Religious illiteracy's win is pluralism's loss

This author presupposes that religious knowledge has some value. On the contrary it has as much social value as any subject whose truth claims are unsubstantiated. Speaking of unsubstantiated subjects, Knowledge of Religion is as useful as Knowledge of Astrology or Alchemistry. Actually US does not need another generation of young'ns who know about religion. Actually after couple more generations we will regret the lack of religious knowledge as much as we now miss total absence of any knowledge of Alchemistry. In short I am not at all scandalized at the Pew findings. As a matter of fact I am actually elated, that end of religion is just around the corner.

Gee, clearthinking1, you sure do sound self-righteous. Suggest you read what you write before you post.

farnazmansouri2,

I wrote on this thread in response to your comment. Don't worry about my courage or intellectual clarity.

It is sad that on a day when there is consensus that reasonable people have prevailed in making progress on living together in peace in India, you have chosen to undermine anything positive. You seem to fear the mature & methodical action that is the hallmark of true progress. You sound like a simplistic radical looking to create conflict, not constructively resolve problems.

It is not uncommon for the self-righteous to become closed-minded. They then see the world as black & white, not shades of grey. This is a destructive tendency.

Self-righteousness is the disease that allows people to become communists like Stalin & Mao in the name of helping others.
Self-righteousness is what allows people to become fascists and nazis like Mussolini & Hitler in the name of improving society.
Self-righteousness is what allows religious people to become pedophile-protecting Bishops, suicide terrorists, or unemotional assassins in the name of god.

Self-righteousness closes the mind not just to facts and reason, but to honesty & morality.

You & your colleagues have entered the self-righteous zone where minds are already made up and all that's left is an agenda. Your obsessively repetitive and offensive comments are not constructive, and this is apparent to anyone reading them.

All self-righteous people have a long bibliography from people who already agree with their agenda. Watch Fox News for one week and you'll understand what I mean. What you need is not a long list of people who agree with you, but an an honest and open mind and an intellect focused on a valid method for constructing peace & tolerance.

This is also why atheists & agnostics are more knowledgeable about religion than the self-righteous believers. [This comment is actually relevant to Dr. Shukla's article above.] You asked about the connection between Hinduism (Sanatan Dharma) and Dalits. Are you truly knowledgeable about the facts on this one or just the "Fox News" fair & balanced agenda? Its honest introspection time.

Clearthinking:

Quite the coward, you've become have you not. You abandon the Shukla's other thread for obvious reasons and attempt to vilify me here. You are as wrong about the ignorance you accuse me of as your co-Hindus were of my ignorance of Kashmir, as you know, very well. Because you saw.

As I posted previously, I have published bibliographies on caste in India on this and other threads.

How far do you want to take this wanton defense of slavery, Clearthinking?

Let me know. Do you want another Bibliography? Do you want me to paste articles by Indian HIndu academics?

Let me know, FoggyThinking. And do continue to show us what your Hindu education has taught you. Evidently, you were not well educated. I have Hindu colleagues who would scream if they read your posts.

Byronmorgan,

Farnazmansouri2 does not know what dalit, untouchable, shudra, harijan, caste, varna, jati, scheduled cast, etc mean and how they are related to Hinduism, Sanatan Dharma, Vedas, Upanishads, or Gita. Yet she knows that it feels good and righteous to spout about injustice, without actually understanding the issues or doing much about it. Even if this means insulting people like Dr. Shukla who have stated clear positions about social injustice. His organization, Hindu American Foundation, has beautiful report on caste related issues.

Dr. Shukla on the other hand actually does charity work in India, and many Hindus in India have been working on the social problems and injustices in their society for hundreds of years, including people like Mahatma Gandhi.

The economic problems and poverty are so deep in post-colonial India that it is still difficult to lift these people up with education and opportunity without having the resources. Nevertheless, people are trying with quotas and reservations in schools and other aid. Farnaz thinks that she is morally superior to men like Dr. Shukla or even Mahatma Gandhi and would like to lecture them.

Dalits can be Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Sikh or Buddhists and they live in India, Pakistan, Bangladesh. It is a complex social & economic problem, except in the eyes or self-proclaimed moral purist like Farnaz.

Makes you wonder what the true motivations are, besides troublemaking.

Why does this "Farnaz" guy come in and troll every single editorial dealing with Hinduism and complain about Dalits?

I don't go into every Muslim article and claim that all Muslims are terrorists. Or go to Catholic discussions and claim they're all pedophiles. Et cetera.

