Tweeting Death

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"K A F i R" (A NOne iShmaeli/Esaui iSlami?)

"K A F i R"

"Kafir" "Kafir"

W H A T -- AN -- U G L Y -- W O R D(s)! Provoking!

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Worse Than The "N" Word That Was made NO Longer Usable in U.S.A Community (Ummah)et al.(Obscene like).

The (un) Holy Quran/Koran Needs To Get a Fixing, NOt only the Hadiths; 'aHBi-Bi's (Love's)! aye?

F I F A - W O R L D - C U P - 2 0 1 0:
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To me, the Utah Attorney General’s actions were not calculatingly callous, they were reflexively self-centered. The execution was just another opportunity for self-promotion through the use of piety and tough talk, all for the consumption of his constituency. If you are going to “tweet” while another human being is being put to death, that communication should be used to examine the moral aspects of capital punishment, pro and con.

I know that I feel deeply diminished when ever we perform an execution, but I am not ready to say that it should be abolished. I’m sure that there are others who deeply feel that justice has been rendered. Those visceral emotions are not unimportant and they should be part of the discussion, but they should not be the controlling element - not with so many other variables.

The Attorney General could have chosen to advance the cause of social understanding, but he chose to advance the cause of his political aspirations.

It isn’t which side of an issue that the media takes which is the problem with society, but rather which issues the media takes that is the problem. This week, the Washington Post’s “On Faith” has decided to discuss the morality of tweeting rather than the morality of the death penalty.

Tweeting death doesn’t trivialize life, killing people rather than taking the time, money, and effort needed to overhaul our penal system to actually rehabilitate criminals trivializes life.

You can read the rest of my response to this topic:
http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-8928-Philadelphia-Atheism-Examiner~y2010m6d22-On-Faith-The-morality-of-tweeting-the-death-penalty

I will be responding to every issue posted in the 'On Faith' section. If you would like to be notified when my new response is up, please subscribe.

I am a supporter of the death penalty, but I agree with the author's criticism of the Utah AG. To bring a "solemn" process into the world of "tweeting" is beyond the pale, particularly from a public official. The appropriate response to an execution is grief whether you support capital punishment or not. It's grievous that a human life is being lost, even if the taking of that life is justified. It's a grievous situation that murder transpired, that a human being fell to that level of evil. One should feel sorrow and also a true measure of humility rather than being glib in pronoucements of justice or power. In the movie, The Green Mile, one of the guards was particularly callous and disrespectful to the condemned while alive and dead. He was rebuked by Tom Hanks, who played the captain and another guard who said, "He's paid his dues and he is even with the law." The condemned man's sentence was death by execution. As an agent of the law and state, the AG had no right to add his moralizing to the process.

P.S. Those who believe in the efficacy of capital punishment do not all subscribe to the premise that it is simply and eye for an eye equation. Rather, it is the belief that the state has a duty to enforce laws in a manner that is right and reflective of the nature of the crime and the rights of those injured. It's not a cookie cutter prescription, but an approach that accounts for all factors in any given situation and one that promotes a rightful fear and respect for law and humanity.

this sentence appears in your article:

"private citizens, especially those most impacted by the murder,"

Matthew, this may come as a surprise to you and to many people in the media but it is NOT CORRECT in English to say, 'those most impacted by...'

The correct form would be 'those most affected by...'

You don't have to take my word for it. Ask any professor of English.

Nonsense. The Attorney General was just expressing his sense of the profundity of the situation in the terms most familiar to him. In doing so he also expressed his spontaneous compassion for the executed man.

To the author: Try to connect with your own heart and how others might express the same feelings in their own language and from their own point of view, not just through your projections.

What a sick individual Utah has for an AG! It just reinforces every negative image that I have of that state.

postoastie wrote: "Schmalz apparently hasn't lost a family member to Ronnie Lee. How nice."

No, it points to Schmalz having no bias in his writing, unlike he would if he had lost a family member to Lee. Revenge should have no place in American justice, but the Tweets seem to indicate otherwise.

postoastie wrote: "Thanks to the good people who do believe in this final punishment, Schmalz will Never lose a family member to Ronnie Lee."

No, that was thanks to the jail he was housed in, protecting the citizenry from Lee. His death adds nothing more to your safety.

postoastie wrote: "Schmalz is not a grateful man...or else he doesn't really care about his family."

Maybe we should execute everyone in jail? I really don't see your point. Must someone have fear and revenge in them to want justice via an execution? Is it a requirement? Which part of the bible said thou shalt execute?

postoastie wrote: "The death penalty is 100 percent perfect at preventing the evil Ron from killing again."

