The Oldest Prisoner of War

"God", "Yahweh", "The Ignorant Demiurge", created war. War is the inevitable and inescapable consequence of the nature of the world s/he created.

If this imagined diety is now a "prisoner of war", I say, "Good, S/he deserves it."

I only hope s/he's in Abu Ghraib, the mirror image of the world s/he created.

"Life is suffering." - The Buddha.

MO:

That wasn't God, "for so god love the world he gave up his only son for the sin of mankind?"

Jesus is the son of the being in the ball of fire, the one Moses made the deal with.

http://www.hoax-buster.org/sellyoursoul for details of Moses selling his soul.

It's worse than that. The "Apostles Creed" the OFFICIAL statement of what Christians believe says that Jesus "descended into hell" upon his death on the cross. Just before He died He said to the **good thief, "this day you will be with me in paradise." Thus paradise must be hell.

All fits together in a nice neat package. Hell is paradise, the domain of Devil, the being in the ball of fire that was the type of fire in hell, the fire that burns but does not consume.

There's just one conclusion. Those who follow Moses, the ministry have also sold their souls to Devil. Devil is so clever His fee for their souls are paid by the suckers following them to hell with their tax deductible "money on the plate." Therefore you are actually paying Devil's fee to the ministry, folks like Pat Robertson, Robert Schuller, Ted Haggard, etc. because your taxes are higher as a result of their suckers getting tax breaks.

Laugh at it. It hurts too much to cry.

I have lost the lord
and found the light
and I'm here to tell you
that it feels alright.
Lost the lord found the light
just gotta tell ya that
I feel alright.

I have lost the lord
and freed my brain
and I wanna tell
I don't feel no pain
Lost the lord freed my brain
just gotta tell you
I don't feel no pain.

I have lost the lord
and found what's true
and I gotta tell you
that you could too
Lose the lord find what's true
just wanna tell ya

that you could too.

ASIM:

Do you actually expect any contributor to this board to lay down the truth about the middle east? They learned from CNN/FOX/ABC/..etc the art of news making. DOn't expect anyone to say anything that reflects history or the suffering of oppressed people around the globe. Not even a previous US president (Carter) was allowed to do it! He hardly opened his mouth, only to muffed up by his own countrymen! Poor America, what have you done to your own good people!?

Samuel:

Looks like you are talking about south america not the middle east! You need to come up with genuine thoughts when you express your input. You just can't copy the media into this board! I guess you got so obsessed with the statement that "God is a prisoner of war" and thought that this alone justifies your writing!!! I think you are a prisoner of your own lack of knowledge of the middle east! You either say something useful or say nothing at all!

The conflict in Palestine is not religious-I repeat is not religious:it is about jews invading Palestine,ethnically cleansing its indgigenous population-the Palestinians-and locking them up in a big concentration camp,the west bank and Gaza-under an apartheid racist jewish regime.

Religion is an after thought, an isreali justification to avoid peace.

Once the jews return Palestine to its rightful owners and go back to where they come from,then peace will prevail.

Qassam rockets!!! you mean the HAMAS fire crakers? the problem is the israeli nuclear arsenal with hundreds of nuclear warheads that are scarring all nations in the region to acquire nuclear weapons to protect themselves from israel nuclear arsenal.

Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on

Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals

in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.

A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to

Australia and her Queen at a special meeting with Prime Minister John

Howard, he and his Ministers made it clear that extremists would face

a crackdown. Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to

Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the

country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state, and

its laws were made by parliament. "If those are not your values, if

you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then

Australia is not for you", he said on National Television. "I'd be

saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing

people in Australia: one the Australian law and another Islamic law

that is false. If you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent

courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the

opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps,

then, that's a better option", Costello said.

Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he

said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to

the other country. Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told

reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should

"clear off". Basically people who don't want to be Australians, and

who don't want, to live by Australian values and understand them, well

then, they can basically clear off", he said.

Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by

saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques.

Quote: "IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave it.

I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some

individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we

have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of

Australians."

"However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the

'politically correct' crowd began complaining about the possibility

that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against

immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a

better life by coming to Australia." "However, there are a few things

that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some

born here, need to understand." "This idea of Australia being a

multi-cultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and

our national identity. And, as Australians, we have our own culture,

our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle." "This

culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials

and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom"

"We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese,

Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to

become part of our society. Learn the language!" "Most Australians

believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political

push, but a fact, because Christian men and women, on Christian

principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is

certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If

God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world

as your new home, because God is part of our culture."

"We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is

that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with

us."

"If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like "A Fair Go",

then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this

planet. We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change,

and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By

all means, keep your culture, but do not force it on others. "This is

OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will

allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done

complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our

Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take

advantage of one other great Australian freedom, 'THE RIGHT TO

LEAVE'." "If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to

come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted."

