Obama's Brilliant Beginning

seriously do not understand why so many thought this was a great speech. I greet my Muslim friends with "Asalam aleikum" and believe that Israel is overstepping its "rights" to the land by oppressing the indigenous people be they christian or muslim (not sure there is an actual place called Palestine but to me that is not the real issue). But knowing the basic beliefs and history of Islam I was MOST concerned that a President who openly claimed Christianity in this speech would concede to "agree" that the Isra event actually happened. I certainly can agree that both sides need to compromise on matters of policy. BUT on matters of faith, no TRUE Christian would EVER cite the Isra event and thereby agree that Moses, Jesus and Mohammed prayed together. Christians do NOT believe that Mohammed was a prophet, but rather very misguided and perhaps even mentally ill and definitely NOT a saint or worthy of being taken to the heavens. They also could NEVER concede that Jesus, who had ascended to the heavens in His glorified body to be reuinted with the Father and Holy Spirit, would appear in anything BUT that glorified form again. And the Isra event was clearly crafted by Mohammed to try and trump the earlier historical story of Christ's transfiguration where Moses and Elijah descended from the heavens to witness to Jesus' authority and majesty as God. This was followed just weeks later by His ascension into the heavens. The Isra event is also the MOST important event to Muslims because it is through this event they believe that he was given superiority over all former prophets (supposedly then more important than Jesus) AND from this divine transport, also given divine sanction to spread Islam by ANY means such as wars, violence, oppression, whatever. So herein lies my BIG problem with President Obama and the others who helped him write that speech. In short, he did not just come out and say "all sides need to respect each other and play fair" what he REALLY did was agree to Islam's dominance over the Christian Gospel and gave the Muslim world the green light to take on the world and rewrite history just to make 1.5 billion people happy. A SAD SAD day for the rest of the world!

Obama is looking weak. He bending overbackwards to Muslims. Obama should be standing tall for the values that we hold, which we will not relent. Islam is inherently evil. Women are not even chattel. Shame on Obama.

Hsnknwj,

You asked a very important question. What is stopping Hindus ....

The answer: nothing is stopping them from addressing and reforming problems. If the society has flaws like unequal treatment of women, they try to fix it. It may take time to fully change things, but significant progress is being made. This is why India is progressing rapidly and Pakistan is struggling with modernity.

There is no Holy Koran or Prophet for Hindus, so they can question anything and change it. But people like you are like Reverend Wright that President Obama spoke about last year. Please listen to his speech. You seem to see the world as static and are pessimistic about peoples ability to change, reform, and improve. This is understandable if your identity is tied to a Holy Book like the Koran which cannot be questioned, ever, because it is the word of God.

However, the only constant is change. And Muslims will continue to fall behind on issues like women's rights and equality if you cannot change the Koran and its views. Hindus have made significant progress in the last two centuries on women's right and caste reform. As you know a recent President, current chief justice of the Supreme court, and current speaker of the Parliament are Dalits. Women are in positions of leadership as well. The current president, Sonia Ghandhi, and current speaker of the Parliament are women, not to mention past prime ministers like Indira Gandhi. The oppression of women has been and is an issue in all societies, but some are making progress faster than others.

I don't know about your fetish with urine drinking, but I'm sure there is an internet site out there for you. Otherwise, your desire to not acknowledge change and progress is revealing. You seem to harp on issues from the 1800's like Sati (which was partially in response to protect women from Muslim invader armies after battle). I presume you run around criticizing America for slavery even though that ended in 1865. Racism persists, but progress is being made.

So, why don't you focus your energy on reform and change within Islam. This way women's rights, violence, and terrorism will improve. You do seem to care a lot about women's rights in India. What do you think about muslim women's rights? Muslim women have more political and economic rights in Hindu India than in your Muslim countries.

Pamela says:
“Quoting from our holy book in support of his arguments demonstrated in a visceral way the respect with which Obama has pledged to approach the Muslim world and gave us hope that he is sincere about all the other hopeful plans he has set out.”

