Christian Factor in 'Idol' Upset

You have the noise of American Idol "teenies" so who cares about their religion or their "songs".

Then you have the magical sounds and melodies of Susan Boyle, pure Heaven on Earth!!!

What you're really saying, David, is that you're troubled that people consider and actually act on their religious beliefs. Horror. Unfortunately, the mythical separation of church and state has morphed, in some people's minds (including yours), into a concept that religion must also be divorced from an individual's thought process and decision-making. NO WAY! We are not just free to "believe" a certain way but to act on those beliefs. Anyway, various groups identify with the various contestants -- I bet Arkansans are voting for Kris by a healthy margin, and gays are voting for Adam by at least as healthy a margin. Why can't religion -- which goes to the core on one's being -- result in some affinity toward one contestant? Why, indeed, are you even troubled by this?

Yes, it's all an evil plot by teh gayz to take over the music industry. I mean, first it's Adam Lambert, then it will be Elton John!

Oh, wait...

David, I know very little about all this as well, but I put my money on a fourth option, Excellent Marketing by the shows producers.

Another point I find compelling is the notion that Adam couldn't possibly be a Christian if he's gay.
The people who insist on this line of thinking are the ones Jesus would smack down in that parable sort of way if He were walking the earth today. It's the most telling aspect that today's "Christians" seemingly have no idea what Jesus was really all about.

fr debra5:

>...It's the most telling aspect that today's "Christians" seemingly have no idea what Jesus was really all about.

That is SO true, and I hope Adam blows the competition away!

Odd that devout Christians seem to be so devoted to this mean-spirited and nasty sort of spectacle.

Then making it overtly about religious affiliations rather than whatever talent it's 'supposed' to be about?

Well, my days of not taking the Right seriously are definitely coming to a middle.

This appears to be yet another instance of a phenomenon stemming from global warming:
TSTH: To Stupid To Happen.

Don't you think maybe, just a teeny bit, you might be reading waaaaaay too much into this? Doesn't most of life have a "religious subplot?" If you don't like that, that's fine, but then your life has a "non-religious subplot," or possibly even an "anti-religious subplot." People vote for who they like, based on a ridiculous number of silly, illogical, or even informed, reasons. That's about all there is to this. What I find troubling is that you find this troubling. I think you are looking much too hard for an issue, when there are lots of genuine issues in this world that should concern us a lot more.

I would point out too, that your proposed poll illustrates more bias in its proposed question options than its responses ever will. Maybe it has a "religious subplot" too.

Mr. Waters, you said "I don't watch American Idol...". Whenever anyone starts off a with "I don't watch..." something, I immediately know that they Tivo it and watch it after their family has gone to bed. Admit you love American Idol!

Of course, I wouldn't know. I've never watched the show.

In response to David Waters - I also find it very troubling that those who proclaim themselves "Christians" or followers of Christ would join to persecute someone because of their sexual orientation. I can see these same "righteous" people in the crowd shouting "crucify him" because Jesus never really showed a sexual interest in Women. You who rally around a belief that homosexuals are damned by God can phrase your illogic any way you want, and claim that you are just expressing your opinion, but the intentional gathering of "voting forces" to vote against Adam Lambert because he is gay is what it is: intolerance, judgement and persecution. This goes against Christ's teachings of love and nonjudgement, lest ye be judged.

I just knew one of the WaPo knuckleheads would try to stir this pot.

Could it be that Kris Allen was a better singer? I haven't watched Idol for a couple of months, but I follow Lisa DeMoraes' Idol blog. It seems the sentiment is that Adam Lambert has a habit of screeching his songs. Doesn't sound very appealing to me.

I guess if you voted for Kris you're a homophobe. If you voted for Adam you're anti-Christian.

Right?

I suspect that the underlying issue is that at its base, "American Idol" is not a talent show. It's a popularity contest that may or may not be swayed by the talents of its contestants.

The audience votes for whoever it wants to, using whatever standard they wish to apply.

I've never really watched Idol before this season, and I can honestly say I might have missed two episodes all season this year. I liked Kris becuse he's an actual music artist whereas Adam is just a fantastic singer. I can also say, I had no idea Kris was all about showing off his Christianity as others have in the past. I seriously doubt his religion has much to do with his win. Saying people voted for him because of his faith takes away from his actual talent. He's an incredible muscian and vocalist.

