Religious Convictions Need Not Impede Search for Common Ground on Societal Issues

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T am trying to think of poaaible competing truths. Perhaps:
1. God created the heavens and the earth
1a. Living organisms evolve
2. God - The Christian God - is love and "God so loved the world"
2a. Except a person believe in Christ he can not be saved = will be damned.
3. Whatsoever ye shall ask in the name of the father shall be granted
3a. Not all prayers are granted.
4. "I and my father are one" "If ye have seen me ye have seen the Father"
4a. Stephen (Acts 7:55-56) was filled with the Holy Ghost (1) and saw God (2) and Jesus (3) standing on the right hand of God (3 members of the God Head)
5. "Except a man be born of the water (baptism) and the spirit (gift of the Holy Ghost) he can not enter the kingdom of God"
5a. If ye believe in Christ ye shall be saved

Can you come up with other examples of "competing truth"?

GA Atheist is right, the number is 93%. That is, 93% of the TOP scientists (ie the smartest and most active) dont believe in god. I think that is a pew poll ---anyways its very often cited by both believers and non-believers

Here ya go:

"A recent survey of members of the National Academy of Sciences showed that 72% are outright atheists, 21% are agnostic and only 7% admit to belief in a personal God."

Okay, I was wrong...only 93%

GA_Atheist quote:
Fact being that about 95% of the top scientists do not believe in god

"Fact" huh? Then you should no problem coming up with a source for this "fact". We'll all be waiting patiently...

My rational thought is based on a book that is the Living Word of God. My position is to be conformed to the Word. Gay Marriage is a sin. The average lifespan is cut in half for gays. I grieve for those people because they are blind to what God designed for marriage.

Debbie Wimmers: (regarding gay marriage)
"Because I abide by the bible. It's sad that 50 percent of all marriages end in divorce (churched or unchurched)

So once again...you base your decisions on a book rather than by rational thought.

One more time, how does it affect you that two men get married?

"It's the lack of relationship with God. Madeline OHare made sure of that 40 years ago. Students in private schools do better than those in public schools."

this doesn't "mesh" with my previous point of:
why the majority of "religious" countries are the worst in human treatment, economic development/growth, etc.
And because of religion, our students are falling behind other less religous societies in engineering and other fields...instead of advancing technology (which we used to lead) we are now falling behind

Students in private schools (which are not all religous) do better because usually there are less students per classroom. It has nothing to do with religion.
Where's the correlation between religion and being smarter?!
If anything, non-religious people are smarter. Fact being that about 95% of the top scientists do not believe in god.

Frankly, I'm surprised that the media -- especially Fox News Channel -- hasn't made a peep about this conversation. I'm a bit more surprised that "Freeing God's Children" author Allen Hertzke isn't part of this debate: he's the one who documented American evangelical leadership in the ecumenical alliance to defend human rights abroad, especially religious liberty. Perhaps now, God is back, and this time, He's here to stay. It's long past time for the United States of America to start reasserting its religious and cultural exceptionalism and/or identity to fortify its own intellectual spinal cord against the combined tactical attacks of premodern Islamic fascism and postmodern Marxist relativism.

Dear 'faith matters',

Concerning your comment,

"Hi Richard, nice to see you on this panel... too bad Roy Herron kicked you butt all over CNN a few weeks back!"

I think you trying to say,

Hi Richard, nice to see you on this panel...(in my personal evaluation, based on my ignorance of what these two men our actually talking about) Roy Herron was more closely aligned to my own personal beliefs and therefore, "kicked your butt" all over CNN a few weeks back!

I do not see this as a "butt kicking", if you define "butt kicking" as a Democrat being mad at a Republican for being a Republican and upholding values of a particular faith based on the foundation of that faith, namely, the Bible, then I see your point. Both men claim to be men of faith in Jesus Christ, and therefore base all truth claims from the same source, I would challenge you to go and compare each of these men’s stances on key issues of ethics and morality and see which one is correctly aligned with the scripture they both claim.

The real debate is over the authority of the Bible against the pull of cultural drift.

Debbie Wimmers:

I guess right to life doesn't extend to people in Darfur, or in all the people killed in name of religion through out the years...

There are people now that are doing something about that. It is a long process. there are ministries that are sending food and supplies to Durfur.

Why do you care who gets married?!
How does it affect you in the least?!

Because I abide by the bible. It's sad that 50 percent of all marriages end in divorce (churched or unchurched) That is why the AIDS epedemic is so bad and it's going to get worse.

"The nation is so messed up because we have taken the bible out of government and schools"
Yep, that's the reason the country is messed up, no bible in schools!

That's why the majority of "religious" countries are the worst in human treatment, economic development/growth, etc.
And because of religion, our students are falling behind other less religous societies in engineering and other fields...instead of advancing technology (which we used to lead) we are now falling behind.It's the lack of relationship with God. Madeline OHare made sure of that 40 years ago. Students in private schools do better than those in public schools.

Debbie Wimmers:

"The Republication Platform stands on conservative issues like the right to human life and marriage between one man and one woman"

I guess right to life doesn't extend to people in Darfur, or in all the people killed in name of religion through out the years...

Why do you care who gets married?!
How does it affect you in the least?!

"The nation is so messed up because we have taken the bible out of government and schools"
Yep, that's the reason the country is messed up, no bible in schools!

That's why the majority of "religious" countries are the worst in human treatment, economic development/growth, etc.
And because of religion, our students are falling behind other less religous societies in engineering and other fields...instead of advancing technology (which we used to lead) we are now falling behind.

