Role Models for Religious Minorities

la verdad es que, desde el punto de vista de un mormon que regresa al Islam, el Mormonismo no es mas que una copia,un billete falso.silo desean, visiten www.islamenlinea.tk para mas informacion.

heres a heavy duty one-

http://www.khazaria.com/genetics/abstracts-jews.html

or
http://www.jewishaz.com/jewishnews/000519/study.shtml

whatan easily answered question-
i guess no one here is going to call into question the science of genetics?

arabs and jews are genetically 'cousins'.
which is an interesting term as since the desendants come from the lineage of 2 brothers, isaac and ishmael- whose grandfather is abraham-
they literally are cousins.
and thats the abrahamic connection too.

ok? clear on that?

if necessary ill post links all day if somehow someone somewhere isnt happy with this one

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/742430.stm

SULEYMAN - like all islamics you dont have the balls to defend your absurd statements.

Prof. Nyang:

Excellent article. Thank you.

Mr Nyang is right, we need to work harder to understand. Lets read the writings of Imam al-Ghazzali when they are published in English.

Mormons teach and practice religious and cultural tolerance. I am a Mormon and I have never heard anything negative spoken in our church about any other religion or group of people.

TAKE NOTE: Personally, we all need to stop bickering about who has the better or right religion and face the facts that we are being manipulated by world powers, through fear, into greater and more destructive wars. Why? For this New World Order.

Anonymous,

Jesus said to love thine enemies, bless them that curse you, pray for them who despitefully use you and persecute you! Even if Muslims are truly as you say (which I am not buying) Christ teaches one to proceed much differently than you propose. The enemy is the devil who would have us return railing for railing instead of turn the other cheek.

loni - dont fool yourself, you have nothing in common with islam, NOTHING!
they will pretend you do, but when you get to the basis of faith, you are in complete opposite corners of reality.
islamics believe that anyone who says that a man born of woman is god - is such a sinner that they are subject to a death sentence. that means all christians will either have to reject jesus or die.
additionally, an islamics view of world peace is limited to when the world is islamic.
the mormans do a lot of good works, islam teaches its children to murder jews and get 72 virgins.
dont be fooled, islam will only pretend to be your friends. yes they will say they think jewsu was a prophet and talk about people of the book, but there was a large jewish community in mecca when moho was alive - where are they now? why can islamics live in israel but jews cannot live unmolested in islamic countries?
know the enemy - they are islamic.

Thank you Mr.Nyang for your article. I found it to be very balanced and insightful. Unfortunately comments like Mr. Swartz remind us of how misunderstood we "Mormons" are. I would hope that anyone wanting to learn the accurate doctrine of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints would turn to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Likewise if we want to learn of another faith we should go to the source and not seek out an excommunicated member or a scholar of another faith. Mr. Swartz does make one viable point, we are encouraged to donate one tenth of our income as tithing. A principal that has blessed my life on many levels. What he didn't mention is that we also participate in fasting once a month and donate the money to the needy and we are invited to donate to a perpetual education fund to help those who need help getting an education. We can also donate time to serve in a local cannery or farm to help provide for those in need. We are invited to donate and assemble hygene kits, school bags, infant care kits, etc. to provide aid to those in need where ever they might live. I for one am grateful for these opportunities and feel that through serving our fellowman we truely learn to love as the Savior taught.

"This is one of the most difficult points that puzzled the Muslims as well as the other groups that now call themselves Abrahamic. Although Islam came after Christianity and Judaism, Muslim narrative about Islam does not have anything that parallels the American teachings of the Mormons."
ABRAMAMIC? who says? you are trying to lie yourselves into the established jewish blood line again by pretending to be the sons of abraham, via ishmael. YOU CANT PROVE IT!
moho said he was a direct decendent from ishmael but did he offer proof? abraham lived around 2500 bc. moho was born around 600 ad. so with a 3100 year gap he just decided to steal the idenity of someone else and pretend he was in the blood line.
any of you have proof? of course you dont because no one ever heard of moho or islam until about 629 ad and there is no link.

What the ...???

The Mormons are one of the most RACIST and BIGOTED religions in America and you LIKE THEM?????

Boy have they got your faked!!!!

Mormons only let blacks get their priesthood because they were being threatened with LEGAL ACTION if they didn't INTEGRATE their GOOD OLD WHITE BOYS CLUB!!!!!

The Mormons are still a bunch of OLD WHITE BOYS who only care about how much MONEY they bring in!!!

HOW MANY OTHER RELIGIONS TELL THEIR GRADUATES TO MAKE SURE THEY PAY THEIR CHURCH DONATIONS DURING THEIR GRADUATION CEREMONY?????!!!!! byu did EXACTLY that this year!!!!!!