I would've been happy with either Kris or Adam winning. Both of them seem truly modest. But, I think Adam over the next few days is going to teach us what it means to lose graciously. Ironic, isn't it, that this lesson will sail right over the head of another Californian, who a few weeks ago was the runner-up in another national contest that was "hers to lose."

For crying out loud people! Get a life!

A writer here states that a vast majority of gays voted for Lambert, and that has got to be true. But gays have supported him because he is massively talented, not simply because he is gay. The fact of the matter is that if Adam Lambert was coming on American Idol every week and turning out the brand of performances that Kris has done, gays would not be supporting him. I can pretty much assure you that the gay vote would go to whichever talent was the greatest and most compelling, as Adam has been week after week. That is how we roll! And I can also assure you that if the gay population of American Idol voters suddenly found out that Adam was not gay, and that he had an ultra-conservative Christian background, my guess is that the gays would just keep on voting for him. Because of his talent, not his background and beliefs. The Christian vote, on the other hand, would go to a lump of clay sitting silently on the stage, as long as the voters could be assured that the lump of clay was a good Christian lump of clay with a solid Christian background and good family values.

I don't watch Idol, but I've been to many Band Battles where the Christian bands brought half their church with them and packed the house, beating out much more talented people. Sounds same same to me.

More evidence that the American population is more than ready for a cleaned up entertainment industry. We have had enough with Lindsey Lohan and her ilk.

"UPDATE: America Idol fans chose Kris Allen the Christian over Adam Lambert the Unaffiliated on Wednesday evening's finale."

ONward Christian Idol. (Sorry, I couldn't help it.)

I am so glad that another homosexual was not chosen as the American Idol. This was such an embarassment when Clay Akien was chosen.

ROB-ROY writes:
"More evidence that the American population is more than ready for a cleaned up entertainment industry. We have had enough with Lindsey Lohan and her ilk."
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What does *that* mean? Both contestants were modest, well behaved, model gentleman.

There no evidence, only speculation, that the winner of last night's contest was determined by a religious bias.....however, there was clear evidence that the Miss USA contest was determined by the anti-religious bias of a judge who clearly stated his position.

of these two examples, which is more "troubling?"

What a ridiculous bigoted article.

America is about 70% Christian. How did Adam get this far unless Christians weren't voting for him?

I am Gay and Liberal and I voted for Kris Allen and so did many of my Gay Liberal fans. I guess you are not aware that many Gay websites liked and backed Kris Allen. All you have to do is look around.

This is just another attack Christian's thread. You are aware that the majority of the previous winners and people like Daughtry, David Archuleta, Jordin Sparks, Carrie Underwood, Kelly Clarkson, Mandisa, Phil Stacey, Chris Sligh, and Brooke White are all Christians and so what.

Plus the majority of the top 10 male contestants with the exception of Anoop are devout Christians? Matt, Scott, Michael, Danny are all DEVOUT Christians, besides Kris,and that doesn't include religious Lil Rounds. Many Christians start off singing in churches like Clay Aiken every week and that is why they are perfect for the show.

Just to also let you know Adam won many Red States and Kris won many Blue states. I guess bigots are not only on the right, they are on the left.

It is about what type of music people like and many more people like soft rock over hard.

Kris and Adam are very close.

This is just another bigoted article that likes to label people.

Here is something that might surprise you bigots, but you know Katy Perry, the girl with the "Adam Lambert" emblazoned on her cape that appeared on the show. Well here is something most people don't know.

KATY PERRY WAS ONCE A CHRISTIAN GOSPEL SINGER BEFORE SHE WENT SECULAR. That is right she was well known Christian singer.

I couldn't tell you the religious affililation or sexual orientation of 90% of the musicians I listen to. I couldn't care less what deity, if any, they worship, or what orifice/organ combo they employ between the sheets.

I really wasn't aware that there was any religious issue here. I know that I believe Adam was by far the better and more diversified talent.
Adam will have more contracts at his door in the next few weeks.