Assuming he truly was guilty. You realize I hope that there is a lot of documentation of innocent people executed. Or is it easier to ignore that in order to claim 100% effectiveness?

postoastie wrote: "Ron "trivialized life", Mr. Schmalz. Why don't you comment on that?
It matters not what my religion is...A killer gets killed. Big Whoop."

Please explain how killing Lee makes you safer than him locked away for life? And in any case, this is not about the right/wrong of capital punishment, it is about an AG who seems eager to advertise his executions. Why not just do it in downtown Salt Lake at noon, so those without Twitter feeds can benefit? The AG is a loser and should be reprimanded. If it was solemn, why tweet about it?

Schmalz apparently hasn't lost a family member to Ronnie Lee. How nice.
Thanks to the good people who do believe in this final punishment, Schmalz will Never lose a family member to Ronnie Lee.
Schmalz is not a grateful man...or else he doesn't really care about his family.
The death penalty is 100 percent perfect at preventing the evil Ron from killing again. Ron "trivialized life", Mr. Schmalz. Why don't you comment on that?
It matters not what my religion is...A killer gets killed. Big Whoop.

Attorney General was trying to be a man by treating the death nonchalantly. Thought I support the death penalty under certain circumstances, the act should never be treated lightly or with disrespect. This is not about revenge, but justice and justice must be sober. Clearly the AG was childish and profoundly disrespectful.

How are we a better society by having killed Mr. Gardner?

This was not justice - it was mis-spent revenge.

And the Attorney General was a twit for having tweeted.

I would like to ask a question of opponents of capital punishment.

If we could be certain, beyond all doubt, that the convicted person was guilty, would you still oppose capital punishment?

If so, would your opposition extend to the likes of Ted Bundy?

While the comments from both those who favor capital punishment and from those who oppose it are interesting, consider this...The Attorney General, unless I'm seriously mistaken (which I don't believe I am), was not physically present during the execution. It's not as though he was in the witness room giving a play-by-play. He was most likely sequestered with the Governor and other political figures waiting for the possibility of an 11th hour reprieve. That being the case, how are his tweets any different than those of any other citizen?

POPPYCOCK to the whole premise of this commentary. "Solemn" means serious, and most of these comments about Shurtleff's language is taken out of context and largely exaggerated. The press was able to text and tweet also during the execution, and they did. Get over it. Gardner did not give his victims mercy, he didn't even know them! He was just shooting to be shooting. At least he got to choose his manner of death-- his victims did not.

"tweeting" during your official duties, even if the 'duty' is rather distasteful?

VERY INAPPROPRIATE.

not that I want to know .. . . but, were his 'tweets' a breach of confidentiality---now broadcast to the entire US if they choose to look for them?

VERY, VERY INAPPROPRIATE!!!!

I couldn't care less if the prosecutor had been playing the Xbox while they dispatched that creep Gardner. As I see it, he received his just deserts. By all accounts Gardner had been a victimizer all his life, leaving broken victims in his wake. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

To the liberal commenter connecting death penalty to currency value and automobile industry health. Japan has the death penalty, and uses it, and they have a strong currency and a very strong automobile industry.

I'm against the death penalty. I believe that human beings have no right to take the life of another person, and that extends to the "state" as well as individuals.

That said, I went to court a few months ago to fight a traffic ticket (I won) and was told that I had to "check" my Blackberry in a locker before I could go through security.

Children are not allowed to use mobile phones in class. It's considered disrespectful to, and disruptive of, the learning process.

But this District Attorney could "tweet" during an execution? Quite frankly, his actions are not appropriate to his office, and he should be ashamed. School children are held to higher standards in the polite use of mobile technology. I cringe to think that someone with such poor personal judgement is part of a judicial system that determines the course of other peoples' lives.

our morals and values say hold violent criminals who harm innocents and if they commit the ultimate crime, they get the ultimate punishment? What kind of morals and values do you have? should we have put gardner in "treatment?" why bother when as far as I can tell, he's permanently cured of his disease.

nyerunner101 i haven't yet gotten to the comment that has so incensed you, but no, it's not a FACT, it's your OPINION and nothing more. Are you forgetting that gardner DELIBERATELY TOOK A MAN'S LIFE? You have an opinion, nothing more. I say capital punishment if underused, and that it should be carried out only by electric chair, gas chamber or hanging, and that firing squad and lethal injection are far too lenient. Never shot a man, but I've shot deer, rabbits, squirrels, and other game, and I'd feel less remorse shooting a violent criminal than I would bambi or thumper. Who are you that you're opinion is fact and the rest of us who don't agree are wrong? I might also remind you your opinion is in the minority in this country. People in Utah should be celebrating the death of pondscum, and one less living off the taxpayer dollar. You're no more right than anyone else. MORE AND SWIFTER EXECUTIONS! MORE AND SWIFTER EXECUTIONS! MORE AND SWIFTER EXECUTIONS! It's America we're all entitled to our opinions, but opionins don't turn into facts magically because one believes them. get over yourself.