It was a coalition of Muslim and Catholic countries (mainly Latin American states) and followed by many Asian and African states, that seek to maintain the pure defination of family - man, woman married to one another and children that ensued from this union in all the text of the outcome of the United Nations global conferences of nineties - from population and development to social development to women and development. The Vatican was very active in this too. Some wags in opposition called it the Unholy Alliance of Muslim and Catholic states.

The Scandinavian countries were pushing for gay rights and gay family units too to be recognized and included in the outcome documents of these UN held global conferences. The mainly developing countries of Asia, Africa and Latin America wanted the programmes and activities under the auspices of the UN that was agreed to be undertaken by relevant UN agencies are focussed on the majority agreed defination of family unit. Of course, the UN resolutions and outcome documents that was agreed do not subsume national laws on family units and whatever is defined as family by law in states.

It was a saddening and frustrating experience for me to have attended those global conferences as part of women's NGO delegations. It was also a very emotive and frustrating issue for minorities such as gays and, and on female headed households, the latter due to divorces or widowed. There is a lot of female headed households in conflict areas. In the end, how a family is defined by national laws or the text of UN global conferences have no bearing on reality.

Mr. Nyang,

I enjoyed reading your commentary very much. For the past 14 months, I have lived in Qatar-in the Middle East for those of you not familiar with world geography.

I have developed very strong feelings for the good men with whom I work and they are in all respects my equals in terms of their integrity, honesty, and work ethic as well as in their faults and failings. I expect that the friends I have gained will remain my friends for life because that is the way of the culture. In spite of differences of opinions, religious beliefs, or anything else, we recognize that we both desire the same things in life-to be happy, have sufficient money to provide for our families, and have the time to be with and enjoy our families!

Unbeknownst to most people, the family-centered Islamic culture and society can be thanked for standing fast in the face of assaults on the traditional family unit by the United Nation's and governments of countries. I know for a fact that UN resolutions, designed to weaken the family unit and/or redefine it, have been defeated due to strong opposition by Muslims in the Middle Eastern countries.

From my personal experience here, Christian's-Catholics, Mormons, Methodists, Baptists, Evangelicals, Presbyterians, and any other group that professes a belief in Jesus Christ-need to get off their high horses and stop believing that their beliefs are the ONLY ones through which any good in the world can come! Only by recognizing that fact and then making a sincere effort to understand and respect all people, regardless of religious beliefs, can world peace be achieved. Of course, world peace will not eliminate human suffering! That will only happen when all people decide to "practice what they preach", which means everyone must decide to care for and respect others as much as they do themselves; AND THAT IS WHAT CHRISTIANS AND MUSLIMS BOTH PROFESS TO BELIEVE!

that is your problem - islam does not respect other religions, it demands that you convert of die. nice try but the world of islam does not accept other religions.

Let's find a common ground. We all believe that there's only one Living God and we are all His children. We all came from the spirit world before we were born into mortal life. Let us respect each other no matter what religion we belong. God will answer prayers of sincere and honest hearts. Remember we are all equal in the sight of God.

Paul said:

I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel[the real Gospel of Jesus Christ]-- not that there is another one[o really, what was the great commission by Jesus all about then], but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ[Saul means his 'gospel']. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel[Jesus' Gospel] contrary to the one[Saul's gospel] we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone[specifically the Judaisers, the real aposotles of Jesus] is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed (Galatians 1:6-9).

Mr. Nyang,

An extremely well written article. And no attacks.
I liked how you focused on the problems, and then finished with the solutions. I think that is what its all about, progress. Not perfection. The ability to look inward and to see where change is needed, then to implement that change.

Sulayman S. Nyang

Thanks for your blog.

Being thrust into the forefront of an interfaith dialogue sometimes makes cultural progress seem more real than it is. I think you allude to that several times.

The LDS church has a lot going for it. Some of it is the tenacity of its ancestral founders. None of my forebears seem to have been amongst them, and I was confronted when it was first pointed out to me that the pioneer history of the church was also my history. I came to see that was true when I turned to their writings for solace in my own journeying in the wilderness.

Whilst the church is made up of a membership of contemporary people, many attitudes of the past are kept alive by references to the past in LDS literature, teachings and folklore.

That can be arresting to the naive. I recall myself wondering why the LDS church was so different in the "centre stakes" than in Australia where I lived free of a lot of the folklore. There were many answers. Some had their roots in financial strength, others in ecclestaistical leadership experience, and others in the depth of my personal spiritual experience.