One adult member of my family liked Adam because he considered him a more talented, sophisticated singer. He did not, however, vote.

A young teenage member of my family liked Kris because she thought he was cute and talented and she liked his song choices and singing style better. She voted for him 125 times.

I wonder if you substituted the word "Jewish" or "black" or "atheist" for "Christian" in your article -- would the Post even have published it, or would it have been accurately dismissed as bigotry on your part? But bigotry against Christians is just fine with the Post, it's part of their mission, even in the hypocritically named "On Faith" and "Under God" forums.

Of course evangelicals support another evangelical regardless of ability.

Its what the church has become.

I'm quite convinced Jesus is disgusted with the church of Dick Cheney, George Bush, and those who attend with and vote for them.

There is no would-be christians - only a natural reaction to their predictable immoral and self-serving behavior.

Aside from the fact that this show, which I watched once, one time to many, speaks to the worst in us, this current business is simply TSTHH: Too Stupid to Have Happened.

As for media "coverage" of the above referenced nonsense, the media, across the board, may now aspire to the level of the National Enquirer.

We have insisted on nothing from the media, and we have gotten less.

savedgirl,
Thank you for letting us know you aren't really paying attention. Clay did NOT win American Idol, he came in second to Ruben. I do believe he has sold a lot more albums than Ruben.

I second the comment by the earlier poster re music preferences, not sexual preferences. Adam can kick, no question, but many of his performances reminded me of the show Ed McMahon used to host, where predictably, nearly every singer would reach (or screech) for the highest note in their vocal quiver about 13 seconds into the performance.

Adam engaged in this theatrical vocal scaling in practically every single performance, and the in-house audience would just as predictably go "woo woo woo!" with pretty (now chemically-tanned) Ms. Abdul as head cheerleader. Frankly, it got really, really old.

Last night, Adam seemed truly in his element with Kiss, a bunch of homely-looking white guys who successfully embraced vaudeville and make-up to compensate for their 4-chord limitations. Adam seems on a parallel track, destined for Broadway, Hollywood cabarets and/or Vegas, where flaunting your sexual preference, whatever it may be, simply qualifies you as one of the crowd. I hope not, because the kid truly has the chops to do something special, but whether he ends up Simon's star or magnesium ash is up to him.

JM

I think the stereotypes about "today's Christians" are the most damaging comments circulating and the most concerning to me. I actually did not know about Kris's or Adam's religious beliefs. I personally voted for Kris -- first time voting all season -- b/c I prefer his style of music to Adam's. I think Adam is a far superior *performer*, but if I had to choose to listen to music from one of them for an entire hour, I would choose Kris. (His take on Kanye West was, IMHO, the best performance all season.) Adam is just too over-the-top for me (although he is right at home singing Queen or Aerosmith -- he should've sung Dream On, which was probably Danny's worst performance of the season). Just b/c a Christian does not vote for Adam does not mean that s/he is prejudiced or intolerant.

Mark 2:17: "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners." (That means everyone, including you and me.)

DnMn

Why are you even troubled by this?

Because it is showing promoting a religion or religion.

"a concept that religion must also be divorced from an individual's thought process and decision-making. NO WAY! We are not just free to "believe" a certain way but to act on those beliefs."

I guess I fail to see why religist devotion should factor in when other people decide if you achieve your hopes and dreams, such as the voting process.

from the pictures in the papers, they both looked like gay christians to me.

Wow, how scientific! What solid verifiable facts do you have to back up your claims?

Meh.

First of all - it's a TV show; people are free to vote however they want, prejudices included.

Second of all - it's a TV show.

I don't think there's anything wrong with voting for someone who you can more easily identify with.

If the winner should be decided purely on talent, then the voters should be professional judges with experience and a good ear for music.

If the winner is going to be decided based on popularity by the general public, then of course one has to expect that certain biases will be a factor.

Suppose the finalists had been a woman and a man - would there be any surprise to hear that some women voted for the girl for the sole reason that she was a girl? Would there be any surprise if men voted for her because she was hot? Probably not.

It's no big deal - we're all human.

It's all Idol Worship, and this is offensive to God.

And to me, too!

Who cares about this nonsense?