People like leslieswearingen disgust me. Different opinion? We are talking about the taking of a man's life here. What kind of moral values do people like you have? Virtually none, judging by the insipid and ignorant comments you make.

The death penalty is barbaric and it is wrong and should have been left abolished by the Supreme Court in 1976. This is not an opinion. It is FACT. The stunning hypocrisy of a state like Utah is that it is run by a religion that frowns on dancing, drinking, and swearing. Apparently, however, there is nothing wrong with THE DELIBERATE TAKING OF A PERSON'S LIFE. Every person who lives in Utah should be ashamed.

A tempest in a teapot; much ado about nothing! This is a Media-made story because it is against the use of Capital Punishment, which is interesting, because the sleaze media has no problem with the slaughter of 4,000 infants a day through abortion.

Liberals are not just economic illiterates, they are also moral phonies!

This is disgusting, trashy behavior. How embarrassing for our country to have this kind of nitwit for an attorney general in one of our states. Pathetic.

Psolus:

Such internal inconsistencies are the hallmark of all poorly written fiction.

Tweet?
Welcome to the 21st Century. Why is this a story.

What a Putz. I would expect this from an AG in Texas or South Carolina. Why are Republicans so obsessed with Twitter? I remember Republican Congressmen giggling like schoolgirls and twittering away whenever they are addressed by Obama.

"An eye for an eye" is Old Testament Hebrew.
"Turn the other cheek" is New Testament Christian.

So, what happended?

Did god change his policies?

Is the current "turn the other cheek" policy up for review?

What are the alternative proposals?

This is not a BFD, it is just the viewpoint of one man. Lord have mercy people, get over it. What he did is well within the legal parameters for freedom of speech as established by the Supreme Court.
People can communicate ideas you don't agree with, deal with it.
And, don't use being offended or having hurt feelings as a way to manipulate or get others to shut up because they have the nerve to think differently than you do.

Tweeting is clearly the wrong way to provide information of this sort to a mass audience. Instead, it should have been done primarily via a website. Oh, wait...no, make that a television broadcast...no, no, it should have been on the radio instead...oh, uh uh, nope, should have been the newspapers, with the paperboy calling out the headlines...oh, rats, no that's not right either...the town crier, then...

People, we need to recognize that there's a big difference between a message and a medium. Also, it's not like this was an act which drove adoption of Twitter; Twitter is highly used and followed by many, which in turn provided a basis for using it as yet another means of disseminating a piece of information. The execution wasn't *only* announced on Twitter, after all...it was also on the TV, the radio, various websites, the newspaper...in fact, every means above (except for the town crier, that is). Adding one more way of getting the word out doesn't cheapen the message in and of itself.

BOZHOGG wrote:

"An eye for an eye? I thought it was "turn the other cheek".
Why can't you Christians decide?"

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"An eye for an eye" is Old Testament Hebrew.

"Turn the other cheek" is New Testament Christian.
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The meaning the Christians attribute to "an eye for an eye" is tit for tat, vengeance.

The Tanakh, however, sees things differently, and it is to that which Jews subscribe. "An eye for an eye" intends to set limits on debts. This Christian misinterpretation counts as one of many that the Christians have visited on the Bible.

In the interim, I have yet to see one "turn the other cheek." Neither have I seen such turning among Christian nations. "Turn the other cheek," "religion of love," blah, blah, and blah--alibis?

Worth considerin'....

Btw., Norrie, regards to cats.

He's a butcher, no more no less.....with the same respect for humans (and that hasn't anything to do with what the victim did, the DA just lowered himself to the same level)

BOZHOGG wrote:

"An eye for an eye? I thought it was "turn the other cheek".
Why can't you Christians decide?"

*****************

"An eye for an eye" is Old Testament Hebrew.

"Turn the other cheek" is New Testament Christian.