Maybe if we circulate this amongst ourselves, Canadian and American

citizens will find the backbone to start speaking and voicing

the same truths !

Dear Samuel Rodriguez:

Correct, religion and politics are intertwined in all three great faiths. Goes back to the struggle for political control of heaven when Lucifer declared himself to be God and attempted to throw God.

http://www.hoax-buster.org for the uneducated who don't know the story of Lucifer and the fallen angels. And, it raises a big question. Did Lucifer win? The evidence says the three great faiths all say Lucifer is God. All three worship the supernatural being that lives in the fire of hell, the one Moses made the deal with.

The real question of course is how do we separate religion and politics locally, not become like them. I'm sure your organization never suggests how members should vote like all Christian faiths. The Mideast is just like we have recently become. Don't you think?

In Europe and U.S., Nonbelievers Are Increasingly Vocal

By Mary Jordan
Washington Post Foreign Service
Saturday, September 15, 2007; Page A01

BURGESS HILL, England -- Every morning on his walk to work, high school teacher Graham Wright recited a favorite Anglican prayer and asked God for strength in the day ahead. Then two years ago, he just stopped.

Wright, 59, said he was overwhelmed by a feeling that religion had become a negative influence in his life and the world. Although he once considered becoming an Anglican vicar, he suddenly found that religion represented nothing he believed in, from Muslim extremists blowing themselves up in God's name to Christians condemning gays, contraception and stem cell research.

"I stopped praying because I lost my faith," said Wright, 59, a thoughtful man with graying hair and clear blue eyes. "Now I truly loathe any sight or sound of religion. I blush at what I used to believe."

Wright is now an avowed atheist and part of a growing number of vocal nonbelievers in Europe and the United States. On both sides of the Atlantic, membership in once-quiet groups of nonbelievers is rising, and books attempting to debunk religion have been surprise bestsellers, including "The God Delusion," by Oxford University professor Richard Dawkins.

New groups of nonbelievers are sprouting on college campuses, anti-religious blogs are expanding across the Internet, and in general, more people are publicly saying they have no religious faith.

More than three out of four people in the world consider themselves religious, and those with no faith are a distinct minority. But especially in richer nations, and nowhere more than in Europe, growing numbers of people are actively saying they don't believe there is a heaven or a hell or anything other than this life.

Many analysts trace the rise of what some are calling the "nonreligious movement" to the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. The sight of religious fanatics killing 3,000 people caused many to begin questioning -- and rejecting -- all religion.

"This is overwhelmingly the topic of the moment," said Terry Sanderson, president of the National Secular Society of Britain. "Religion in this country was very quiet until September 11, and now it is at the center of everything."

Since the 2001 attacks, a string of religiously inspired bomb and murder plots has shaken Europe. Muslim radicals killed 52 people on the London public transit system in 2005 and 191 on Madrid trains in 2004. People apparently aiming for a reward in heaven were arrested in Britain last year for trying to blow up transatlantic jetliners. And earlier this month in Germany, authorities arrested converts to Islam on charges that they planned to blow up American facilities there.

Many Europeans are angry at demands to use taxpayer money to accommodate Islam, Europe's fastest-growing religion, which now has as many as 20 million followers on the continent. Along with calls for prayer rooms in police stations, foot baths in public places and funding for Islamic schools and mosques, expensive legal battles have broken out over the niqab, the Muslim veil that covers all but the eyes, which some devout women seek to wear in classrooms and court.

Christian fundamentalist groups who want to halt certain science research, reverse abortion and gay rights and teach creationism rather than evolution in schools are also angering people, according to Sanderson and others.

"There is a feeling that religion is being forced on an unwilling public, and now people are beginning to speak out against what they see as rising Islamic and Christian militancy," Sanderson said.

Though the number of nonbelievers speaking their minds is rising, academics say it's impossible to calculate how many people silently share that view. Many people who do not consider themselves religious or belong to any faith group often believe, even if vaguely, in a supreme being or an afterlife. Others are not sure what they believe.

The term atheist can imply aggressiveness in disbelief; many who don't believe in God prefer to call themselves humanists, secularists, freethinkers, rationalists or, a more recently coined term, brights.

"Where religion is weak, people don't feel a need to organize against it," said Phil Zuckerman, an American academic who has written extensively about atheism around the globe.

He and others said secular groups are also gaining strength in countries where religious influence over society looms large, including India, Israel and Turkey. "Any time we see an outspoken movement against religion, it tells us that religion has power there," Zuckerman said.

One group of nonbelievers in particular is attracting attention in Europe: the Council of Ex-Muslims. Founded earlier this year in Germany, the group now has a few hundred members and an expanding number of chapters across the continent. "You can't tell us religion is peaceful -- look around at the misery it is causing," said Maryam Namazie, leader of the group's British chapter.