Thank God the flaming homosexual didn't win. Homosexuality is a filthy, disease-ridden practice explicitly condemned by God.

Vincent Van Gogh sold only one painting during his lifetime. I'm not comparing Adam Lambert to Van Gogh, but sometimes talent goes unrecognized by a lot of people.

Nothing against Allen, but Lambert is a more talented singer.

Now for the important question- When does Susan Boyle sing again???

Geez! I thought you had to be gay or a pimply faced, overweight, teenage girl to watch American Idol. What makes people want to watch a hybrid of The Original Ted Mack Hour and The Gong Show? Has American taste really fallen this far? Next thing you know, TV viewers will be watching shows about nut cases eating bugs and horse intestines. Wait, they've already done that on Fear Factor. Does it ever get any better than this?

Lambert was a superb, class performer. Kris really brought on the fact that he was a darn good singer the final 4 competitions.
Both guys are good people, and really like one another.
For those who follow tennis, is Roger Federer and Rafa Nadal - boosters of one tend to say they praise and admire the worthy rival as a great champion of model comportment.

For fans though, Adam is definitely going to get more votes in Manhattan, Kris in Florida. Past contests did show that heavily made up rockers just don't have the fan drawing power a centrist crooner or country artist does.

I would think that as a secondary reason, you have both gays and Christians feeling the other side is out to hurt them. Unfortunately for gays, there are a lot more Christians than them....and in the public eye, radical gays are now seen as the greater aggressor..especially on gay marriage.
Trashing Mormon churches after Prop 8 and saying that black and hispanic preachers were also "ignorant". And gays using their power to blackball Kerrie Prejean and publicly threaten the careers of "homphobic bigots in Hollywood and on TV".

It likely wasn't the main reason, but to the extent the gay marriage wars between gay and religious people are being fought - savagely in the case of some like Paris Hilton...Lambert was probably hurt more than Kris.

That said, I see Adam Lambert as someone with the potential to really catch on on stage, screen, and in the rock genre. A triple threat. And as good and well-liked a person to his fans and those who know him as a person, it seems, as Kris.

Signs of the time. When gays become so powerful to win almost all battles from court cases to singing contests, maybe we should reflect on how Lot was intimidated by gays in Sodom - gay power.

There is no doubt America is following the path of Sodom. Just a few more years and it will arrive to its destiny -- destroyed by fire.

The voice of Adam is so high that it irritates my ears and yet he landed second place. He should join the Bee Gees impersonators or be a double for Bon Jovi.

if i'm not mistaken the winner gets a recording contract, yes? if this is true, then maybe his faith should be an issue. that is, if you want to here the moral decline of western civilization tune your radio to the local pop station. if, however, you prefer to listen to something that doesn't involve a "lovely lady hump", some reference to makin' "dollar bills" or strippers, well good luck. i suggest to you that making potential customers aware of ones faith should count for something. when parents, christian or otherwise, buy music for their children it might help if they knew what message they were about to share with their children without having to google search or preview an artists entire album or albums to get an idea of what that person stands for. likewise, if you don't care for christians at all and you fear that your children may be influenced by a singers belief, then you too would already possess some knowlege of the artist intent. i support christians how i can because i like christians, especially those who'll risk a potentially successful carreer to make public their beliefs.

The notion of a "Christian" vote on the Idol finale, is ludicrous. It assumes the existence of a monolithic entity. A monolith indeed when you see the hundreds of denominations and variations of "Christians" that exist in our country. The better explanation for Allen's win is the ability of thousands of tweens and teens who are experts at texting votes, while others who tried calling may have found busy signals and wound up not voting at all. Allen appealed to the Idol's demographics. The obviously very talented Lambert appealed to an older rock crowd. The young ladies voted for the guy next door who in their minds clearly does not wear make-up or eyeliner and instead of calling votes in the sent them via text messaging. Given the history of the non-winners success, second place may be a blessing for Lambert. He'll do well, and he should. The finale has never been about who is the better singer. Its about whose fans manage to get through to vote. And since the system encourages you to vote and vote often, clearly popularity was not an issue either.

I'd just like to see an American sports star or awards ceromony not thank god for winning whatever it was. Cliched and boring.

