A Refreshing Look at Character

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If it's 'about character,' ...even if defined as 'How good are you with right-wing-Christian Christian slogans?' ...why has there been less concern about Warren implying McCain was in this 'cone of silence' of his....

When he wasn't...

And McCain claimed he was in this 'Cone of silence' jokingly-saing he was trying to 'hear through the wall...'

When he wasn't...

This was about a de facto religious test for office.

As for character, we need only look at how the 'game' was played.

What an idiot the man is. All Warren did was to throw softballs... that's right just waste everybody's time and don't get to the meat of any issues. We wouldn't want to clear away any of the post modern haze so that people could come to an actual decision based on their principles!

But of course that's how closet-Mormon Mouw would like people to treat religious differences. How sad he must be that Romney didn't make the cut.

There is a big difference between spirituality and religion. Spirituality doesn’t have any dogma, fiction, or perversion. Spirituality is simply based on everything being connected and part of one body, with One Being behind it all. This is what Jesus A Christ was trying to communicate. It is that simple.

Politics being how various needs and wants are expressed and met or obtained how combined efforts are implemented and what joint ventures are formed and funded. Politics should include the view that we are all one; part of the same body. Religion should not be involved in Politics because it has become perverse in the eyes of the Lord it has become the house of hypocrisy not the House of God.

What is disturbing is how fast both candidates were swept into the Illusion, each not daring to question the popular fiction.

CHURCH: a body or organization of religious believers

FAITH: a system of religious beliefs

There is no difference yet neither candidate questioned it and was able to see through the Illusion created by Rick Warren. In other words he was propagating a fiction.

RELIGION IS AN EGO CREATION NOT ONE OF SPIRIT - scripture says and we are warned that the Churches (institutionalized religion) are the Antichrist; which must be true if we have Faith in Scripture?

McCain with his understandable doubts about the existence of a God resulting from his experience in prison camp, and Obama doesn’t really buy the Jesus died for our sins crap.

Jesus was a Jew and not a Christian. Furthermore the Christians should be thanking the Jews for crucifying Jesus since their act actually redeemed Christians, Jesus could have just committed suicide to die for your sins right?
What this character Jesus did was refuse to buy into the worlds fictions and he set the ultimate example of being steadfast in the truth.

Religion is one big fiction, and it was people protecting The Religion that crucified Jesus because he questioned the fiction and saw through it.

So if anyone really wants to honor Jesus, start ripping the fictions apart with your rational logical discerning minds and live steadfast in the truth, don’t sell out to the ego empire.

Remember a divided people are a weak people. This is what allows 10,000 to take advantage and make subservient the other 300 million people in the United States.

Religion is being used to divide you amongst your selves, in the US and other countries. It is one of the most effective weapons of the source disconnected ego to protect it's fictional world. Religion is a behavioral control mechanism a producer of shame, guilt and irrational conformity.

Most people have no idea what love is, because love that comes with a condition is not love. There is only one source of love, and one can choose to be a channel for it or not.

Why die and go to Heaven when you can bring it to you?

If I recall correctly Jesus once said something like “I am in your world but not of your world”. He was speaking of the world of fiction that most are living in which still persists today but looks like it is in it's end days and the Ego empire is going to fall.

Divine Source connected - Ego Divine
Divine Source disconnected - Ego Bastard

Yes, faith meaning trust is a verb not a noun. The word has been perverted by the Ego and made into a false idol.

Quoting "An atheist or agnostic running for office has every right to use such an occasion to speak about the basis for the convictions that shape his or her policy views"

The Words of Solomon, “Hearken unto thy father that begat thee, and despise not thy mother when she is old”

And Samuel told him every whit, and hid nothing from him. And he said, It is the Lord: let him do what seemeth him good.
And Samuel grew, and the Lord was with him, and did let none of his words fall to the ground.
And all Israel from Dan even to Beersheba knew that Samuel was established to be a prophet of the Lord.

And again the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah.
For the king said to Joab the captain of the host, which was with him, Go now through all the tribes of Israel, from Dan even to Beersheba, and number ye the people, that I may know the number of the people.

“from Dan even to Beersheba, and number ye the people, that I may know the number of the people.”

Judah and Israel were many, as the sand which is by the sea in multitude, eating and drinking, and making merry.
And Solomon reigned over all kingdoms from the river unto the land of the Philistines, and unto the border of Egypt: they brought presents, and served Solomon all the days of his life.
And Solomon's provision for one day was thirty measures of fine flour, and threescore measures of meal,
Ten fat oxen, and twenty oxen out of the pastures, and an hundred sheep, beside harts, and roebucks, and fallowdeer, and fatted fowl.
For he had dominion over all the region on this side the river, from Tiphsah even to Azzah, over all the kings on this side the river: and he had peace on all sides round about him.
And Judah and Israel dwelt safely, every man under his vine and under his fig tree, from Dan even to Beersheba, all the days of Solomon.