Google the word "tolerance" Farnaz, and join us in the 21st Century.

I think the real point here is, however you dissect the numbers, 'religion' is an insufficient criterion to vote on, never mind claim guides democracy itself.

How bout thinking?

The facts at hand?

Gods know it'd at least be refreshing. Maybe even save our collective behinds.

I know, I'm picky. But is anyone seeing righteous absolutes here?

What is the connection between Hinduism and the continuing wretched oppression of India's two hundred Fifty million Dalit?

The Dalit?

The challenge is to unwrap that flag, and start treating knowledge as an asset to be acquired rather than an attribute to be spurned.

"The challenge now is to go beyond labels and names of our religions, and build a society that lives to their highest, transcendent precepts."

I hope I never see that day.

In a minute or two I went to the on-line 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica article on Hinduism and found a quite adequate discussion of that religion. (While the total population of the country has grown since that time, 70% of Indians were then Hindus.) Thus there is no reason why anyone in the U. S. should be ignorant of Hinduism or any other of the world's best known religions (probably more accurately described in that reference work than in most of the "serious" journalistic coverage (found, for example, in public broadcasting and the Washington Post). Instruction in religion best fits as part of intellectual history. Here the teacher at the high school level could suggest that interested students study reliable and objective encyclopedic works to understand the beliefs and practices of religions playing a significant part in history of the period of any study. Where papers are assigned, these could be possible subjects and need not be complicated. At higher levels one must risk exposing students to the biases of their teachers and their own lack of diligence and critical faculties. A significant source of the problem is the inattention to serious instruction by most of the denominations in the U. S. One could cite many of them, but since the Presbyterians can claim the most outstanding leaders of the 16th Century Reform, from Calvin to Knox (with many other great minds in between), one can note here how few Presbyterians regularly in attendance at Sun. services have a clue to what Calvin and others of this school believed and taught. Certainly their ministers are free to distance themselves from those beliefs and practices, but their neglect of objective teaching of those beliefs and practices arises from an attitude that is a major reason for the general ignorance.

S A J A N A S

Note: The "EK(1, Unno..)LAH'tiON "O.U.R." {O.ne U.niversal R.eligion} book, is derived from the [OUR]

U-N-i-V-E-R-S-E; which is the Apocalyptarion's Genuine but Holyi "CONSTiTUTION" and and "IT"s [OUR] "CLUASES" are the "Laws Of IT's NAture"! soo,

our O.U.R. is 1st, and the

The man-made U.S. Constitution & Clauses (A Miracle in its own Right) is 2nd, and all the religious Books known today are 3rd, or Last [to Magnify, Uphold & make Honorable].

SO, OUR HOlyi COsmic FEeler's FAith, via ou O.U.R., is a D-Y-N-A-M-i-C faith, Belief.. Better than Pre-Apocalyptic competing for gods Religion Systems!! All else

Are Stagnant/Static Jealous Pre-Apocalyptic Religio/Wannabe Systems and THEREFOE;

R' righteously, inevitably Being Left behind, as Promised In all their (NOt our) Infixus Books as mentioned above & so so many times, exclusively on 'ONFAiTH' here) and Human's are getting Scared of US!

"IT", regodless of what Stephen Hawings, or Richard Dawkins & Co. Say'th, that this is the Prophecy/Epoch/Era/TRANS{FiNITY. So

WE[i] EKlaht-iON's art on a Holyi Cosmic Move/Mission! Thus "SPACE-FORTH'ng US" & "FUTURE-BOUND'ng US" + more Good Tidings (After the Bad)!! O' J-E-A-L-O-U-S-Y, our Enemy.!

Note: As Eklaht-iON's, or Apocalyptarians (NOt OFF's) that WE[i] Keep our Friends Close BUT, our Enemies (The Delusional Godly Jealous One's) even Closer". So Beware of Them Human's who Speak and act in Fork Tongues.!

Secret (Opposite Revealation): The U.S. Government (Officials) are EUCHARIST-ADDICTS.

Explanation: Like Ye Prez (B.H.O.), not our, is Drunk With Rabbi Jesus Flesh & Blood. He, thay are possessed. Not even an Exorcist can help them. Our Hol;yi Government (which they Curs'th, Sin'th)), NOt theirs is Infested with NOCOLATAIN's, aka SYMBOLIC VAMPIRES & SYMBOLIC CANNIBALS!