I don't think you're looking for interactive dialogue of a deep and integrating nature between the LDS church and Islam. Respective religious culture will ensure that won't happen.

But if you're looking for a working dialogue that breaks down barriers to acceptance (beyond tolerance but not-yet-embracing) in both directions, that may come in this generation in some locations.

The LDS and Islamic needs to protect their doctrines will always stand in the way of a formal embrace, and deeply rooted "homeland cultures" will keep the people at a comfortable distance until some LDS and Islamic folklore gives way to reasonable perspectives. That takes large chunks of peoples lifetimes to realise - or cataclysmic events that radicalise the otherwise slow evolution of attitudes. I hope for a speedy version of evolution.

I expect that LDS people and Muslims will be equal to the task, and that it won't take another term in the wilderness for each to teach them that preserving their doctrines need not be a barrier to accepting each other as brothers and sisters and working together to build a happier world.

From the LDS perspective, I can't see how we can expect to meaningfully lead if we can't induce at least some of the Muslim, Chinese, Hindu, other Christian, and generally agnostic rest-of-the-world to follow. Brow beating won't cut it and imperialsism and colonialism always fail. Open dialogue and shared spiritual edxperience are the only way forward.

Is it really so hard for a Muslim to believe that God hears and answers the prayers of Mormons, or for Mormons to believe that God hears and answers the heartfelt prayers of non-Mormons? Hope not.

Acceptance by both groups that they each share in God's love and that they may have something to offer each other as a people is a good starting point. And praying for each other's wellbeing may be the next step. Talking and listening together without suspicion and resentment will come easier then. Becoming unified in love and caring can't be too far away if we can get this far, and becoming a close-knit multi-religion community shouldn't be many years over the horizon.

Ever the optimist, let's keep going on this, I say.

This is an excellent opinion piece. Mr. Nyang, and it goes a long way to show how accommodating, tolerant and most importantly, resilient, both Muslims and Mormons are.

All those mormons that I have encountered have been very understanding of the suffering and the aspirations of Muslims. Religious affiliation (or non-affiliation, to reassure Professor Daniel Dennett and The Brights) should not be a consideration in holding office; but surely one's moral stance and sense of spirituality should have an appropriate weight in considering the overall worth of a candidate to office.

It is easy to be hedonistic and claim rationality for unrestrained ambition and even medacity; it demands far more discipline to be moral and have a sound spiritual orientation.

Thank you for an excellent article, Mr Nyang.

It seems silly to debate wether the Koran or the Book of Mormon accurately evidence a true lineage through Christianity back to Abrahamic roots. The author of this article seems to illude to the fact that Islams story is a better one. While I will grant that it some aspects it seems more plausible in others it is wildy less plausible. It seems that these matters with regards to Latter Day Saints and Muslims will always remain a matter of faith.

In the times of both Muhammad and Joseph Smith there was no scientific way to evindence genetic lineages to the people of Isreal. Today modern genetic mapping technology is beginning to change this. It will be interesting to see how this effects the creation of new Abrahamic based religions such as Matrixism, etc. In time when the genetic information from enough Jews is compiled we will be able to tell with some mathematical accuracy and precision who really comes from the lineage in question.

Very interesting post, Mr. Nyang, thank you.

Everyone in the world, be they Catholic, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Zorastrian, Jain, Wiccan, Baptist etc. would do well to try and learn about and understand the faiths of others. The Mormon experience of surviving oppression and clinging to cherished beliefs (and even thriving in the US and abroad) is inspirational, and is made more so by learning about their interesting, beautiful faith.
Sadly some of the comments here showcase hatred and total ignorace(especially of Islam) of the sort Americans should now hang our heads in shame over. Catholics, Jews, and of course Mormons were forced to endure terrible bigotry and prejudice in this country, based on total ignorance which breeds fear and hatred. Hating Islam and Muslims is equally absurd and harmful, especially since the haters evince such COMPLETE ignorance. Seriously, learn , read, think. Talk to Muslims, Mormons and people of all faiths.
Then we won't have to keep repeating the history of abuse of religious minorities and subsequent shame/guilt.

Petros,
I realize that this is totally off the topic of Islam, but let me help you understand the "Morman" gospel.
Just as the Christians of Paul's time began believing incorrect doctrines, we see many widely varying beliefs throughout Christianity today. The Bible makes it clear that God wants his followers to be united in one faith (Ephesians 4:5, John 17:21). Through Paul and other apostles, God gave those ancient members the truth in order to bless and unite them.
Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day saints believe that the true Gospel was restored through modern-day prophets. The gospel preached by missionaries and apostles of the restored Church is indeed the same Gospel taught by Jesus and the apostles of his time. If you listen to them with an open heart, you will find that the fulness of the Gospel has been restored.
Anyone who so desires can find the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

The Morman Message is a false Gospel. All so-called teachers and scholars who approve of the Morman Gospel do not know Jesus and are false teachers. The apostle Paul had the following to say about those who preach a false Gospel.