Muslims are eager to have non-Muslims, especially from Europe and the Americas show some respect for their Quran and their prophet. They go to great lengths to achieve this goal as if they need confirmation of what they profess on a daily basis. It seems that at some level they have doubts and since they base their whole identity on their religion, they do violently fight off any indication that might shake their tenacious hold on the ideology that defines their whole being. If they truly are convinced that their religion is from the Creator then they would leave it in the Creator’s hand to defend His religion.

hsnkhwj:

You posted to me on Stevens-Arroyo's thread, but I did not post there. We are positioned differently, hsnkhwj, but social positioning does not necessarily lead to single-system seeing.

I'm not a binary thinker, if that is the fear your post was meant to suggest, nor do I think you are. My thinking, however, is imperfect, still in the making. Also, remember we are in the bloggosphere, not "reality," which, in our case, might be a coffee shop or cafe, in which we could speak freely, thoughtfully.

If we were in such a setting, your post on India wouldn't have taken the form it does. (And you don't even mention the shanagagins in Bangaladesh and elsewhere!) Every once in awhile, some threaders do managae to have an intelligent discussion, often notwithstanding, or despite, the
venue, the essay they're blogging in response to.

So far, I've held off on Pamela. That may not last, however, so be prepared. I admire the restraint you've shown thus far, hsnkhwj, but as you have just demonstrated, the bloggosphere seeks something else of us. Then, too, restraint is not always the right path.

That's a pity. Some had envisioned the web as the hall for 21st century town meetings.

Btw., if you are interested in Catholic thinking at a higher level, I'd stick with Tom Reese. Google him. Impressive. Very.

Farnaz

Clearthinking:

Who is stopping Hindus of India from dismantling the caste system?

Who is stopping the Hindus from refraining to promote urine drinking?

Who is stopping Hindus from not killing young brides for the sake of dowry?

Who is stopping Hindus for refraining from killing widows by pushing them on the funeral pyre of their dead husbands?

Who is stopping Hindus from not worshiping lingum?

It is best to ignore people who claim to be thinking clearly, but are really just biased and hell-bent on seeing Armageddon happen. The world is never a perfect place, but right now there is a definite possibility for peace, and true clear thinkers will strive in that direction.

Clearthinking1 - you don't have to look very far for Christian terrorists. Just go to Wichita.

Pamela,

You ask a lot of questions in this article about what actions Obama and America will take following the magananimous speech by President Obama.

Here is a question for you. What will Muslims do to reciprocate to Americans for this gesture?

My guess: nothing.
Muslims will demand more respect, more apologies, more money from America.

As a self-appointed spokesperson for Muslims, where is your apology? If you are so willing to accept an apology to the Muslim world, how about accepting responsibility for Muslim actions like terrorism?
Oh. I forgot that only those "extremists" who have "hijacked" your "religion of peace" can accept responsibility for actions taken against kafirs as directed unequivocally in the Holy Koran. The silent, smirking majority of Muslims have been extraoridinarily quiet about the "extremists" in their own countries, cities, families, homes, and perhaps their own minds for centuries. What's changed?

You wrote: "There are some Muslim countries who are no doubt ready and eager to move forward." Who's stopping them from moving forward and stop supporting and apologizing for terrorists? Remember, Pakistanis signed a peace deal in Swat Valley with terrorists. It was Obama who forced Pakistan to fight the Taliban Terrorists, not the "moderate, nonextremist" muslims such as you, Eboo Patel, or Fareed Zakaria. All of you supported the Swat deal because nonmuslims just don't understand Sharia law and muslim culture.
We get it. Do you?

I think there is too much hope hanging on Barak Obama’s overture to the Muslim world. There are going to be a lot of people who are going to be disappointed. After all Obama can accomplish in the Middle East only what he is allowed to do by the American Jewish community and their right wing Christian allies. I think the Israelis are and have been ready for a final settlement of important issues regarding peaceful coexistence with their Palestinian neighbors but the American Jews keep on meddling and exasperating the situation to such an extent that makes a meaningful peace out of reach for the foreseeable future.