“from Dan even to Beersheba, all the days of Solomon.”

And Hezekiah sent to all Israel and Judah, and wrote letters also to Ephraim and Manasseh, that they should come to the house of the Lord at Jerusalem, to keep the passover unto the Lord God of Israel.
For the king had taken counsel, and his princes, and all the congregation in Jerusalem, to keep the passover in the second month.
For they could not keep it at that time, because the priests had not sanctified themselves sufficiently, neither had the people gathered themselves together to Jerusalem.
And the thing pleased the king and all the congregation.
So they established a decree to make proclamation throughout all Israel, from Beersheba even to Dan, that they should come to keep the passover unto the Lord God of Israel at Jerusalem: for they had not done it of a long time in such sort as it was written.

“from Beersheba even to Dan, that they should come to keep the passover”

And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel.
And David said to Joab and to the rulers of the people, Go, number Israel from Beersheba even to Dan; and bring the number of them to me, that I may know it.

“Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel”
“number Israel from Beersheba even to Dan; and bring the number of them to me, that I may know it.”

My son, if thine heart be wise, my heart shall rejoice, even mine.
Yea, my reins shall rejoice, when thy lips speak right things.
Let not thine heart envy sinners: but be thou in the fear of the Lord all the day long.
For surely there is an end; and thine expectation shall not be cut off.
Hear thou, my son, and be wise, and guide thine heart in the way.
Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh:
For the drunkard and the glutton shall come to poverty: and drowsiness shall clothe a man with rags.
Hearken unto thy father that begat thee, and despise not thy mother when she is old.

These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens,
And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the Lord God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.
But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
And the Lord God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
And out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

“heavens and of the earth” “earth and the heavens”
“there went up a mist from the earth”
“watered the whole face of the ground”
“Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground”
“breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.”
“out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight”
“the tree of life also in the midst of the garden”
“good for food”
“the tree of knowledge of good and evil”

And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

“My spirit shall not always strive with man”
“his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.”

And Moses went and spake these words unto all Israel.
And he said unto them, I am an hundred and twenty years old this day; I can no more go out and come in: also the Lord hath said unto me, Thou shalt not go over this Jordan.
The Lord thy God, he will go over before thee, and he will destroy these nations from before thee, and thou shalt possess them: and Joshua, he shall go over before thee, as the Lord hath said.

“I am an hundred and twenty years old this day”
“I can no more go out and come in”

Give ear, O ye heavens, and I will speak; and hear, O earth, the words of my mouth.
My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass:
Because I will publish the name of the Lord: ascribe ye greatness unto our God.
He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

“Give ear, O ye heavens”
“I will speak; and hear”
“O earth, the words of my mouth”
“My doctrine shall drop as the rain”
“I will publish the name of the Lord”

Then said the Lord unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no.

“I will rain bread from heaven for you”
“the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day”
“I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no”

Then I will give you rain in due season, and the land shall yield her increase, and the trees of the field shall yield their fruit.
And your threshing shall reach unto the vintage, and the vintage shall reach unto the sowing time: and ye shall eat your bread to the full, and dwell in your land safely.
And I will give peace in the land, and ye shall lie down, and none shall make you afraid: and I will rid evil beasts out of the land, neither shall the sword go through your land.

“I will give you rain in due season”
“the trees of the field shall yield their fruit”
“sowing time: and ye shall eat your bread to the full, and dwell in your land safely”
“I will give peace in the land”
“I will rid evil beasts out of the land, neither shall the sword go through your land”

And it shall come to pass, if ye shall hearken diligently unto my commandments which I command you this day, to love the Lord your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,
That I will give you the rain of your land in his due season, the first rain and the latter rain, that thou mayest gather in thy corn, and thy wine, and thine oil.

“the first rain and the latter rain”

But the land, whither ye go to possess it, is a land of hills and valleys, and drinketh water of the rain of heaven:
A land which the Lord thy God careth for: the eyes of the Lord thy God are always upon it, from the beginning of the year even unto the end of the year.
And it shall come to pass, if ye shall hearken diligently unto my commandments which I command you this day, to love the Lord your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,
That I will give you the rain of your land in his due season, the first rain and the latter rain, that thou mayest gather in thy corn, and thy wine, and thine oil.