The only thing trivialized here is the person this man Murdered! Victims have no rights! What's there to take serious?
POSTED BY: MINCO_007 | JUNE 22, 2010 10:53 AM
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This may very well be the stup1dest comment EVER POSTED. Guess what Einstein??? You are correct. The victim has no rights because the victim is DEAD. Is this really that difficult for you to process???? That is EXACTLLY why we have the JUSTICE SYSTEM. They speak for THE VICTIM. Either educate yourself or keep your mouth shut and save a little dignity. Regardless of the fact that this man was a murderer the States attorney acted like a friggin 12 year old with a new toy. He needs to resign today and the Bar association needs to open an investigation into the matter. My guess is he’ll be disbarred. The rules and ethics are plainly stated and he has violated his oath.

So what do you want for this Murderer? Who gives what anybody was doing while he got what he deserves. There are no ethics for the likes of this Murderer. So if the Victim has no rights, then neither should the Murderer! The AG could pick his toes while this guy got his, who cares & why would they? You and this animal have no respect for human life! Why is the victim dead? Cause Whacko killed them. He's not an innocent man. He got to jerk the Justice system for 25 more years after his murders. I say we paid him enough attention moron!

The Bible is a very poor source for rules of etiquette unless you're interested in the proprieties of selling your virgin daughter, transferring ownership of your slaves, stoning your disobedient son, or shaving your beard.

Utah's mostly crazy.

Many state attorneys general are psychopaths, insensitive and cruel.

Put them together and this is what you get.

He's a Republican. Doesn't that say it all?

Posted by: ScottChallenger

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It doesn't say anything to me, Scott.

However, if I were chock full of personal prejudgements (aka - "prejudices") then it might say something to me.

Maybe if the media concentrated on the victim of this killer instead of someone's tweets.

Agree w/ ZZIM. This is just words for the sake of words. It's a lame article taking a position on something that didn't even need to be commented on. Pick a relevant topic; something that actually effects people in a real way, and pick a side.

"The Bible" and "Religion" now here in North America are no longer applicable to any train of thought now:

"The Bible" and "Religion" is Anti-Gay and even our President of the United States is Pro-gay (inviting the Mississippi Student to the White House coincidentally on the night of the Canceled Prom).

News reports of United States Army personnel stealing money in both Iraqi and Afghanistan War Theaters.

Without "The Bible" and "Religion" as a widely-accepted foundation for etiquette EVERYTHING will become trivialized

--even the term "sanctity" is obsolete because it has a "religious" meaning.

The very crime of "Murder" may eventually become obsolete because only "The Bible" and "Religion' say that "Murder" is morally unjust.

Since North Americans have "said" (through voting)that "The Bible" is no longer relevant, anybody can tweet anything they want.

Twitter tweeters are twits.

He's a Republican. Doesn't that say it all?

And to those who think this has been a big secret, you need to get out more. Evey time someone ANYWHERE in this country is executed it's reported by the media. The firing squad outings just get more press. And there is no denying that Utah allows the option of firing squad because of the LDS belief in blood atonement, whether anyone will say so or not.

This is a uniquely Utahn LDS attorney general, Mark Shurtleff represents the extreme right Mormons (the majority of Utah citizens) who just don't think like the rest of us mortals. Try living there for awhile, you'll get it but you won't want it!

The only thing trivialized here is the person this man Murdered! Victims have no rights! What's there to take serious?
POSTED BY: MINCO_007 | JUNE 22, 2010 10:53 AM
REPORT OFFENSIVE COMMENT
This may very well be the stup1dest comment EVER POSTED. Guess what Einstein??? You are correct. The victim has no rights because the victim is DEAD. Is this really that difficult for you to process???? That is EXACTLLY why we have the JUSTICE SYSTEM. They speak for THE VICTIM. Either educate yourself or keep your mouth shut and save a little dignity. Regardless of the fact that this man was a murderer the States attorney acted like a friggin 12 year old with a new toy. He needs to resign today and the Bar association needs to open an investigation into the matter. My guess is he’ll be disbarred. The rules and ethics are plainly stated and he has violated his oath.

He needs to be fired NOW!!!!

beowulf3 where are these secret shootingsof those who don't deserve it in state sanctioned venues taking place at this very moment? Gardner is either the third or fourth person to be executed by firing squad in this country since 1977.

The only thing trivialized here is the person this man Murdered! Victims have no rights! What's there to take serious?