All u need do in this country is thank god and all is roses. Rubbish

As long as there have been christians, art and entertainment has been a target for them. They complained about Michaelangelo's nudes. They burned books. They created the Hays Code censoring Hollywood movies. They excoriate the multitude of gay artists. Christians have alway had a regressive impact on art, music, literature, theater and films. Since Kris Allen won AI, a christian influence must have been a factor. The talentless always support the less talented. Can't we just ship the christians to Utah and be done with them?

I did not know Kris was an out christian -- i did know danny cokey was. This show does have a demographic appeal to Southern, conservative, christian types for the same reason Miss America always held appeal to the same group. When an ex-idol has a hit song called "jesus take the wheel" you know you've scored religious nutcake gold. It's funny these conservative shows Idol and Miss America (and Dancing with the Stars) are run by left wingers, but let the christians have their way with the winners. As long as it's putting money in left wing coffers may it go on -- it is totally fluff. And really, in all seasons, when they visit the contestant's hometown -- someone like Adam appearing in San Diego is as likely to bring out people as an amateur puppet show might, while Kris can depend on almost every person in Conway Arkansas showing up -- this is their moment in the sun, the greatest show on earth.

To imply the outcome was based mostly on faith and sexual orientation is an ugly way to ease dissatisfaction with the results at the expense of the contestants and the voters. If the show’s fan base was really as hateful as some of you imagine, it is unlikely Adam would have been voted into the finale. Think about all the singers Adam beat out. Okay. Okay.

The Newsweek writer’s last point in essence was that Kris’s musical style is more appealing to general audiences than Adam’s. For whatever reason, some musical forms have a narrower appeal than others. Adam’s performances were indeed thrilling, but Kris’s delivery was less likely to jar the nerves and there is much to be said for that factor. Sometimes it really is about the ear, and the effect the music itself has on the listener.

It is common sense that Danny’s fans might vote for Kris based on the singers’ musical choices alone. As different as the three are, Danny and Kris sounded more similar than Adam did to either one of them. If the final three had been Adam, Allison and Danny and Adam was voted off, Allison probably could have won by picking up rock fans who had supported Adam. Come on, people.

It’s not so much that Christians will find anything to argue over as it is that WaPo writers now will try to recast just about any story into a gay versus Christian battle. They find the right kind of people to go along with their silliness, too. It is unfair to both the GLBT and faith communities. For one thing, some people belong to both communities, a point that too many do-gooders who belong to neither community but want to follow the fashion of the day fail to grasp. It strikes me as odd that these same do-gooders who would have you believe they are concerned about justice and equality so often busy themselves with color coding maps, fitting people into categories, and advocating for certain groups over others.

So are we or are we not a christian (voting) nation?

Wnen does Susan Boyle sing again?

Things would be made much clearer if, in columns like this, is is pointed out that the "Christian" vote on American Idol, to which is referred, that tilted the vote toward Kris, is largely that of the rightist movement today called "Evangelical," which, by the way, is an abuse of the word. Many Christians voted for Adam, though he is either homosexual or leans that way and presented himself accordingly. It is accurate to say that had he run as a "straight," he'd likely have won fairly easily. He was far and away the more talented of the two finalists and demonstrated as much on the final two shows as well as in most of the previous competitions.

As usual, OnFaith produces a torrent of anti-Christian bigotry.

If you folks are so concerned about bigotry, don't be bigots.

Regardless, 38% of the votes cast came from Arkansas, which would indicate that a stronger showing from the home state played a much greater role than the tired old tripe about those mean old Christians.

I was amazed Adam lasted as long as he did because of the Fox demographic ... which just goes to show that talent, true raw brilliant talent, can persuade over prejudice. (Just another reason Obama won?)

When it was down to three, Ryan made a comment to the effect that a million votes separated the contestants. No word of the vote tally was made on Wednesday night, I think precisely because Fox knows if Adam was beat 2-1 (a likely scenario), the mask of "America's Choice" of the Idol will be torn and the show lose its credibility.