“drinketh water of the rain of heaven”
“A land which the Lord thy God careth for”
“I will give you the rain of your land in his due season, the first rain and the latter rain”

The Lord shall open unto thee his good treasure, the heaven to give the rain unto thy land in his season, and to bless all the work of thine hand: and thou shalt lend unto many nations, and thou shalt not borrow.
And the Lord shall make thee the head, and not the tail; and thou shalt be above only, and thou shalt not be beneath; if that thou hearken unto the commandments of the Lord thy God, which I command thee this day, to observe and to do them:

“the heaven to give the rain unto thy land in his season”
“to bless all the work of thine hand”
“the Lord shall make thee the head”

Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

“Unto the woman he said”
“I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception”
“in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children”
“thy desire shall be to thy husband”
“he shall rule over thee”

Then Moses heard the people weep throughout their families, every man in the door of his tent: and the anger of the Lord was kindled greatly; Moses also was displeased.
And Moses said unto the Lord, Wherefore hast thou afflicted thy servant? and wherefore have I not found favour in thy sight, that thou layest the burden of all this people upon me?
Have I conceived all this people? have I begotten them, that thou shouldest say unto me, Carry them in thy bosom, as a nursing father beareth the sucking child, unto the land which thou swarest unto their fathers?

“Moses said unto the Lord”
“Wherefore hast thou afflicted thy servant”
“wherefore have I not found favour in thy sight”
“that thou layest the burden of all this people upon me”
“Have I conceived all this people”
“have I begotten them, that thou shouldest say unto me”
“Carry them in thy bosom, as a nursing father beareth the sucking child”

David T:

I don't think this qualifies as a religious test in the way the Constitution means. I think this was a good opportunity for the candidates to be straight about their beliefs, and in an environment a lot more conducive to that than we usually see. Whether they succeeded or not is obviously open to question. If I were a candidate, I would not hesitate to be a part of this particular pastor's forum, even though I am a card-carrying heathen. It would probably lose me some votes, but I wouldn't want people to vote for me if they didn't have at least some understanding and acceptance of my views. Any candidate that would want those votes is a just careerist feeding at the public trough.

Interesting that the U.S. Constitution specifically says there should not be a religion test to be elected to office - yet it seems most Americans and especially the religious leaders want to make sure that part of the Constitution is forgotten.

And that explains why Senator Obama came across looking like a bumbling oaf even before McCain took the stage exactly how? Obama got another chance to look like that different kind of politician he's always prating about and again came off as same ole same ole.

Get it through your head dude the only difference between Jimmy Carter, Barack Obama, Michael Dukakis and Walter Mondale is skin color. Its the same duplicitous campaign pretending to be something other than the leftist he is because he knows the people between the mountains won't vote for that crap.

And, a not-so-refreshing look at Xian mendacity: apparently Rev Warren was fully aware that John McCain was nowhere near his church or his imaginary cone of silence when he assured the world that McCain was AT THAT VERY MOMENT sequestered and unable to hear the questions posed to Obama and the answers given by Obama to Warren.

The truth?: McCain was actually in his motorcade at the time, fully able to hear both questions and answers during Obama's session. And now comes late word that McCain may have also have been given the questions in advance.

The Purpose-driven LIE, perhaps? Another notable example of Xians having no problem lying for Jesus, and of a candidate who will lie just as readily as do the Xians if it suits his purpose.

"There would be very little criticism, if any, if both candidates sat and talked about their moral and political convictions at a gathering of the League of Women Voters or the NAACP. But as soon as it happens in a religious context the predictable "separation of church and state" stuff gets going."

I fear the day when the "separation of church and state stuff" FAILS to get going. That it is currently "predictable" that such "stuff" gets going when our politics is moved into a "religious context" speaks extremely well of the fact that in SOME quarters, the Constitution and it's spirit is STILL respected, regardless of the oppressiveness that Xians are bringing to bear on today's political landscape.

Perhaps Rev Mouw feels differently? Perhaps he believes that the Constitution is subservient to his particular religious beliefs? Perhaps he believes that the Constitution should just shut up when it comes to that wall of separation it so firmly erected between church and state? His column today indicates in no uncertain terms that he holds such a belief.

Mouw also writes:

"An atheist or agnostic running for office has every right to use such an occasion to speak about the basis for the convictions that shape his or her policy views."

Last I looked, there are no atheists running for president, so your kind "offer" of allowing a non-existent candidate equal time to address your religious litmus test rings just a bit hollow, doesn't it?

If turnabout is fair play, rather than asking that the non-existent atheistic major-party presidential candidates show up at this religious forum, why not demand that McCain and Obama appear at a forum run by atheists who would ask them atheist-informed questions? Such a forum could be moderated by Christopher Hitchens or Daniel Dennett. After all, the religious have had their shot at the candidates. Seems to me it's fair to allow the non-religious their shot as well.

Do you think either candidate would come within a state line of such a forum? Don't think so.

Do you really believe that offering non-existent atheist presidential candidates an opportunity to appear in a religious forum that would - by definition - be uniquely biased against them somehow justifies subjecting real live existing presidential candidates to a religious litmus test evens the scales?

Don't think so on that one, either.