GAYists + EUCHARISTs = ABOMINATION & PRE-Apocalyptic Behaviors. Example: Enforcing thei r (NOt our) DRUNK'n NOAD RACIST" Story on OUR, not their,S.S. Earth.

WE[i] art taking Over This Pre-Apocalyptic NATION 1st, then the Other Godly Jealous Nations, One at a Time!

VOTE: DEATH to THEOCRACY & MONARCHY on bless'th

(Zero Born in Sin nor via some Curs'th; maybe YeYo Kids & CO. are, but surely NOt US Eklaht-ion Kids & Family's)

S.pace S.hip Earth: aka S.S. BLUE-DOT, S.S. Geoid, S.S. Gaia, S.S. Tellus'ng something and more!

sure, teach religions in school. But, teach it is social studies and teach the origins of these religions as man made constructs and folk lore. This will counteract the religious fakery and prosteltizing to the gullible. The more kids learn abou the origins, history and use/misuse of religion the less likely they are to be fooled by it.

I don't buy into any specific religious tradition as having a lock on the truth including the one I was born into. I tend to the atheist/agnostic part of the spectrum. Having said that, there is nothing wrong with teaching ABOUT religion, but the problem is always some fanatic teacher who wants to convert people to a version of what he believes to be the truth.

Tread carefully.

Yep.

I think a lot of this angst is seriously misplaced. Most people that I know who are "religious" really haven't thought about it - especially critically. They are in the same religion that they were raised in and its just woven into the fabric of their lives. Athiests though often have started off from a religious upbringing and chosen to become athiest after much thought and deliberation. So of course I would expect athiests in general to be "more knowledgeable" (whatever that is supposed to mean) about facts about religion, only because they've had reason to critically think and analyze religion in ways that many believers have never had reason to. It shouldn't be a value judgement and it shouldn't be causing an uproar. And no - it shouldn't be used as an excuse to teach religion in public schools.

"O' 'IT' (Lord, if Ye/Yo not Mind),

O' 'IT' (NOt a 'HE/Him' nor a 'SHE/HER')

forgive them NOt, for S.pace-S.hip Earth's {Blue-Dot; of manymany) Human's, unlike Us HUUMATE(s) kinds, really know'th what they/Humans Do'th, yet they Deny'th or play Dumb (child like; Even as Grown-ups.) O' Corrupt Human(s)!

Behold: The "Religion Of Everything, Before The Science of Everything" is DISPENSED already here (on Blue-Dot); A Prophecy/Era/Epoch who's 'time' (via clocks/SUN/SOLARdials) via Holyi 'TiME' (TEMPerature) is Come'th! And

As Fore-Warned/Told in All Ye/Yo' iNFIXUS-BOOKS (Chumash/Bibles/Qurans.... and Geeta/Kangyurs/Tripitaka's...).

Hark: The "HOlyi COsmic FEeler's FAith is Come and will Preavail, by the Us HUUMATES [aka EKLAHt-iON's] and Save the MINDs/HEURISTICa/O's of Them for the Sake of our "FUTURE-BOUND & SPACE-FORTH MEMETiCAL's: and

Ultimately fo the preservation of our "O.U.R" [The Eklahtion's: 'O.ne U.niversal R.eligion']; good enough until the real END OF TiME!!

iMagine: A "SiNGULARITY" of All 5+-Major Pre-Apocalyptic SYSTEMS of Religions [PEACE BLESSING EPOCHs, aka AQUARiUS-Age), and NOt a "PLURALITY" (competing, hassling, Maiming//Killing over a Name for god(s), INSTEAD OF "IT", born from the WAR-BLESSING, Epochs, aka PiSCES, Kali AGE!?

Yes! Yes! WE[i] art Come fo Thee!

WHEREFORE: Magnify, Uphold & Make Honorable The "O.U.R"!

Note: Please Do Not be in denial To Self, loved ones nor Others. Do Not DENY, then DO [acts against HUUMATES or Humanity]. nor DO and then DENY what Ye/Yo Human's hath done or been Doing still, so soo PRE-APOCALYPTICALLY! PS: VEDiC nor ABEiC have No Escape, No Excuse on our (NOt yours) Holy S.pace-S.hip Earths.

"IT" is "TiME!" Believe, or Perish!

Atheism is not nihilism. Just because atheists harbor no fantasies of some wonderful afterlife doesn't mean that this one is meaningless. Such slander.