Let us all weep for the poor killers who manage to evade justice for years on death row. Does America have a shortage of killers and vicious criminals that we are so concerned with their preservation? If your opposition to the death penalty is based on religion, re-read the biblical penalties. If it is based on just your opinion that it is wrong, all you have is an opinion that is no more weighty than any other.

Even by WaPo's declining standards of journalism, this puff piece reeks of cornball tabloid journalism. I almost thought it was satire.

Some 1860 Luddite would have cried foul if an attorney general sent news of an execution over telepgraph wires.

Hmm... every once in a while I come on these pages and read a bunch of words some guy wrote... then I realize that I have just read nothing at all.

This article is nothing more than verbal cotton candy, all air, zero substance.

Honestly, I can't see anything at all in this article worth commenting about.

The talon of 'an eye for an eye' was not about what *should* be done -- He was talking about setting a limit, since at that time there were punishments more akin to 'an eye for a stolen cup of flour'.

He was trying to set a limit... to tell people that retribution is wrong. But He was not saying that for everything, match up crime and punishment literally equally. He, in fact, is more focused on letting folks know that God will take care of justice.

That scripture has been taken out of context of what it is being said for and who it is being said to; and it has been done so in order to justify so many wrongs over the years.

people who don't deserve it our being shot in state sanctioned venues at this moment? Who? There have been three or four people executed by firing squad, all in Utah since 1977. Where are these secret shootings taking place? Must have missed the report on that one.

AG Shurtleff's actions in this instance are tacky and tasteless.

Don't care much about the tweeting. But, if as some have noted, the DP is such a great deterrent then why do states with it generally have more murders than states without it?

I'm opposed to capital punishment. Nonetheless, I think you have let your opposition to it cloud and color your arguments related to "tweets" from the AG, Michael. I believe tweeting was inappropriate and demonstrates a level of governmental callousness that underscores why politician should not be allowed to execute. Still, I think you are unnecessarily over reaching to make your point and perhaps, in the process, picking a fight with Christianity that is neither proper nor wise.

For example, you take issue with the use of "Solemn" and Elsewhere you say all of this "places the execution within the larger context of the Christian belief in a redeeming God." So is all of this meant to suggest some apparent conspiracy to attribute execution to divine intervention or divine justice?

I think there is a far simpler answer (and in life that's usually the correct answer). The speaker, or tweeter I guess, believes the things he is saying and those beliefs colors the langauge he uses no less so then you beliefs color what you wrote.

For example you say the use of the word "solemn" recalls the "sanctity of religious ceremony." I guess I'm just not seeing that. Most definitions I've thus far seen suggest as the first few definitions of solemn: (1) Deeply earnest, serious, and sober; (2) Somberly or gravely impressive. Well I don't think you can get much more serious or grave than an execution. So, why was that wrong to use? Why is that some underpinning for an argument about Christianity?

I think there is a simple answer -- your views on the subject are now speaking through the words of another speaker rather than your own....

sorry, not a solemn occasion to me or one that should be shown any deference, respect or dignity. What is wrong with you arancia12. Is it okay to tweet if you're at the vet's having a rabid dog put down? or should that rate also as a solemn occasion? I'll ask the same question, what's wrong with some of you. Why aren't you celebrating and dancing a jig when scum is removed from the earth and is no longer sucking our tax dollars?
I have no respect for violent criminals and murderers, they get way too much respect for my liking to start with. tweet, tweet, tweet, and when the scumbag dies, it's sweet, sweet, sweet.

My thanks to everyone for maintaining a really vigorous discussion with a great clash of perspectives.

A note on blood atonement. I do teach introductory courses on the LDS tradition. I asked my LDS friends about the blood atonement issue in relation to Utah's use of the firing squad. Most would not link the firing squad to blood atonement per se, although I think the issue is an interesting one historically. But it's also true that "blood atonement" is often used as part of anti-Mormon polemics and bigotry. It's certainly the case, whatever the status of "blood atonement" as doctrine in early Mormonism, that it no longer has a place within contemporary mainstream LDS life.

Mat

who cares what happens to these violent animals? "dehumanize?" Do these cretins treat their victims like humans? These are people who have demonstrated in the worst possible way that they have no regard for any human life but their own.
I don't see one thing that was "tweeted" that I have a problem with. Are we suposed to show more "respect" to the condemned. I have no respect for them, I have nothing but contempt and disdain, and think firing squad and lethal injection are too easy a way to go. Oooh, the needle might hurt going in. Good, I hope it hurts. These scumturds aren't worried about the suffering of their victims. Quit whining about the indignity of it all. Was his victim's diginity respected? his vicitim tried to hide from him but he found him and executed him and got what he had coming. Get rid of lethal injection, it should be electric chair, gas chamber or hanging. capital punishment opponents want us to hold the lives of animals in higher regard than they do the lives of innocents. Can't get with that.

