religion, like all other religions. 1/10th of 1% of any religious, ethnic or racial group tends to be radically intolerant, but the others are fine people.
Check the video tapes of Danish Embassies… burning in Syria and elsewhere, you cannot count more than 50 people who are destructive, others were gawkers. , you can count… Google for that day, there were similar rioting and destruction going one elsewhere… By the way, Muslims had written to the Danish Government to file law suits against those 50 some people for the destruction of their embassies – not against Muslims, which is dumb, but against those miscreants and bring justice.

Every community should build their own centers to teach tolerance, pluralism and co-existence, like this proposed center aims to do that. Let’s take actions to shape the future rather than drift into disharmony. Muslims are taking positive steps, and the American public will support it despite the politics of the right wingers.

Mr. Ghouse, Mohideen_Ibramsha, muslim1908:
You all are great pieces of work. Where were you during the Danish cartoons fracas or the South Park Fracas or the Draw a MO day Fracas. Which side of the argument were you on, the constitutional side arguing for free speech rights or were you on the you cannot offend 1.3 Billion moslems side of the argument. Let me guess, let me guess on the free speech side right, NOT!

You definitely don't want to offend the 1.3 billion muslims, what may. Arent you the guys who constantly parrot do not stereotype all muslims by the actions of few. Given that why do you stereotype all the 1.3 billion muslims when it serves your purposes. If you believe as you state then why is to not conceivable for you that there may be a significant fraction of the muslim population that may not be offended by the cartoons or South Park or Draw a MO day.

For those of you who have made an art form of milking the "we are offended" cow for all it has got, cannot even conceive that 300 million of your countrymen may be offended by the building of the mosque? You know what. you just do not care how offensive it is for the remaining 300 million people. By your own counts there are between 100 to 200 mosques in NYC for 600,000. So clearly it is not that you do not have place to worship your magical man in the sky? this is just an arrogant demand for group rights.

How many of you have ever reflected and made any attempts to facilitate the construction of places of worship for the magical men in the sky of non-muslims. Let me guess, let me guess me says 5? no no 3? No, no, no how about BIG FAT NO right?

I agree with you lots of the protest are driven by bigots and ignorants. But you did not flinch for a moment to stereotype all the critics into bigots. But that is OK right? Of course it is you are muslims so you are the only one who is always right.

Have you seen the reaction here compared to the reaction in your native lands. There were wide spread riots and burning of embassies over the Danish cartoon incident. The proponents of the mosque would do well to foster tolerance in your native lands. There is enough tolerance here. May be when you have brought you sunnah to the point where they would stop rioting for each silly thing and start writing instead. Then you can plan on building more islamic centers here.

This is an excellent article. Keep up the good work!

I think the proponents of the Islamic center near Ground Zero project are making an enormous PR mistake . . . BUT we should be staunch and forthright in our commitment to their having the right to do so. WE are not Saudi Arabia, so WE shouldn't practice religious intolerance the way they do.

I read Gingrich's piece a few days ago. It is filled with specious arguments and, I think, cynical and opportunistic pandering to his base. Although I think he's a bright and articulate guy, I also think he's a bottom-feeder. May he never regain power.

Please read
http://deentech.com/IsraelAndWealth.aspx
which gives one technical solution to avert the clash between Zionists and Muslims. An improvement on this solution would be to dig a canal like the Suez Canal along the Jordon, Syria, and Lebanon border of Israel so that the Holy Land becomes Holy Island and out of contention with Muslims.

Also read
http://deentech.com/Church_Masjid_Synagogue_on_the_same_spot.aspx
removing the worst conflict between the Zionists and the Muslims.

We are for peaceful coexistence.

The Masjid near the Ground Zero would hopefully have meetings of Jews on Saturday nights, Christians on Sunday nights and Muslims on Friday nights with open admission to the whole public to integrate the communities to live in peace.

We suggest the 24/7 telecast of the prayer hall of the Masjid to be done like that of the Holy Kaaba in Makkah so that the whole world could see what happens inside the Masjid.

A Muslim has nothing to hide; Islam is Peace and we strive for peace.

This is one issue that you're not going to be able to pigeonhole that easily. I am a liberal democrat and believe this to be a very insensitive proposition and know for a fact that I am not, as a liberal democrat, alone in that perception. I will grant you that there is probably good reason to guess that some of the sentiment from the right is based primarily on prejudice of one kind or the other but the objections from a lot of people like me is that we feel it's just inappropriate to build this center so close to ground zero. Why is it necessary to have this facility so close ? It could just as well serve the local community if it was built a few blocks uptown while not being so in your face to the people who live and work in the neighborhood and the people who come from all over the country to pay their respects.