As much as I enjoyed both "Mad World" performances ... I think Adam's only hope was to reprise "One" and use Bono's characteristic Christian themes to his benefit. That might have undercut his artistic honesty ... but only just a bit. No one has ever "played" American Idol better than Adam, and we can only hope his performance this year raises the level of the competition in years to come.

Another agenda-driven commentary.

HEY, DAVID!!! In the event that you have been living in a cave this past decade, you probably don't know that young folks (the 'American Idol' demographic) are strongly pro-gay (probably as a consequence of (a) sticking a finger in the grown-ups' eyes and (b) being products of an uber-liberal 'education' system).

So it is totally improbable that the pro-gay young folks would have voted against Adam because he appears to be gay. Gotta get with it, David, or you'll continue to be misinformed.

Come on folks, "American Idol" is a reality TV talent show. It is NOT a real talent show. Why does it have a non-American as a judge anyway?

As far as Lambert's sexual orientation is concerned, it has NEVER been publicly disclosed.

Don't confuse sexual orientation with sexual preference, they are not the same thing. One does not have a choice in regard to one's sexual orientation.

Right wing christian zealots have the worst taste in everything...no style, and no class!

Ok. Some would say that Chris got Danny's votes because of the Christian vote. I'm a christian but was pulling for Adam. I just happen to be a product of the 80's and I like his style of music more. Please don't bash christians for their beliefs. It seems so sheek to put down us christians as wackos now days. I think the real reason Chris won is becuase a larger portion of America digs his style of music over the rocker style. I doubt very seriously that American Idol is a predominately christian show. Now stop dogging us christians or I'll come pistol whip you with my gun ( which I have none) and slap you with my bible ( which I have many). Just kidding!!! Check out The GH-4 Effect. One compelling read.

Adam Lambert's looks actually fit the homophobic gay stereotype with his feminine style looks.

Real mature gays don't wear makeup. They look like other guys.

When I was growing up, it would be rare for a Christian to even be on a TV talent show. Besides, there are lots of gays and lesbians who are believers in Jesus the Christ. If Jesus said one negative word about those whom we would call gay in the 1st Century AD, the Gospel writers never mentioned it.

So when does Susan Boyle sing again??

The intolerance of the Christian church is becoming frightening. I just read where Liberty University won't allow students to have a "Democrats Club" because Democrats don't have Christian moral values.

WTF is that all about? If you are a Democrat you aren't a "real" Christian? If you are gay, you aren't a "real" Christian? If you are different in any way, you aren't a "real" Christian? Sorry, as a Christian, this is NOT the sort of church I want to be affiliated with! Jesus travelled the land picking up the poor, unwanted, crippled, untouchables, and loved them all. What the hell is happening to the Christian church????

The faith of the two contestants had NOTHING to do with it. Here's the real issue according to insiders. In the long history of Idol over the years more people in Arkansas, believe it or not, vote than any other state except California. So the guy FROM ARKANSAS gets a ton of home state votes. Hence the upset. Religion had nothing to do with it. Razorbacks just love Idol is all.

It's American Idol! Who cares?? Wow... they sing other people's songs... big deal. If some no talent hack wins a competition because he's Christian, so what?

"

Signs of the time. When gays become so powerful to win almost all battles from court cases to singing contests, maybe we should reflect on how Lot was intimidated by gays in Sodom - gay power.

There is no doubt America is following the path of Sodom. Just a few more years and it will arrive to its destiny -- destroyed by fire.

The voice of Adam is so high that it irritates my ears and yet he landed second place. He should join the Bee Gees impersonators or be a double for Bon Jovi.

Posted by: spidermean2 | May 21, 2009 7:28 PM
Report Offensive Comment "

He's back!

Adam didn't win because he's either Bi or homo-sexual, plain and simple. Boy, did you Chrisitians ever teach him a lesson he won't soon forget! Now let's crank some evangelical rock and just start hula hooping! Yeah, rock on!

Maybe that guy won because christians just love entertainment that does not require any thought.

If the most talented singer didn't win he'll do better than the guy who did in the end. Good luck to both of them. I always like to see the best person win in a fair fight...but this TV, make believe, entertainment packaged for the masses and made for profit...at the end of the day it really doesn't matter that much...there are more important things happening elsewhere.