What is the matter with some of you? Is there nothing solemn or sacred in this world anymore? Would you tweet during Church? A Baptism? A Mormon ritual? The death of your father or mother?

Technology brings great things but should be used with restraint. Just because something exists doesn't mean it should be used constantly.

Putting to death one of God's people is not entertainment. While it may be necessary it is a gamble we take with our souls too. Certainly people understand that necessary actions can also be solemn actions...

the tweeting official did not have to mention the victims' names in his release, believe me the families and friends know who they were.
this psychotic killing animal did not stop and reverence the lives of those he killed in cold selfish blood.
this very hot weekend in chicago, 3 people were killed, 8 more were shot, some very seriously wounded in a TWO day span.if any of these savages ever go to trial for their weekend shooting spree, there will be the bleeding hearts trying to protect them from the same fate they cavalierly imposed on their victims.
public hanging would be too charitable for some of these killers.
and lawyers are human beings too and should not be killed by a eye bulging cretin trying to escape punishment.even you and your loved ones deserve a better ending to your time on this earth.

I believe executing a human being is a solemn occasion and a secular occasion. If you believe in God at all you know that we are taking a life that God created, no matter how awful it is. That alone should call for somber reflection upon our actions, sorrow for the loss of a human soul, mourning for the innocent victims, and fear for our own souls.

Tweeting during an execution is the rock-bottom for American culture.

Did the first telegraph about somebody's execution trivialize it? Did the first radio report? Television?

Tweeting is just a form of communication.

As to execution, the only thing wrong with it in the US is the long time it takes from sentencing to the actual execution. Only the most clear cut cases should be tried for capital punishment and based on the highest standards of evidence - to include best efforts to exonerate the accused based on DNA.

The Posties think only the press has unlimited rights to be idiotic . Utah no longer has the Firing squad . This murderer had the option because he sat on death row for 25 years . Would the Posties deny him his rights under the law . The legal community in Utah is very small . We all knew Burdell and saw Nick Kirk everyday . Everyone called him a friend , and had no doubt he would take a bullet to the gut to perform his duty protect the court . We just didn't know after he did and after Burdell was killed some people would expect the law to forgive the shooter .

ps -- Utah gave up the firing squad in 2004. However, for the four murderers still on death row these many years later, the choice of the firing squad is strictly their own. As a matter of fact, choosing The Squad was probably always fully up to the murderers themselves, not the state. Murderers convicted after 2004 cannot chose that method of execution.

Unfortunately, the facelessness of blogs and tweets ans erased common decency in the country- even with people who should know better. Whether a man was guilty or not, whether the death penalty is wright or not- it is a huge thing to put another human being to death. If our elected officials trivalize it in such a way they transform it from real to computer game- how are children ever going to learn right from wrong in the country with such behavior?

The reason the theocracy called Utah is the only state that still has a firing squad is that Mormons, who will deny it, believe in "blood atonement" for murder.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_atonement

Shurtleff tweeting during the execution combines modern technology with old wild west technology to demonstrate the collective ignorance of Utah Mormons who claim to be "pro-life"

Ted Bundy, who murderered 30+, has not knowingly committed any additional murders -- or any crimes of any nature, since January 24, 1989. Coincidentally, that is the date he took a seat in Florida's "Old Sparky". Go figure. I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that Ronnie Lee Gardner will also be deterred from committing additional violent crimes.

The premature termination of Ted's human existence has saved not only a great deal of time and money for society, but countless other lives. As to these mysterious innocent people who've been executed, just tell me Ronnie Lee Gardner was innocent, then I'll believe. Else, I'm not the slightest bit interested.

Tweeting about it? Whatever...

The author teaches religion - what did you expect him to say - 'burn baby burn'? There are a lot of cry babies here in TX too, who are mostly ignored by everyone except the liberal press in Austin. TX just executed a cop killer who had spent 32 years on death row - an appropriate sentence for such an act.

What's wrong with the Judge tweeting directly to public.

Is the news media up in arms because they got cut out as the middle man and lost the opportunity to be the first one out with * BREAKING NEWS**??