No Other Gospel

I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel-- not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed (Galatians 1:6-9).

akbar ahmed's article is gone but he is not forgotten. here is one of his statements from another link
http://www.akbarahmed.org/id67.html
"We know that for the first time in history, due to a unique geopolitical conjunction of factors, Islam is in confrontation with all of the major world religions: Judaism in the Middle East, Christianity in the Balkans, Chechnya, Nigeria, Sudan, the Philippines and Indonesia; Hinduism in South Asia, and, Buddhism—after the Taliban blew up their statues—in Bamiyan. And, Islam is on a collision course in the western province of China, where culture represents an amalgam of the philosophy of Confucius, Tao, and Communist ideology."
its just a coincidence that islam is at war with every religion in the world and in every corner of the world. it has not one thing to do with the fact that islam and the koran demand hate and murder to be a good islamic.
earth to islamics - enough bs - we see who you are and you cant lie to us anymore.

what happened to the islamic links like akbar ahmed - he had a long article about islams problem is that america thought islam was violent and moho being a child molester for having sex with a 9 year old. now the thing is gone. can these people just pull their articles when everyone says they are full of crap.
just wondering.
i could do a better job of defending islam than some of these people do who are supposed to be islamic and experts.
but his link had one heck of a lot of comments - mostly telling him he was nuts. but now they are gone. anyone know why? even the bug eye goonie - she is not posting much now either.

john k - where is your proof that moho came from ishmael, something within 500 years of ishmael?
and since jews existed in 2500 bc and islam did not exist until 629 ad when moho invested it, that would mean, althoghter class - the jews were there first.
but you need some facts - so here are some acts that islam committed and after 400 years of being attacked christians started the crusades.
The first Crusade began in 1095… 460 years after the first Christian city was overrun by Muslim armies, 457 years after Jerusalem was conquered by Muslim armies, 453 years after Egypt was taken by Muslim armies, 443 after Muslims first plundered Italy, 427 years after Muslim armies first laid siege to the Christian capital of Constantinople, 380 years after Spain was conquered by Muslim armies, 363 years after France was first attacked by Muslim armies, 249 years after Rome itself was sacked by a Muslim army, and only after centuries of church burnings, killings, enslavement and forced conversions of Christians.
notice that part about islam attacking cities and countries and it mentions jerusalem being attacked.
the jews kept an ongoing history and they can be traced back to before their captivity in egypt. they can be traced to babalon and david and solomon are well known figures in history and can be documented by independant sources.
other than moho saying he was in a direct line from abraham, where is the proof?

The works of Al-Ghazali are being translated into english for the first time by Daniel Peterson (ho appears in the PBS program "The Mormons") and his fellow scholars at the Neal Maxwell Institute at Brigham Young University. One of the scholarly journals published at BYU featured in its last issue an address by a Muslim scholar to the BYU student body, and its cover bears a beautiful design in Arabic translating the "Psalm of Nephi" from the Book of Mormon.

Mormon scholars over the last 50 years who have looked for the cultural antecedents of the Book of Mormon have found many of them in the Semitic culture shared by the ancient descendants of Abraham in Israel and the Arabian Peninsula. The opening chapters of the Book of Mormon describe a years-long journey of a man named Lehi and his family, escaping from Jerusalem just before the conquest by the Babylonians, and traveling down the west coast of Arabia to an area called "Nahom"--which corresponds to an area whose name "NHM" is preserved in South Arabic engravings from the same era recently found by French archeologists on altars within a 600 BC temple. Traveling eastward from that point, the family finds, on the southeast coast of Arabia, an area that remarkably is watered "bountiful" with honey, flowering plants, fruit, and trees large enough to provide timber for ships. There is also iron ore nearby that can be used for tools and nails.

Modern BYU scholars have located several candidate sites along the Oman coast, unexpected oases that show green in satellite photos but that were unknown to Europeans and Americans until modern times, with the only known surface deposits of iron ore in eastern Arabia. BYU has produced a 90-minute DVD displaying the evidence confirming the Book of Mormon description of the journey from Jerusalem to the Indian Ocean.