She and other leaders of the council held a news conference in The Hague to launch the Dutch chapter on Sept. 11, the sixth anniversary of the terrorist attacks in the United States. "We are all atheists and nonbelievers, and our goal is not to eradicate Islam from the face of the earth," but to make it a private matter that is not imposed on others, she said.

The majority of nonbelievers say they are speaking out only because of religious fanatics. But some atheists are also extreme, urging people, for example, to blot out the words "In God We Trust" from every dollar bill they carry.

Gaining political clout and access to television and radio airtime is the goal of many of these groups. With a higher profile, they say, they could, for instance, lobby for all religious rooms in public hospitals to be closed, as a response to Muslims demanding prayer rooms because Christians have chapels.

Associations of nonbelievers are also moving to address the growing demand in Britain, Spain, Italy and other European countries for nonreligious weddings, funerals and celebrations for new babies. They are helping arrange ceremonies that steer clear of talk of God, heaven and miracles and celebrate, as they say, "this one life we know."

The British Humanist Association, which urges people who think "the government pays too much attention to religious groups" to join them, has seen its membership double in two years to 6,500.

A humanist group in the British Parliament that looks out for the rights of the nonreligious now has about 120 members, up from about 25 a year ago.

Doreen Massey, a Labor Party member of the House of Lords who belongs to that group, said most British people don't want legislators to make public policy decisions on issues such as abortion and other health matters based on their religious affiliation.

But the church has disproportionate power and influence in Parliament, she said. Forexample, she said, polls show that 80 percent of Britons want the terminally ill who are in pain to have the right to a medically assisted death, yet such proposals have been effectively killed by a handful of powerful bishops.

"We can't accept that religious faiths have a monopoly on ethics, morality and spirituality," Massey said. Now, she added, humanist and secularist groups are becoming "more confident and more powerful" and recognize that they represent the wishes of huge numbers of people.
While the faithful have traditionally met like-minded people at the local church, mosque or synagogue, it has long been difficult for those without religion to find each other. The expansion of the Internet has made it a vital way for nonbelievers to connect.

In retirement centers, restaurants, homes and public lectures and debates, nonbelievers are convening to talk about how to push back what they see as increasingly intrusive religion.

"Born Again Atheist," "Happy Heathen" and other anti-religious T-shirts and bumper stickers are increasingly seen on the streets. Groups such as the Skeptics in the Pub in London, which recently met to discuss this topic, "God: The Failed Hypothesis," are now finding that they need bigger rooms to accommodate those who find them online.

Wright, the teacher who recently declared himself a nonbeliever, is one of thousands of people who have joined dues-paying secular and humanist groups in Europe this year.

Sitting in his living room on a quiet cul-de-sac in this English town of 30,000, Wright said he now goes online every day to keep up with the latest atheist news.

"One has to step up and stem the rise of religious influence," said Wright, who is thinking of becoming a celebrant at humanist funerals. He said he recently went to the church funeral of his brother-in-law and couldn't bear the "vacuous prayers of the vicar," who, Wright said, "looked bored and couldn't wait to leave."

Now, instead of each morning silently reciting a favorite nighttime prayer, "Lighten our darkness, we beseech thee, O Lord, and by thy great mercy defend us from all perils and dangers . . . " (from the Anglican Book of Common Prayer), he spends the time just thinking about the day ahead.

He said his deceased mother, a Catholic, was comforted by her faith: "It kept her going through difficult times," particularly when his father left her when he and his sister were young.

"I really don't know how I will react if something really bad happens," he said. "But there is no going back. There is nothing to go back to."

Not believing in an afterlife, he said, "makes you think you have to make the most of this life. It's the now that matters. It also makes you feel a greater urgency of things that matter," such as halting global warming, and not just dismissing it as being "all in God's plan."

He called himself heartened that the National Secular Society, which he recently joined, is planning to open chapters at a dozen universities this fall. The rising presence of the nonreligious movement, he said, is "fantastic."

"It's a bit of opposition, isn't it?" he said. "Why should these religious groups hold so much sway?

Canyon:

Dude, seriously, you're my boy and all, but is there really a need to preach all the time?

You're losing your fire man.

Like I have said before, I may disagree with you, but it doesn't mean we can't have a beer and go to the titty bar together.