It is the stupid and selfish people who make an issue when none exists.

so, if anyone, unemployed, broke and about to live on the street...
only have to kill someone to get a roof over their head, three square meals, healthcare and maybe even cable tv and possibly an education...
what would you do...
if you were that desperate...

And discussing this (invented) issue in an anonymous, online comment board (entries limited to 1000 characters?) elevates the discussion how?

If this isn't a case of pot calling kettle black, I've no idea what is.

In general I am for the death penalty if the person is really "deserving" by our normal modern human standards ie. child killer, serial killer, etc. but when I read what this guy did I was slightly on the fence..he killed a lawyer. Not right to be sure but is it a capital offense?? It left me a little conflicted...I think 10 years would have been enough...

I fail to see how or why tweeting immediately trivializes anything. It's simply another form of communication.

Aboout 800 people in the US are killed every year by those who have been convicted of murder, served some years in prison, and been released.
If you oppose the death penalty, you are condemning these innocent people to death in order to avoid killing the guilty.

I have never been concerned about the deterrent effect of the death penalty. Life in prison doesn't seem to deter either. The death penalty is the ultimate punishment given to those who have committed the ultimate crime, murder. I agree that tweeting is inappropriate, but so is a reporter asking someone "how do you feel?" after the death of a loved one. Those who oppose the death penalty argue that those who support it do not value life. It is people who murder who do not value life, until their own is on the line.

The Utah AG's play-by-play tweeting is simply callous and displays a lack of common human decency. It displays a failing on a spiritual level.
It seems to me he is more fit to be an executioner than a public official. His character defects must be a source of constant angst to his wife and children.

"public executions serve as a deterrent."
-----

And you support that statement with what citations and statistics?

The death penalty was once *thought* to act as a deterrent. Most hitmen aren't deterred because they believe they'll get away with it. Serial killers are compelled to kill so a death penalty means diddly to them. A person who kills out of anger or impulse? Do you really believe the death penalty is in their mind at that moment? Oh, wait - I won't kill this guy, I'll just maim him...

I think the Tweet was absurd. I don't know the story behind this man's execution but any execution is not cause for celebration. It exhibits a break down of human behavior on the part of the criminal and even of society.

I don't agree with the DP because occasionally someone is found to be innocent. I agree you cannot put someone to death solely on the concept of "beyond a reasonable doubt."

And eye for an eye? I thought it was "turn the other cheek"
Why can't you Christians decide?

I could only read the first paragraph of this article without feeling sick to my stomach. This is called progress?

Typical stinking no-good Utah pro-lifer.

These executions should be public. Not a pay per view event, but publicly done in the local area in which the criminal was convicted. Tweet or not, public executions serve as a deterrent.

The People have a right to know when our will is done and our public officials have an obligation to keep us informed in as timely a fashion as possible.

A year ago, someone would have called someone who would have put it out on the wires.

Why is press release any different from a Tweet other than that it takes a while to print and distribute?

Technology advances. Human nature, not so much.

Dearest Mathew:
Is it possible that you believe all of our lives have not been "trivialized" or otherwise put into bargain basement bins?
Several observations: 1.As a trashcan lid on the world, religion has backfired.2. A truly merciful shooting pierces the spinal cord, not the heart. But ritual prevents the marksmen from doing what they know is right. 4. People who don't deserve it are getting shot in state sanctioned venues even as I write this, yet your bathetic bent prompts you to mewl over a miscreant whose deeds you have no, repeat no, authority to overlook. 5. Lay off the doughnuts and other forms of white sugar death. Suicide is a sin, don't you know.

Did he do it ?- If there is really no doubt -Then fine - I don't care what anybody tweeted -

Mark Shurtleff is just as sick and twisted as the murderer he gloated over murdering!

Death really can't be trivialized, though the post-pagan religions try to accomplish that. Killing, on the other hand, can. Ask any suicide bomber. Tweeters help that process along. They should be challenged by name.

As a Utahn, nothing that Shurtleff does surprises me anymore. He is exceptionally careless (and thoughtless) about any number of matters, including the kind of basic ethics that should govern any AG's office, including conflicts of interest and campaign contributions. He regularly opines with unbounded ignorance on areas of the law about which he knows next to nothing. He's basically Sarah Palin w/ a J.D.

More directly to the point: last year, Shurtleff accidentally tweeted an early announcement of his plans to run for U.S. Senate - which he then tried to delete before it was noticed. So, we could debate whether Shurtleff's tweet diminished the solemnity of the occasion, or we can debate whether Shurtleff is even worth paying attention to as any form of moral indicator. Personally, I vote for the latter.