Mormons respect Arabs because their cultures, both material and literary, have preserved so much that brings to life the words of the Bible and the Book of Mormon. Mormons understand why Muslims eschew alcohol. Mormons know what it is to fast. Mormons understand that religion can affect one's understanding of all the rest of life, and that submission to God's will--which is what "Islam" means--is also required of all who would truly be called children of Christ. Mormons understand withy Muslims the challenge of integrating an intense religious commitment into one's life in a largely secular surrounding society.

"Although the Mormons have made tremendous progress over the last one hundred and seventy- five years, and the evidence of their success is too visible to be denied,there is still residual bigotry against them. In many ways their wounds have healed, but those of their Muslim fellow citizens have just become publicly noticeable."
I see what you mean

Islam is misunderstood? Here is something pretty bizarre and an unfortunate little misunderstanding for the women of Iran.

Iranian President Under Fire for Kissing, Embracing Old Woman in Public – >From Fox News, May 2, 2007.

A kiss is just a kiss ... unless you're the president of Iran.

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, president of the ultra-conservative Islamic country that last week rounded up hundreds of women for not properly covering up, is accused of indecency for publicly embracing and kissing the hand of a former schoolteacher.

Ahmadinejad was photographed and filmed bowing to kiss the elderly woman's gloved hand and hugging her at a ceremony Tuesday ahead of Iran's teacher's day, prompting charges of indecency by the influential and hard-line Islamic newspaper Hezbollah.

"The Muslim Iranian people have no recollection of such acts contrary to Shariah law during Islamic rule [since the 1979 revolution]," Hezbollah printed on its front page. "This type of indecency progressively has grave consequences, like violating religious and sacred values."

The woman, who was not identified, wore thick black gloves, a headscarf and a long, black coat, meaning Ahmadinejad avoided any skin contact.

Critics, however, charge he violated Shariah law, which forbids a man to have physical contact with a woman with whom he is not related. Penalties vary for such an offense, ranging from stoning to death, usually depending on whether the man or woman is married. Ahmadinejad is married, and has two sons and a daughter.

This is not the first time Ahmadinejad or his administration have come under fire for his treatment of women.

Last year he proposed that women be allowed to attend soccer games, and one of his vice presidents was criticized for watching a woman dance at a ceremony in Turkey.

Two weeks ago, police began a high-profile crackdown to enforce "correct" Islamic dress codes.

In its first few days, the "bad hijab" crackdown netted several hundred young women on the streets of Tehran, with many receiving a warning and several hundred being arrested.

Policewomen dressed in black chadors bundled detainees into buses that had been stationed on street corners in advance, before carting them off to police stations.

Those women were accused of presenting an immodest appearance — allowing their hair to show beneath the obligatory headscarves, wearing short coats that failed to conceal their hips, or wearing tight, revealing jeans and heels.

"These women who appear in public like decadent models, endanger the security and dignity of young men," according to Saed Mortazavi, Tehran's public prosecutor.

Ahmadinejad has not publicly commented on the arrests.

Mr. Nyang:

Your piece highlights issues regarding tolerance that ought to be had for all persons of all religions. I do not know much about Islam, but, being a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I am certainly sensitive to bigotry and prejudice in our society. I appreciate that you adddress that issue that has affected members of both of our religions. I would hope that greater education regarding others' religions would help us to strengthen our relationship and eliminate a lot of contention.

Hi Mr. Nyang,

I join "Thankful" in commending you for your thoughtful and well-informed piece.

As a Mormon, I would also be interested in knowing what more I could learn or even do to learn from and better understand Islam and Muslims? I have several Muslim friends from school, with whom I have enjoyed discussions about our respective religions. From what my Muslim friends have explained, Islam has been greatly misunderstood.

Best regards,
Joshua

As a Mormon, I enjoyed reading your thoughtful piece.

Hi Mr. Nyang,

Thank you for your thoughtful piece -- I wonder what you think Mormons specifically could better learn from Muslims ?

Very curious on your thoughts,

Mormon

ANonymous,

Your Idea that Mohammad did not come from the lineage is a hallucination. We further know that your defense of Isreal shows your even more in denial of the assertation of Muslims that the land of PAlestine is theirs. There has never been a Majority of jews in Current day "isreal" until the establishment of the so called jewish state. your ignorance is evident.

"This is one of the most difficult points that puzzled the Muslims as well as the other groups that now call themselves Abrahamic."
now this is interresting. there is not one bit of proof that islamics or arabs came from abraham, unless you consider the rantings of moho, as proof. he claimed to be a decendent of the line from ishmael - the child of abraham and a servant. no one made this claim un the 2600 years from the time of abraham so what is this doing here?
well if you want to pretend that the land of israel is really yours you make up an assertion that you are really one of them but from a different branch of the family.