Just try coming at it from a different angle.

mad love and mad reason.
for so god love the world he gave up his only son for the sin of mankind??????????????it canot be more crazier than this!!!!!the reality is, mankind still sining right and left day and night and will continue to sin till the last day,and the all mercifull creator god will continue forgiving till the last day and till the last breath of the last mankind,that,s why he is the mercifull.no body died for no body,s sin.
on the other side, those who among mankind who they suffer from mad reason who they reject the creator god ,took uppon themselfs to be the god of the world they theoryiez and legalize and jurisprudenceize for mankind???.
the above TWO craze are not only the world mass think tankers but also the world mass upper hands who they are the decision makers in the world??? no wonder things go wrong no wonder mankind live the status quo of mass delusion and mass paranoia and mass confusion .
when adam and eve dropped on this planet earth they were not dropped to be on their own to figuer it out how to live this life and how to integreate ,rather the creator god sent them and their off springs his word and guidance .where is the true word of the creator god ? what is the question of this life?what is the answer to mankind conflict?.mankind in his right mind usualy stick to the word of his creator god,mankind every where need to sing the song of the songs and the world mass anthem -all praise goes to the creator god-who created mankind and the rest of the universe from none.

Canyon Shearer:

You want to blame this mess on secular humanists?
You think the answer infuse the Middle East with yet another religious sect? Unbelievable.

The Middle East is prophecy fulfilled.

"And [Ishmael] will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren." - Genesis 16:12

"For though your people Israel be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant of them will be saved. Destruction is decreed, overflowing with righteousness." - Isaiah 10:22

"If they persecuted [Jesus], they will also persecute [Christians]." - John 15:20

The Middle East serves an important lesson for us, that we are completely incapable of governing ourselves or surviving without God. The heart is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things, who can know it?

The humanist wants to believe we can create utopia on earth, remove suffering and poverty and depression and war. They failed miserably in Spain, they failed miserably in Germany, they failed miserably in Russia, they failed miserably in China, they failed miserably in North Korea, and they failed miserably in the United States. They will fail miserably in Israel and Egypt and Iraq and everywhere.

While sin still abounds, while men still reject God and seek after their own lusts of power and wealth, this world will be broken and despicable and show us just how much we need God.

The humanist will say, we are trying to fix it, we don't need God; I am part of the solution, not part of the problem.

The humanist says this because they have no understanding of the sinfulness of sin. Are you a part of the problem, or part of the solution?

Have you ever told a lie? Each lie you have told contributes to suffering and deceit and death. Lies and liars will not be allowed into Heaven, God considers lying lips an abomination. (Do not confuse lies for discretion)

Have you ever stolen anything? Coveting something to the point that you have to have it at any means proves the deceit of the human heart. (Do not confuse necessity for lust)

Have you ever used God's name in vain? Blasphemy is using the name of the God that gave you life, that is patient in your transgressions, in place of a cuss word. You wouldn't appreciate it if your mother's name were used to express disgust, imagine how much more offensive it is to God.

Have you ever murdered anyone? In the Middle East this is a major concern, where Israeli's and Ishmaelite's are trained to kill each other and their enemies children, and keep count of the confirmed kills (confirmed means it was witnessed by at least two other soldiers), most have dozens, if not hundreds of kills. If a single sparrow cannot fall to the ground without God's notice, how much more injurious is it when an image of the Living God falls. But God is also concerned with the intentions of the heart, He considers hatred as sinful as murder, the lust for blood as damning as killing in cold blood. If you insult someone in malice and hatred, you are in danger of the judgment.

The price to enter Heaven is not to kill the infidels, it is not to defend your homeland, it is not to convert the masses, nor even heal the world of its ills.

In the courtroom your good deeds are an insult to the judge. Consider how ridiculous it would be to tell a judge, "Judge, I admit to murder, to theft, to perjury, but I've done many good things, and I feel they outweigh the bad." The judge is going to hold you in contempt; you have insulted his honor and attempted to bribe your way out of justice. The truth is, your good deeds have no bearing on your transgressions. Justice is due.

All three of the Abrahamic religions in the Middle East recognize this justice as the eternal fire of Hell. A transgression against an infinite God requires an infinite retribution. As you pay your fine in the eternity of Hell, you will never appease God, the gravity of lawlessness is something we cannot fully comprehend. Our sin has led to the murder and suffering of multiple billions of people, God is angry with sin and He has promised a day in which His wrath will be poured out upon your head.

But there is good news, not that we loved God, but that He loved us, He sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to live a perfect sinless life and die on the cross in Jerusalem as the propitiation for our sins. We broke the law, we hated God, we murdered in God's name, and cursed God while we were doing it, but Jesus paid our fine.

God commands all men everywhere to repent, to cease the senseless killing and hatred, and lust, and larceny; He commands that you seek after righteousness and ask for forgiveness for your crimes against Him and against humanity. Flee to God in sorrow for your transgressions, and He will forgive you, not because He will simply forget your sins, but because they have been paid in full on the cross by Jesus Christ. Justice was served upon God's Son, and you can be forgiven, not because you have done anything to deserve it, or because you are a good person, but because you are a bad person forgiven by a good God.

When you have done this, the deceit and damnation of the world will grieve you and make you hate sin all the more; at the second coming of Christ, when all the tears are wiped away, His gloriousness and goodness will shine all the brighter, and we will know just why He is God, and we are not.