I was speaking of a current biographical sketch of the Emmitt Till situation in my Tweet. I understand your request to be more clear in my description. Thank you.

"I have Tweeted about the injustices involved in the Emmit Till situtation in the South."

You were tweeting back in 1955?

ThinkDeep,

So, if the U.S. banned all forms of execution, the dollar would strengthen against the Euro, and the auto companies would sell more cars.

I don't think that I can argue with such well thought out and articulated logic.

Utah's attorney general's decision is troubling to me, but not necessarily wrong. The attorney general (I am from Utah) has the right to speak his mind, but the consequence is that Mr. Matthew Schmalz, in turn, has the right to criticize his decision in the Washington Post. I think there are times when thoughtful comments about the terrible situation in Utah are appropriately given to news outlets. The death penalty being carried out in Utah is a big deal -- it is anywhere. Still, Twitter carries with it a sense of light-heartedness and speed perhaps best associated with professional dialogue or family encounters and not with matters of life and death. Maybe. Citizens of Iran in their election process would argue otherwise, perhaps. Religion is an intricate part of socio-decision making for many in Utah. Is it appropriate that the attorney general exposed his religious slant? I don't know. I believe in freedom of speech. I chose not to Tweet about the death penalty, but I would never say that the attorney general did not have the right to do it. I have Tweeted about the injustices involved in the Emmit Till situtation in the South. The death penalty perhaps stirs up in the hearts of everyone deep questions about good and evil, and sometimes we must speak our minds. I do not follow the attorney general's Tweets. I agree that there is a sanctity of life that should always be respected when discussing death.

Welcome to the barbaric states of USA.
I mean on one hand you have Europeans that have banned any form of execution and OTOH you have USA that executes people by firing squad. What is next America? Drawing people in Quarter! This is just one more indication of why European economies are doing MUCH BETTER that US economy as evident by:

1- Euro being so much more valuable than US Dollar

2- Europeans Auto makers doing fine while US ones went bankrupt, with 1 German Auto maker, VW, having a market valuation MANY MANY times of all US Auto makers combined and while in Germany Auto makers did not lay off even ONE German Auto worker while US Auto makers laid off 10s and 1000s of US Auto workers
etc. etc.

When is USA going STOP being such a backward jerkwater of a country!!!
More here:
http://RealNewsPost.com?n=think.34892

Matt,

You're welcome, and sorry for the ungrammatical sentence. Alas, I am again rushed, but do want to mention an interesting inquiry into capital punishment.

Last year, I had an entire section of freshman comp students research the issue. They were to begin by investigating the opposing view.

I was surprised to find that supporters no longer felt confident. A couple changed their minds entirely. All felt we must, at least, suspend capital punishment until and unless we can be certain of guilt in every capital conviction. Reasonable doubt, students maintained, is not enough when a life is at stake.

I have had the same results with abortion. Some students, almost always religious Catholics, will research abortion and decide that under some circumstances, it is justified. One or two have even concluded it must be allowed.

The same holds true for the rights of gays to marry.

It is difficult for all of us to change long held views, but it is possible.

Thank you for your interesting comments, Farnaz. I would agree with your characterization of the death penalty as a "spectacle" that undermines life.
Mat

The Christian "talon" gives lie to the notion that Christianity is the "religion of love." Certainly, the "talon" is not alone in this, but it does play a major role.

In fact, "an eye for an eye" was meant to set limits on debt, not to equate justice with identity of punishment. And, in fact, if Christians truly subscribed to such a notion, why would they not rape a rapist, torture a torturer?

No, Christianity has put murder in a class by itself, and so it should. However, that does not change the intent of an eye for an eye.

In Israel, there is no capital punishment. Only one man was executed in the history of the nation, and no other person will suffer capital punishment.

Capital punishment does not affirm the value of life, it undermines it. It is a spectacle. Ronnie Lee Gardner overstepped his rights as a citizen since only the government, we say, has the right to kill. But government's right to kill comes from citizens, does it not.

If one tweets about a marriage, is that marriage trivialized?

If one tweets about the birth of a child, is the birth of that child, or the child itself, trivialized?

Thanks, Eric.

Do you think there are any limits to what a private citizen could tweet about?

Mat

I agree with Matthew. Tweeting anything, particularly the death of a human being, immediately trivializes it. It's one thing if it were an average citizen doing the tweeting, but this was an officer of the state. He's been given a job to do and should at least act like he takes it seriously. Tweeting anything gives the opposite impression.