The Republication Platform stands on conservative issues like the right to human life and marriage between one man and one woman. I realize Mark Foley and others have crept into the mix but I don't judge the whole party. The Democrats, on the other hand, are against these issues most of the time. Barney Frank is one that really shouldn't have a leadership role because of his reputation. The nation is so messed up because we have taken the bible out of government and schools. It's blasphemy seeing someone swear on the bible when they don't believe everything in it.

Nice comment Maurie Beck. Are you a writer of some sort? Anyways, Mr. Land is a fool, like all other religous zealots. That should be clear to anyone who values tolerance, intelligence, and compassion for all (including non-christians).

Mr. Land, you say that only god has a monopoly on truth right? which god exactly? Your god or muhammed? or vishnu? or the jewish god? ohhh, ok. Your god. The christian god. So you say, 'after consulting all the gods available for my belief, I believe that jesus christ has a monopoly on the truth'
so you are saying that you have a monopoly on truth, because you interpet the bible as absolute truth. thats a manmade statement of truthful authority.

if you were alive in the middle ages, you would have been a crusader.

** To Richard Land re TRUTH: You said, "God alone has a “monopoly” on truth. He is Truth—which means that truth is defined in relation to the God revealed in Scripture."

Just wondering, are you saying this is _the_ definition of 'truth' or are you saying it's _your/your religion's_ definition/means to assess 'truth'? I understand that it's at least your assertion so it's what's true for you. Does that mean that anyone who doesn't know/understand/accept scriptures can't ever get 'truth'? Or are you referring to particular kind of 'truth'? Perhaps some others who know Land can speak to this.

** To Maurie. LOL (and of course I'm not taking you seriously just in case anyone is unsure/confused by that ;))

** To Debbie. CONSERVATIVE ISSUES Well, I'm not interested in a church & state debate despite your introduction of politics here, but I am interested in what you mean by 'conservative issues.' What are these to you? For me, 'conservative' can mean alot of things. In some ways I would consider myself 'conservative' since I tend to 'conserve' (e.g., water, energy); am 'conservative' in my consumption; tend to be wary of really extreme points of view; and am otherwise moderate in life. OTH, I also like promoting positive change (which in some translations of 'conservative' wouldn't be the case). I'm not a person of the USA (though I am North American), if I were, I'd probably be a Democrat because I see their policies and practices more in line with this 'conservative' nature; more concerned with conservation and protection of environment and life-source resources.

So, do tell me, what is it you mean by 'conservative issues'? And how does this relate to 'truth' and belief systems? Just wondering. . .

FSC

Hi Dr Land, Glad to see you have another blog.

To everyone else, I stand up for Dr Land anytime. The democrats don't know what they're saying because they don't support conservative issus.

quote: That is different than asserting they have a “monopoly” on truth.

quote: A “monopoly” concerning religious truth implies a human claim to omniscience that virtually all Christians, and many non-Christian faiths, reject.

Fine. No one understands completely or implements perfectly whatever set of morals they live by. That doesn’t excuse the faithful from thinking that their set of morals come from the one true source. I can see no point in Mr. Land’s observation other than to dodge the issue. To the extent that the faithful think that they alone study from the “monopoly on truth”, to that same extent they are obstacles to constructive debate.

quote: As to the question of “conversation” and “common ground,” it seems both counter-productive and wrong to argue that one must have doubt as a virtue and requirement for dialogue with other faiths who have competing truth claims.

It seems wrong to you to enter into debate open to the idea that you might not be correct in all the faith based truths you believe in? What an insight into this kind of thinking! Inflexible and proud of it! That should scare the bejesus out of reasonable people. If you enter into a debate about embryonic stem cell research armed with the “truth” that God abhors it, how can you be anything other than an obstacle to a fair exchange of ideas?

It could be argued that everyone has such entrenched “truths”. Being an atheist/agnostic, the absolute I decide an issue by is its effect on happiness and suffering. I will not condone anything that decreases net happiness or increases net suffering. The difference of course is that this is an absolute drawn from human experience that we all can agree with. This does not mean we have to agree on predicted effects on happiness and suffering, but it at least provides a constructive base for debate.

So “societal debate is possible” among the faithful. So what? It’s also “possible” to sink a basketball with a full court shot with you back to the basket while receiving confident and contradictory distance and direction information from blindfolded teammates. The chances increase dramatically, if the blindfolds are removed and objective criteria alone are used to make the shot.

The full court “shot” in today’s world is avoiding devastating attacks from faithful terrorists encouraged by the incompetence of faithful “leaders”. It’s time the rest of us start screaming from the stands, “No more blindfolds!”

Hi Richard, nice to see you on this panel... too bad Roy Herron kicked you butt all over CNN a few weeks back!

See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZS7gUuk7yCI

I am part of the communist, jewish, atheist conspiracy of international bankers; you know, the ones who control the world's media and finance. Like any self-respecting jew, I'm an atheist secular humanist; in other words a moral relativist. Hope you don't hold that against me, but as true believers assert, without a belief in jesus, there can be no morality. I know this is true, because I rape and pillage every chance I get. I'm especially happy though, that christians believe in jesus, because you can just imagine the additional mayhem they would be up to, besides tousing alter boys and burning people at the stake, without their higher moral sense.

Many christians believe that the jews killed jesus. I just want to say once and for all, it's true; we killed your lord. Get over it. We also drink the blood of Christian babies, but only on holidays. The one thing that irks me is that I wasn't in on the original nailing part (I wasn't born yet) and I hate being accused of something without the satisfaction of being guilty. Fortunately, the apocalypse is at hand and I've got my hammer and nails ready for the second coming.

I'm not sure how anyone can have a reasonable conversation when the other party invokes faith. As Harris puts it, it's a conversation stopper. How is one supposed to convince another that their contention is wrong, if the person won't allow it?

The church is the only place that you will find people telling you not to question what you are told... anywhere else, this is encouraged. its pretty sad.